New NEt JEts pay rates !

[Green]

If you guys/gals have not seen the new net jet rates you might want to check this out. Top capatain will make 229k/year. Not bad at all......

http://www.ibt1108.org/new-ta.html

 

[fletch717]

wrong board

 

[Fly-n-hi]

wrong board

I think it's good to post that info on this board.

 

[K-Mart]

Good for you guys!! I bet it is not long before Flight Ops gets an increase too.

 

[FreightNazi]

wrong board

May be the wrong board, but that doesn't refute that fact that a lowly NetJets fractional pilot will make way more than a mighty Airtran pilot ever will!

 

[K-Mart]

May be the wrong board, but that doesn't refute that fact that a lowly NetJets fractional pilot will make way more than a mighty Airtran pilot ever will!

Just think of the recent poor dudes who bailed from Netjets to go to Airtranny. Hindsight is 20/20.

 

[HotelMonkey]

May be the wrong board, but that doesn't refute that fact that a lowly NetJets fractional pilot will make way more than a mighty Airtran pilot ever will!

Well this lowly NJ pilot turned down an interview twice with Airtran six years ago to take a job with NJA. Not to say it was a good or bad move. I think Airtran is a pretty cool place to be right now, just wasn't one for commuting to ATL.

 

[wndshr]

May be the wrong board, but that doesn't refute that fact that a lowly NetJets fractional pilot will make way more than a mighty Airtran pilot ever will!

hmmm...so a newhire at netjets today will make more over a lifetime than an airtran pilot? could you please provide the math?

how long will it take me to make bbj captain at netjets?
how long will it take to make captain at airtran?

how does non bbj equipment compare to airtran captain rates?

i seriously don't know...and don't have the time right now to look at airlinepilotcentral website...

anyone?

 

[SWA/FO]

Yeah, those guys can fly past age 60, right? So no movement..ie. retirements.

I like that "signing bonus" its like a forced savings account.

 

[Ty Webb]

Well, Guys, when I hired on at AirTran four years ago, I had an EJA interview lined up. Thank god I got on here, is all I have to say, because for the last four years, I would have been working longer days, more days, doing harder flying, and been gone longer each trip, for way, way less pay.

Even looking at their new pay rates, it would be at least a $35,000 pay cut for me, if I could even hold CA there.

So, as far as the AirTran comparison goes, there isn't any, as far as I can see.

 

[Green]

I posted that info on the majors board to show what pilots outside our industry are making. A bbj pilot making 230k at net jets is doing a h#ll of a lot better than any 737 captain at a major airline right now (with the possible exeption of SWA). If you look at the ta I think you will find that even a mid size biz jet captain can be in the neighborhood of 130-140k. In our current environment a raise like that is pretty incredible. I am sure management told them that the rates were way out of line considering the industry average at airlines.

I applaud the backbone of Net JEt pilots and I think airline pilots in general could learn something from them, hence my post.....

 

[fletch717]

Looking at the gross pay, I make just about the same as the bbj capt monthly in my year of service as a 717 capt. However my calculations show if you are not on the BBJ the top pay is 96,000 a year + per diem which is pretty low for an 18 year captain. By the way how many 73BBJ's does exec Jet have?

 

[On Your Six]

My throttle's bigger than your throttle!!!!!!! Hey, I am happy to hear that the NJA guys will see a big improvement - they deserve it after such harsh treatment for the last few years.

This idea that one operation is "better" than another is hogwash - we are talking apples to oranges comparisons here. Let's just be happy that some aviation outfit is seeing a boost in rates vs. the alternative.

 

[jehtplane]

Looking at the gross pay, I make just about the same as the bbj capt monthly in my year of service as a 717 capt. However my calculations show if you are not on the BBJ the top pay is 96,000 a year + per diem which is pretty low for an 18 year captain. By the way how many 73BBJ's does exec Jet have?

You are looking at the old payscale ...

 

[Stinkbug]

Looking at the gross pay, I make just about the same as the bbj capt monthly in my year of service as a 717 capt. However my calculations show if you are not on the BBJ the top pay is 96,000 a year + per diem which is pretty low for an 18 year captain. By the way how many 73BBJ's does exec Jet have?

Your "calculations"? According to the link, a captain on the lowest paying schedule in the smallest equipment will be paid 110, 250 at year 14...with cost of living adjustments each year after that. A captain in the largest non-BBJ equipment and on the normal schedule will be paid $167,138 at year 10. No calculating to it...it's in black and white. Even if you were talking about take-home pay I think you can give the Netjets guys a little more credit than that.

By the way, I flew with a guy last tour who's been flying straight-wing citations for longer than 18 years. I'll bet he'd agree that $110k is pretty decent pay for that equipment.

 

[m80drvr]

Been there done that. NJA has about 5 bbj's and they just sold one. They will be getting NO more in the near future. So lets see, approx 5 airplanes crewed at approx 6 pilots per equals 30 pilots at that payscale. Bully for them. Now for the reality, it's going to be about a 4 to 5 year upgrade and the FO wages suck. Then you upgrade into an Ultra or Beech Jet and you top out at 90 base salary at the 5 year mark with a 2.5% or cola whichever is LESS raise thereafter. Sure thats pretty good pay for those planes but get use to it you will be in that A/C for many years. Whoever posted the info about no movement in the upper ranks hit it right on the head. It's a VERY young pilot group and you do not have to retire till your AME tells you so. Getting into a bigger airplane is going to take a while.

PS cleaning Lavs and loading bags sucks, as well as having to kiss the ass of the owner or even better the Kids of the owner. I loved getting a $20.00 tip from a 15 year old. Oh yeah the average duty day on the busy fleets is about 12 hours.

That said, the new contract is quite better than their old one, and they fought hard for it.

Phew thats off my chest. Just had a netjets flashback. Time for another beer.

 

[mdf]

Having spent 10 years in the corp. world, all I can say is congrats. It is long overdue pay. It is good to see positive news.....somewhere.

 

[Fly-n-hi]

Good for the Netjets guys.

Now when our management bring up "industry standard" we can say "well look at Net Jets. They fly 10 seat airplanes for 120k+ per year"

If that comes out to $12000 per seat then my pay on a 134 seat 737 should be 1.6 million a year...not including perdiem. (Yes, I know that isn't going to happen)

This certainly helps raise the bar for the industry.

Thanks Net Jets.

 

[bizjet737]

just for the record, we are now down to 3 bbj's at njla - #5 sold a year ago, #4 sold yesterday. currently shopping for 2 30-50 seaters - but hard to find any used 7-800's.
5yr bbj capt is $167k - tha's 5 in type (about where all our guys are) not w/company.

 

[psysix]

What's the upgrade time to the BBJ?

 

[capt. megadeth]

PS cleaning Lavs and loading bags sucks, as well as having to kiss the ass of the owner or even better the Kids of the owner. I loved getting a $20.00 tip from a 15 year old. Oh yeah the average duty day on the busy fleets is about 12 hours.

.

I wouldn't mind cleaning. I would be fired in a day having to kiss a$$.....especially some 15 year olds.

 

[m80drvr]

Bizjet guy can correct me on this but I'd say with only 3 bbj's and no manditory retirement I would guess that it would be a good guess at 20 plus years to upgrade if hired today. No kidding, I was 35 when I was there and routinely flew with Captains in their mid 20's. Thousands of young guys and gals looking for 20 or "big airplane" slots.

 

[Dizel8]

If that comes out to $12000 per seat then my pay on a 134 seat 737 should be 1.6 million a year...not including perdiem.

Seems quite reasonable to me

 

[Paul R. Smith]

Good for Netjets.

I flew with an FO a week or two ago and he had an interview with NJ, and he was unsure as to wether or not he would go. For hime it came down to the open domicile thing...Anybody have any info on that? Basically it meant he could live wherever he wanted to and they would fly him to his trip start.


Either way, the pay at NJ sure beats 21.50/hr

 

[G4G5]

Gulfstream class aircraft

27.3 Class 4 Aircraft - Captain Wage Table – 7 & 7 and Reserve
Captains who fly Class 4 Aircraft shall be paid according to their years in the Class 4 Aircraft and their Schedule, pursuant to the table below. Captains with eleven or more years in Class 4 Aircraft shall receive at each contract ratification anniversary date a base wage increase of 2.5 percent or COLA, whichever is less.
CLASS 4 CAPTAIN
Years in
Program
NORMAL SCHEDULE RESERVE SCHEDULE
1 $120,000 $142,418
2 $124,500 $147,758
3 $129,169 $153,299
4 $134,013 $159,048
5 $139,038 $165,012
6 $144,252 $171,200
7 $149,661 $177,620
8 $155,274 $184,281
9 $161,096 $191,191
10 $167,138 $198,361
11+ +2.5% OR COLA WHICHEVER IS LESS
http://www.ibt1108.org/new-ta.html

 

[bizjet737]

bbj upgrade time? infinite now since we're losing planes - even before that last capt bid was almost 5yrs ago. may be some turnover in the f/o ranks with the new t/a, have to wait and see.

 

[beytzim]

Overrall, the NJA contract is pretty good.

1. Home basing beats any 121 commuting hands down.
2. Although the average duty day is 12 hours, pilots hang out in plush leather seats and watch movies on plasma TV's on many of the FBO's they go to - for half the day.
3. Company-paid crew meals that blow away any 121 crew meals.
4. Hotels are almost exclusively all Hiltons - and you pick up the hotel and airline points! (About $2-3,000 a year in points/miles)
5. You will make 100k+ as a Captain eventually. In reality more like 100-120k for the next 10-15 years.

That said, there are many problems at Netjets:
1. NJA is like United of the 90's, they are huge, incredibly inefficient, and have lost the customer service that they were so famous for.
2. As a pilot, you will NEVER know where your overnights are up until you are actually checking at the hotel! You will never know if you're overnighting in Ft. Lauderdale or Fargo. There is nothing like putting on engine covers at -10F wx when you didn't bring your gloves.
3. The fractional business model is still untested in the long term and only time will tell what happens when the business matures and the market is at capacity- an inherently tremendous flaw. It is very questionable how the Marquis program will affect aircraft sellbacks in the long term.
4. No jumpseating or ID90 or any family pass priviliges that 121 guys are so accustomed to.
5. Rotten union-management relationship to the core. Similar to American and Crandall.
6. If you have kids, be prepared to say goodbye for seven days in a row every other week.
7. The average pilot age is 45, most will fly to 62-65, so limited movement in that regard. There are probably an equal amount of guys over 60 and under 30 right now.
8. If hired right now, it will take 10 years to be a Hawker Captain, 15 years for Falcon 2000, and 20 years to become a Gulfstream Captain. You will never be a BBJ Captain, so forget about it.

I'm ex-NJA and at SWA right now and obviously prefer it here, but NJA does have a descent contract that I would recommend to someone who is ok will the aforementioned facts.

See ya.

 

[Ty Webb]

Well put, Egg Man.

How's the Corn Dog treating ya?

 

[psysicx]

I don't think Fedex or UPS has family passes either.

 

[ukipilot]

Overrall, the NJA contract is pretty good.

1. Home basing beats any 121 commuting hands down.
2. Although the average duty day is 12 hours, pilots hang out in plush leather seats and watch movies on plasma TV's on many of the FBO's they go to - for half the day.
3. Company-paid crew meals that blow away any 121 crew meals.
4. Hotels are almost exclusively all Hiltons - and you pick up the hotel and airline points! (About $2-3,000 a year in points/miles)
5. You will make 100k+ as a Captain eventually. In reality more like 100-120k for the next 10-15 years.

That said, there are many problems at Netjets:
1. NJA is like United of the 90's, they are huge, incredibly inefficient, and have lost the customer service that they were so famous for.
2. As a pilot, you will NEVER know where your overnights are up until you are actually checking at the hotel! You will never know if you're overnighting in Ft. Lauderdale or Fargo. There is nothing like putting on engine covers at -10F wx when you didn't bring your gloves.
3. The fractional business model is still untested in the long term and only time will tell what happens when the business matures and the market is at capacity- an inherently tremendous flaw. It is very questionable how the Marquis program will affect aircraft sellbacks in the long term.
4. No jumpseating or ID90 or any family pass priviliges that 121 guys are so accustomed to.
5. Rotten union-management relationship to the core. Similar to American and Crandall.
6. If you have kids, be prepared to say goodbye for seven days in a row every other week.
7. The average pilot age is 45, most will fly to 62-65, so limited movement in that regard. There are probably an equal amount of guys over 60 and under 30 right now.
8. If hired right now, it will take 10 years to be a Hawker Captain, 15 years for Falcon 2000, and 20 years to become a Gulfstream Captain. You will never be a BBJ Captain, so forget about it.

I'm ex-NJA and at SWA right now and obviously prefer it here, but NJA does have a descent contract that I would recommend to someone who is ok will the aforementioned facts.

See ya.

Problems?
I would have to move number 2 to the top list, that is what makes this job more exciting than the airlines, at least I won't have to see PHX or LAS or Etc.... every other leg

#4 - Yea you are right that we get no ID90 or pass priviliges, but how often do you use those? That is where Airline miles come into play, and those tickets purchased with miles have a higher priority than passes or ID90's, and I can use my miles to buy a ticket for anyone, you can't do that with passes or ID90's, and for us that travel on the same airline, end up building thousands on one airline

#6 - yea you may be gone for 7 days, but as you recall, your first day was your travel day and your last day was a travel day, and you commute on their dime and time, not yours as you have to now, plus, as you stated you are gone for 7 days but you are also home for 7 full days, not a big deal, at SWA while on reserve, the most you get is 4 days in a row unless you have to commute then it is less

Just my thought