New Pinnacle Management team

[xjhawk]

The way I see our unions working so well with Delta and Pinnacle....All it would take would be for a secret letter of agreement with 9E union reps, Delta's Union reps, and delta. We shall call it LOA "bypass scope". It would include the voted upon pay rates by 9E for the 76 seat jets and possibly even new rates for the 100 seat type plane. I would also bet on a pay raise for current delta pilots. That way they could load up the cheap 76 flying with hundreds of planes but with no scope issues as they all would be Delta pilots.

This is a far fetched scenario as Delta does not have to do this to make a lot of money off of Pinnacle.

AS for Hats and uniforms. You at Delta might think buying uniform pieces as a good tax right off, for me its just something that takes money out of my kids mouths and my mortgage payments. There was a contract that said Pinnacle had to buy my uniform pieces and they skipped buying me a HAT, WINGS, and something to keep me warm. So screw the hats, unless I get a Delta number, then I will wear my sweater and whatever black jacket I want. AS for Hats, I will wear my black stocking cap to keep warm, my baseball cap while flying and that is it. My blue Mesaba hat will continue being my key holder at my house.

Giving us tens of thousands in pay cuts and then making us pay for our uniforms while you get tens of thousands in raises and having your uniform paid for does not give you the right to tell me to buy a bleeping hat.

 

[General Lee]

So your tellin' me there's a chance? . As I said in a different thread, everyone has a price.

There is always a chance, but that particular chance is extremely small. The best timing for that is during a mainline BK, and thanks to consolidation (less competition) and new fees (bag and ticket changes), it is even more unlikely. But, you can always hope.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[jynxyjericho]

There is always a chance, but that particular chance is extremely small. The best timing for that is during a mainline BK, and thanks to consolidation (less competition) and new fees (bag and ticket changes), it is even more unlikely. But, you can always hope.


Bye Bye---General Lee

He's doing the quote from Dumb and Dumber. It's a young man's thing, don't worry about it GL.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCKOI24k_UY

 

[RJLoser]

This is one of my worries. 50% pay hike at mainline for 120 seat scope. The plug at DL will be the plug until retirement. An analyst said mainline will grow with less pay or will shrink dramatically with staggering pay for the last pilots to be employed by mainline.

 

[i fly boxes]

Here is my anal ysis The pilot shortage is actually coming and it will arrive very quickly and very hard when it does. US air needs 150 pilots in the next 3 months. United will have to hire off the street in 2014 500-600 pilots. Spirit needs bodies for their proposed growth. Alliegent is growing. American will hire off the street by the summer and is already recallign american eagle pilots.
The us air /american merger will slow things down a bit, but in the next 7 years that combined airline will retire 700-1000 pilots a year.
The majors will be able to keep up for a little while but the regionals will not and they will suffer.
What better way for Delta to help their problem than to absorb pinnacle right into their mainline list. 2000 pilots they will not need to hire. Also, 2000 pilots that the other guys wont be able to hire (some will still leave of course)
Delta is very forward thinking and for those of you who say no way this will never happen, ask yourself this:
1. Did you predict Delta would buy Pinnacle?
2. Did you predict Delta would buy a 50 % stake in virgin atlantic?
3. Did you predict Delta would buy an oil refinery?

Im not saying it will happen or that I even want it to happen but what I am saying is that I am very impressed with the moves delta has made vs the other legacies and nothing is impossible going forward.

 

[RJLoser]

I agree but... DL is very brand conscious and selective. I think they will have issues with some of PCL's pilots. 90% Great guys there. Don't see a "merging/staple"

 

[i fly boxes]

I agree with that statement and they wouldn't want all of us. Issues can be corrected though and if they are not then they should be let go. Ask your self this though,in 5-10 years what will the quality level of a new candidate at mainline be? Will that Person be coming from college with zero time?

 

[RJLoser]

I agree. Big question...if DL comes in and straightens out PCL will PCL pilots get on board with the idea? A lot of disgruntled individuals.

 

[Airscrew]

I Agree.

 

[Oakum_Boy]

if DL comes in and straightens out PCL will PCL pilots get on board with the idea?

Breaking News: You've already been "straightened out"

 

[mesaba13]

Delta probably shouldn't want some of the guys they already have. They publish ASAP reports and if you read them, they are making the same mistakes us lowly regional pilots make. They also have plenty of backpack wearing individuals and those whose uniforms leave a lot to be desired as well.

 

[i fly boxes]

Delta probably shouldn't want some of the guys they already have. They publish ASAP reports and if you read them, they are making the same mistakes us lowly regional pilots make. They also have plenty of backpack wearing individuals and those whose uniforms leave a lot to be desired as well.

Yeah, they are called Northwest pilots!
Just kidding northwest pilots, I miss your airline.

 

[1.3XVso]

Yeah, they are called Northwest pilots!
Just kidding northwest pilots, I miss your airline.

You sound very familiar to a special little person RED ROSE. That right now is probably walking on that high cloud since he flying now a heavy 900.

 

[A-10_JetMech]

If you think Gumm at Pinnacle is a good thing you are delusional. And hiring consultants to come in. Come on! Once all the 200's are gone and all 900's in place it's probably over. They will probably sell it off or disburse the 9's to other carriers. Hope not, but you can never say never with those slimy bastards. I think Menke saw the writing on the wall and knew this was a hopeless situation. They needed a "yes man" so they put Spanjebob in there for the BK. And now in comes the wind down guy.

 

[mesaba13]

They are not hiring consultants but rather CFO and COO with Gumm being CEO. Ill take a Naval Academy graduate with an impressive resume and former senior Vice president of Human Resources at NWA then Spanjers and company any day.

Why would they need this kind of horsepower only to wind us down in the near term? They could have done that with just Gumm or Spanjers for that matter. I am not saying 9E is a career but I think most of us will have plenty of time to move on. As far as attrition killing this company, other regionals will have just as much as airlines begin hiring.

 

[Ridgeback]

Ha ha. Funny stuff. The 717s won't be operated by 9e, and the next bid will have the initial 100 717 Capts and 100 717 FOs up for bid, flown by mainline. Those 200 spots should cover the first 16 717s coming this year, and the next two years will have 36 717s each, for a total of 88 717s, all at mainline. By 2015 newhire wages will be $71 an hour on that plane, with 12 year Capt pay at $195 an hour on the 717. Not slave like wages. Good try Nostradamus.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Sounds like..


United airlines pilot contract circa 2000.

Step one, New industry leading pilot wages

Step two, Use those wages towards a means to Chapter 11

Step three, Pay crappy wages, work rules, oh and dump your pension on the PGC

This was the playbook used at Pinnacle to get our "slave wages" Oh and by the way totally orchestrated by YOUR management team. I wonder if Pinnacle was the dry run?

 

[Flyer1015]

Sounds like..


United airlines pilot contract circa 2000.

Step one, New industry leading pilot wages

Step two, Use those wages towards a means to Chapter 11

Step three, Pay crappy wages, work rules, oh and dump your pension on the PGC

This was the playbook used at Pinnacle to get our "slave wages" Oh and by the way totally orchestrated by YOUR management team. I wonder if Pinnacle was the dry run?

Lets call a spade a spade, you got a chance to vote in your concessions, all of them. You could have easily said no and then seen what Delta did next, if their bluff really was true. I still refuse to believe an airline's business model can be 100% dependant on pilot concessions being passed. In the example you gave above with legacy airlines, the difference is in their Chptr 11, they were FORCED those things upon them by a BK judge. In 9E's case, 85% voted concessions with a yes vote.

 

[flyboyike]

What better way for Delta to help their problem than to absorb pinnacle right into their mainline list. 2000 pilots they will not need to hire. Also, 2000 pilots that the other guys wont be able to hire (some will still leave of course)
Delta is very forward thinking and for those of you who say no way this will never happen, ask yourself this:
1. Did you predict Delta would buy Pinnacle?
2. Did you predict Delta would buy a 50 % stake in virgin atlantic?
3. Did you predict Delta would buy an oil refinery?

Im not saying it will happen or that I even want it to happen but what I am saying is that I am very impressed with the moves delta has made vs the other legacies and nothing is impossible going forward.

There's some sense in what you're saying, but why didn't they absorb Comair with its only just over 600 pilots?

 

[mesaba13]

I am very skeptical that Delta will absorb us but a big difference with Comair is that they could not help Delta shed 200's at this point in time. 9E was Delta's way out of 140 200's that still had leases. This apparently had some value to Delta that we can speculate about but probably will never know a dollar amount.

 

[General Lee]

Sounds like..


United airlines pilot contract circa 2000.

Step one, New industry leading pilot wages

Step two, Use those wages towards a means to Chapter 11

Step three, Pay crappy wages, work rules, oh and dump your pension on the PGC

This was the playbook used at Pinnacle to get our "slave wages" Oh and by the way totally orchestrated by YOUR management team. I wonder if Pinnacle was the dry run?

DL gets all of the 717s by 2015, all 88 of them, and I just gave the set pay rates by then. Your company went BK, don't blame us for that. DL pilot rates were set prior to your BK. Other airlines and investment companies did not come in and offer DIP financing for you to exit, so you get what you get. Remember, DL pilots already took a 47% paycut in the DL BK, and wages weren't the reason for the BK. Since those days, consolidation and new fees have helped booster legacy profits, but your company went BK on it's own, and nobody else wanted to lend you cash to get out. Now you are stuck because of that, not due to DL pilot wages set prior to your BK. Your pay cuts don't pay for DL pilot raises, the extra $2.5 billion each year from fees do. If you want DL pilot wages, throw in an app.



Bye Bye---General Lee