New rules to obtain ATP.

[Twisted Mind]

I guess I missed this part of the "new ATP rules".

http://www.ainonline.com/aviation-n...ing-rule-cost-upcoming-atps-thousands-dollars

 

[wms]

There's a lot that didn't get attention because of the immediate needs to qualify current airline pilots. With the staffing issue, this may need to get worked into new-hire training if airlines are going to attract new pilots.

 

[livin'thesim]

This is going to screw up the pipeline substantially. Essentially, the only way to get the ATP for most will be their first regional job, as a part of initial training.

135 operators will have problems too, because lots of corp jets are less than 40,000 lbs, although I think there are some exceptions in the rule.

 

[COOPERVANE]

Our government in action.

They are over regulating EVERYTHING!!!

My Grandad successfully raised chickens for 35 years and now has called it quits due to over reaching, heavy handed regulations. Everybody around him is doing the same.

Enjoy the inability to compete globally.

 

[KarmaPolice]

The Colgan air crash was a direct result of lax government regulations. Those pilots should not have been there that day in those circumstances.

You might feel differently had a family member been on that flight.

These new regulations are an attempt to increase the chance those circumstances don't coincide again.

It's not perfect, but it's the best they can do. You want Lax govt regulation on air travel, go to Africa or China. I'm pretty sure you'll be able to raise as many chickens as you like there as well.

 

[Gr82Aviate]

The Colgan air crash was a direct result of lax government regulations. Those pilots should not have been there that day in those circumstances.

You might feel differently had a family member been on that flight.

These new regulations are an attempt to increase the chance those circumstances don't coincide again.

It's not perfect, but it's the best they can do. You want Lax govt regulation on air travel, go to Africa or China. I'm pretty sure you'll be able to raise as many chickens as you like there as well.

These new regulations wouldn't have made any difference, even if they had been in existence before the the Colgan crash...

 

[bailout]

This is going to screw up the pipeline substantially. Essentially, the only way to get the ATP for most will be their first regional job, as a part of initial training.

135 operators will have problems too, because lots of corp jets are less than 40,000 lbs, although I think there are some exceptions in the rule.

The way I understand it, is they have to have this done prior to getting hired at even a regional. You have to have this done before you can take the written portion, so i doubt any regional is going to add 30 hours of classroom AND 10 hours of sim time before that new hire starts the regular training.

 

[Twisted Mind]

Bailout, exactly how is this suppose to work? It is a chicken or the egg problem. I think the airlines are going to have to provide this training BEFORE they can legally hire a pilot.

I wanted to get the warning out to people that don't have the ATP written. It is good for two years. If you think you want to fly for the airlines take it before august.

 

[IBNAV8R]

The Colgan air crash was a direct result of lax government regulations. Those pilots should not have been there that day in those circumstances.

You might feel differently had a family member been on that flight.

These new regulations are an attempt to increase the chance those circumstances don't coincide again.

It's not perfect, but it's the best they can do. You want Lax govt regulation on air travel, go to Africa or China. I'm pretty sure you'll be able to raise as many chickens as you like there as well.

All the Colgan crash did was create a grandstand for blustering politicians to prove they are "doing something." The sad fact is that things that really require attention rarely get it but things that make the news do.

Anyone remember the push to have inert gas in the center fuel tanks of 747s?

True, fatigue regulation has been a long-standing concern but it would have done nothing to prevent this accident. The crew had just come back from several days off.

The hiring of 250-hour wonders into the right seat of a transport aircraft was also pretty sketchy. But, does 1,500 hours REALLY make a difference when recovering from a stall? Obviously, not in this case. Basic "pilot s^^^" would easily have saved the day.

Ironically, it was the FAA that had mandated the training requirement to maintain altitude throughout a stall recovery. Interesting how THAT little tidbit never made the news.

 

[Father Jack]

Anyone remember the push to have inert gas in the center fuel tanks of 747s?
What about it?

 

[IBNAV8R]

Anyone remember the push to have inert gas in the center fuel tanks of 747s?
What about it?

It was all the result of media hype after TWA 800. No other 747 had ever had this problem - before or since. Nor did they prove it was the cause of this particular "mishap". But, "we have to do SOMETHING."

Another example of a non-issue getting attention if publicity is sufficient.


The new rule requiring ground training and FFS time ignores the fact that both pilots of the Colgan disaster had this training. Obviously to no avail.

 

[damnflyboy]

This is a bigger deal than most will make of it. Talk about smothering the backflow...

 

[Twisted Mind]

There were more fuel tank explosions than just TWA 800. There were more problems than just Colgan 3704. Colgan was the catalyst that caused the change not the entire reason for the change. The Feds also changed fatigue rules for truck drivers on the same day as airline pilots.

Either way I want to get the word out. If you are thinking about getting an ATP do it now!

 

[Father Jack]

I like having the NGS. Why not? It's adds a bit of safety, and I don't have to pay for it.

 

[livin'thesim]

Wasn't the Colgan crash really just the result of letting a pilot with marginal skills move up the ranks?

Just like giving passing grades to failing high school students, sometimes you have to tell someone that the left seat, and in fact the flight deck might not be the right job for them.

I would say in my substantial years as a sim instructor, I have run into two or three high time captains that really should be in another line of work. They just don't have the flight deck mindset.

 

[IBNAV8R]

^^^^ EXACTLY!!!!!

More flight hours, ground instruction, sim. time or sleep will change that.

 

[Twisted Mind]

Ok the FAA has changed the training, testing, experience, and fatiuge requirements. If a pilot fails a checking event they are placed under a special observation program. You claim none of this will work. In your opinion what will work?

 

[PBRstreetgang]

Sheesh,
Fall asleep during a sim ride and.........

 

[bailout]

Bailout, exactly how is this suppose to work? It is a chicken or the egg problem. I think the airlines are going to have to provide this training BEFORE they can legally hire a pilot.

I wanted to get the warning out to people that don't have the ATP written. It is good for two years. If you think you want to fly for the airlines take it before august.

It is not at all the chicken or the egg. New pilots will have go to a course at FlightSafety or such, pay the big money for that program, get their ATP, then get hired by the regionals. FSI already has the program in place. I have seen it. They just waiting on the victims.

 

[livin'thesim]

What exactly prevents airlines from hiring a pilot with ATP mins and providing all the required training?