NetJets Unrest Puts Warren Buffett in a Rare Pinch

[Diesel]

I have been told by our members who are experienced in these matters that it takes several years, not just 2. Aggressive negotiations without the picketing and the embarassing ads sound right to me, by not reducing our demands much until they come quite a bit in our direction. Our new deal should be better for our FOs and at least as good for the captains, with COLAs for all in perpetuity, in my opinion. I don't think the company will stonewall at that in the end. Those of you who want more than that, great. I just hope we will have a profitable employer in the end.

bwahhhhh

What do you think has been happening over the last two years?

The company reads posts like yours. Guys that are willing to sell out their own union brothers and sisters. Guys like you that are striving for mediocre and not wanting to rock the boat with great glee and joy.

Why shouldn't they. You have no drive or energy to get a better contract. You have no experience but friends have told you that it can be done. You don't provide any path to actually get to this point. How do your friends explain to you that this is going to magically happen?

Where is the incentive for the company to come in our direction? For every day that they delay is another day of cost savings and a win for them. So please enlighten me how this is going to happen.

What truly disappoints me with people like you. You think it's just going to happen. You think that this will just magically happen overnight. You aren't willing to put in one second to help the union. You are ready at a moments notice to make sure the deal is good enough for you so that you don't support your fellow pilots. You don't support omaha. You don't support your fellow pilots and have threatened to cross a picket line which is the lowest scum on earth.

Your attitude will never change. It's who you are as a person which is deeply flawed. You haven't been wronged yet by the company. Prime example is you are not a fees payer because you enjoy the protection of the union but don't do anything to help that protection for the next pilot. As long as you get yours.... screw the other guy.

I'll keep responding to you on FI as long as it takes. Hopefully there is an enlightened soul that is reading this and understands the mistakes your making and this helps. If not..... I'm not wasting any time. I trade all day so I'm in front of the computer and this keeps me from over trading. Battling with idiots who think just enough is good for them screw the other guys.

Again lets just recap.

You have no union experience.
Your friends are SCABS and will SCAB again.
You want to SCAB as long as the deal is good for you
You aren't willing to help the union reach any goal.
You believe that magically the union will reach a goal with the company even thought the company has no incentive to do so.
You believe that union employees are thugs for believing that a SCAB is the lowest form of earth and will treat them as such.
You are a dues payer, so you enjoy the protections of the union, except you hate it at the same time.
You're afraid of conflict so are happy living in mediocrity.
You'll never post anything on the messagbaoard because you enjoy the anonymity that FI gives you because you hate conflict

That sums up these multiple threads.

 

[G4dude]

bwahhhhh

What do you think has been happening over the last two years?

The company reads posts like yours. Guys that are willing to sell out their own union brothers and sisters. Guys like you that are striving for mediocre and not wanting to rock the boat with great glee and joy.

Why shouldn't they. You have no drive or energy to get a better contract. You have no experience but friends have told you that it can be done. You don't provide any path to actually get to this point. How do your friends explain to you that this is going to magically happen?

Where is the incentive for the company to come in our direction? For every day that they delay is another day of cost savings and a win for them. So please enlighten me how this is going to happen.

What truly disappoints me with people like you. You think it's just going to happen. You think that this will just magically happen overnight. You aren't willing to put in one second to help the union. You are ready at a moments notice to make sure the deal is good enough for you so that you don't support your fellow pilots. You don't support omaha. You don't support your fellow pilots and have threatened to cross a picket line which is the lowest scum on earth.

Your attitude will never change. It's who you are as a person which is deeply flawed. You haven't been wronged yet by the company. Prime example is you are not a fees payer because you enjoy the protection of the union but don't do anything to help that protection for the next pilot. As long as you get yours.... screw the other guy.

I'll keep responding to you on FI as long as it takes. Hopefully there is an enlightened soul that is reading this and understands the mistakes your making and this helps. If not..... I'm not wasting any time. I trade all day so I'm in front of the computer and this keeps me from over trading. Battling with idiots who think just enough is good for them screw the other guys.

Again lets just recap.

You have no union experience.
Your friends are SCABS and will SCAB again.
You want to SCAB as long as the deal is good for you
You aren't willing to help the union reach any goal.
You believe that magically the union will reach a goal with the company even thought the company has no incentive to do so.
You believe that union employees are thugs for believing that a SCAB is the lowest form of earth and will treat them as such.
You are a dues payer, so you enjoy the protections of the union, except you hate it at the same time.
You're afraid of conflict so are happy living in mediocrity.
You'll never post anything on the messagbaoard because you enjoy the anonymity that FI gives you because you hate conflict

That sums up these multiple threads.

Skippy, almost everything in this post is wrong, and does not reflect what I have said and how I live my life.

 

[Diesel]

Skippy, almost everything in this post is wrong, and does not reflect what I have said and how I live my life.

I look forward to you supporting Omaha and proving me wrong then.

 

[G4dude]

I look forward to you supporting Omaha and proving me wrong then.

I don't like what you are doing in Omaha. I will strike if the contract offer is unreasonably low.

 

[jonjuan]

I don't like what you are doing in Omaha. I will strike if the contract offer is unreasonably low.

What if it is reasonable in your estimation, but it's not in the unions eyes and they declare a strike? What will you do?

 

[Diesel]

What if it is reasonable in your estimation, but it's not in the unions eyes and they declare a strike? What will you do?

He has already said if he feels the offer is acceptable he will not strike.

Now what does the offer for him to be to scab?

 

[G4dude]

What if it is reasonable in your estimation, but it's not in the unions eyes and they declare a strike? What will you do?

I am still hoping like HECK I am not faced with that choice. I don't know what I would do. I have a bad habit of being honest when asked questions, makes it kinda hard on me here sometimes...

 

[Diesel]

I am still hoping like HECK I am not faced with that choice. I don't know what I would do. I have a bad habit of being honest when asked questions, makes it kinda hard on me here sometimes...

Saddest thing I've ever read.

Wanted to quote it so that he can't change his thoughts when the wind blows the other direction.

 

[CA1900]

Our new deal should be better for our FOs and at least as good for the captains, with COLAs for all in perpetuity, in my opinion. I don't think the company will stonewall at that in the end.

They are ALREADY stonewalling at a deal much worse for us than what you'd be happy with. COLA? They want a 5% REDUCTION on top of what inflation had already done to our pay, and said that if we don't accept it, they'll cancel airplane orders and stop recalls.

They aren't going to actually start negotiating until they're actually motivated to do so.

What do you suggest might motivate them to get things moving?

With 1000+ applications from folks in worse jobs, "Waiting for a pilot shortage" is not the answer. What else do you suggest?

 

[G4dude]

They are ALREADY stonewalling at a deal much worse for us than what you'd be happy with. COLA? They want a 5% REDUCTION on top of what inflation had already done to our pay, and said that if we don't accept it, they'll cancel airplane orders and stop recalls.

They aren't going to actually start negotiating until they're actually motivated to do so.

What do you suggest might motivate them to get things moving?

With 1000+ applications from folks in worse jobs, "Waiting for a pilot shortage" is not the answer. What else do you suggest?

In the early stage of negotiations it is to be expected for them to come in low, right?

 

[Diesel]

In the early stage of negotiations it is to be expected for them to come in low, right?

2 years is the early stages? So we should be done in 10 years.

Does your previous union experience tell you this is normal?

 

[ragman]

G4, a frightened mouse trying to work up the courage to be a rat.

 

[fischman]

I don't believe the Omaha picket is a good idea. Just negotiate vigorously and let's see what the finished voting product is.

Its called leverage dude.

Let's say we're having dinner together. I put my wallet on th table and tell you there's $50,000 in it. You can have it if you convince me.

I promise that there is NOTHING you can say that will convince me to hand it over. NOTHING you can SAY. That is what negotiations are. Talk.

In order to get any of the $50,000 it has to be cheaper for me to hand it over than keep it. You have to LEVERAGE me to get it.

This analogy was published on our message board by someone much smarter than me. Perhaps you should spend some time there. You might learn something.

 

[G4dude]

Its called leverage dude.

Let's say we're having dinner together. I put my wallet on th table and tell you there's $50,000 in it. You can have it if you convince me.

I promise that there is NOTHING you can say that will convince me to hand it over. NOTHING you can SAY. That is what negotiations are. Talk.

In order to get any of the $50,000 it has to be cheaper for me to hand it over than keep it. You have to LEVERAGE me to get it.

This analogy was published on our message board by someone much smarter than me. Perhaps you should spend some time there. You might learn something.

Could be. BTW, the opinion about the early stages was given to me by 3 colleagues who have quite a bit of union experience. I was quoting them, since my experience is limited in these matters.

 

[Diesel]

Could be. BTW, the opinion about the early stages was given to me by 3 colleagues who have quite a bit of union experience. I was quoting them, since my experience is limited in these matters.

You mean your 3 friends that say they would SCAB knowing what they know now?

 

[G4dude]

You mean your 3 friends that say they would SCAB knowing what they know now?

I'm not sure what their stance is on scabbing. I had asked a question about how long we have before we see a finished product to vote on, and they smiled and said this is a long process of which we are in the early stages.

 

[G4dude]

You mean your 3 friends that say they would SCAB knowing what they know now?

Are you capable of having a normal conversation without acrimony and sarcasm? I ask this sincerely. You have a lot of knowledge, but discussing things with you is like slogging through hip deep cold molasses. Can we lighten up a little? The world is not divided between Friends and Enemies, with nobody in between.

 

[fischman]

Could be. BTW, the opinion about the early stages was given to me by 3 colleagues who have quite a bit of union experience. I was quoting them, since my experience is limited in these matters.

Could be? It is.

We are not in the early stages. I have more union experience than you. Will you believe me too?

Convince me to give you $50,000 and I'll do it. Seriously.

 

[Diesel]

Are you capable of having a normal conversation without acrimony and sarcasm? I ask this sincerely. You have a lot of knowledge, but discussing things with you is like slogging through hip deep cold molasses. Can we lighten up a little? The world is not divided between Friends and Enemies, with nobody in between.

I'm able to have a conversation with someone that understands what I'm trying to explain to them. Actually not just me trying to explain to them but many pilots and they still don't get it.

Oh wait I did it again. I'm a bad person.

 

[G4dude]

I'm able to have a conversation with someone that understands what I'm trying to explain to them. Actually not just me trying to explain to them but many pilots and they still don't get it.

Oh wait I did it again. I'm a bad person.

You are not a bad person. But those who disagree with you are not bad people either.