NetJets To Picket

[gutshotdraw]

Uh...you just did.

In the ECHO CHAMBER Nacho....


And I fixed it so even you could follow along.

 

[realityman]

They wouldn't let me wear my leather jacket and there's no way in HE// I was going to wear that dorky overcoat so.....



And thanks for painting with that nice, broad brush Realityman. And I guess I missed all that "support" and those "warm welcomes" in the echo chamber. Ever wonder why NONE of us post anymore????

If you missed it, then it's because you weren't paying attention. Or, more likely, you and the others were more focused on the negative and hostile folks (of which I freely admit there are quite a few) on the message boards. Nevertheless, I have not been alone when expressing the thoughts on our boards that we should be as welcoming as possible to the Gulfstream folks. It's easier to get people to see your point of view when being friendly, as opposed to abrasive and antagonistic posts.

Sorry you missed the friendly stuff. As I said, it's possible it was drowned out by the negative.

Still, I have several friends who are union stewards. There have been a fair number of incidents where some of the GLC guys have utilized the union's services. Some of them for potential disciplinary issues. My friends tell me those guys were VERY glad to have representation! That's great. That's what they pay dues for. It's just a shame that the only time they're happy for the union is when they're in trouble. If the union could use their support, in say, a picket, they're nowhere to be found.

By the way, no way will I post info about those incidents I mentioned on these boards, but our stewards will be more than happy to provide you with sanitized (no names, dates) of the incidents where GLC pilots needed union representation. I'm not making it up. Pick up your phone and find out for yourself.

Considering the union HAS benefitted you folks already, and not ONE could be bothered to support our union's call to action (yes, that's your prerogative), I don't feel too badly about painting with a broad brush in this case.

 

[rajflyboy]

Glad to see that Reality man is back to earth with the g wiz stuff.

Now he just needs to explain how nobody lost any vacation with IBB ??

splain that one to us?

 

[gutshotdraw]

Realityman,

Considering only about 60 of 2500+ pilots showed up for the picket, I'm beginning to think the rank and file support for this EBoard in general and this President in particular is a LOT softer than anybody in the echo chamber is willing to admit. At least on this issue.

As to the rest, most folks just don't like to continually listen to nattering naybobs of negativity or participate in the negativity. Doesn't mean they are all management stooges despite what many "A" siders think.

 

[realityman]

Raj,

Go back and re-read the relevant post by me.

Here's the paraphrased version: As far as the loss of vacation in the IBB, I said that I AGREED WITH YOU. It wasn't right, and I spoke up about it at the time. I just said that when taken as a whole, I felt the IBB was an overall win for the pilot group.

Well, at least I can agree with you in part on something, even if it isn't about the whole thing.

And yes, I'm disappointed the GLC group right now, but I stand by my beliefs that the integration was accomplished in about as fair a manner as could be hoped for.

Whether they like the union or not, or will stand with us when the big fights come, is fodder for future posts.

 

[realityman]

Realityman,

Considering only about 60 of 2500+ pilots showed up for the picket, I'm beginning to think the rank and file support for this EBoard in general and this President in particular is a LOT softer than anybody in the echo chamber is willing to admit. At least on this issue.

As to the rest, most folks just don't like to continually listen to nattering naybobs of negativity or participate in the negativity. Doesn't mean they are all management stooges despite what many "A" siders think.

Actually, here's a little history lesson for you. During our fight for the '05 contract, we had numerous pickets at different locations across the country. Typically the turnout at each picket was quite a bit fewer than we had yesterday in CMH. So are you surmising that we had almost no support for our union leadership during those negotiations? Because the voting numbers sing a VERY different story.

The fact that we had such a good turnout for this picket would seem to indicate that, at least on the "A" side (although we're all "A" siders now), our support is as good as it ever was, if not better.

A lot of people just don't want to do the legwork, but still support our union position. After all, the vast majority of our pilots are spread out across the country. Throw in the fact that a little less than half were working that day, and the proximity to the holidays, when folks are getting really busy at home, and the expense of traveling, and I'd say the turnout was excellent. Maybe some of the GLC folks support the union, but just don't want to do the legwork. It's certainly possible. But the fact that not even ONE showed up doesn't make a positive statement with the rest of us.

I am not implying I now think you're bad folks. As I explained, I just don't feel motivated to go out of my way to try and balance some of the radicals on our own boards. You don't have to like the union. You never asked to be a part of it. That's fine. That's your right. But it's my right to be less than appreciative of the lack of support. Nothing more, nothing less.

Based on history, it was an excellent turnout!

 

[OPECJet]

Realityman,

Considering only about 60 of 2500+ pilots showed up for the picket, I'm beginning to think the rank and file support for this EBoard in general and this President in particular is a LOT softer than anybody in the echo chamber is willing to admit. At least on this issue.

As to the rest, most folks just don't like to continually listen to nattering naybobs of negativity or participate in the negativity. Doesn't mean they are all management stooges despite what many "A" siders think.

How many of that 2500+ live in the CMH area and weren't working? 60 seems like a decent number.

 

[BentOver]

How many of that 2500+ live in the CMH area and weren't working? 60 seems like a decent number.

I was just going to say the same thing..... Other than Union folks, how many drove more than say 100 miles to picket? While it obviously would have been nice to have more GLC guys there, I doubt many of them live anywhere near CMH, or had off yesterday.....

Extended days is a whole other issue though!!!

 

[gutshotdraw]

There's what? 200-250 that live in CMH? And another 50ish in town for school? Given the usual suspects of dyed-in-the-wool drum-beaters willing to drive and the NJASAP officers already in town, yes, I think support for this picket on this issue was soft.

Considering fewer than a dozen NJI types live in CMH, zero were in town since we don't train there, and the vast majority are new to a union, it's not at all surprising none were there. I find it interesting that of the nearly 100 "crossovers" in the GLC, only ONE was there. And he HAD to be.

 

[BentOver]

There's what? 200-250 that live in CMH? And another 50ish in town for school? Given the usual suspects of dyed-in-the-wool drum-beaters willing to drive and the NJASAP officers already in town, yes, I think support for this picket on this issue was soft.

Considering fewer than a dozen NJI types live in CMH, zero were in town since we don't train there, and the vast majority are new to a union, it's not at all surprising none were there. I find it interesting that of the nearly 100 "crossovers" in the GLC, only ONE was there. And he HAD to be.

If 200-250 live in CMH, count on around 1/2 working... Count on a few having prior plans, a couple truly not wanting to get invlolved, and a few more possibly out of town. Also count on the holidays/kids/family commitments. And I think anything close to 80 showing up is a pretty healthy showing. Also those in class probably wouldn't have their uniforms nor the time to picket. Especially during the lunch hour etc..

Management obviously took notice. Their union busting blog www.savethegoldengoose.blogspot.com has been busy after months of inactivity. If you read it you will see the unbelievable immaturity that festers itself throughout this EMT.

 

[OPECJet]

I love the goosemanure blog. Entertaining.... He has a facebook page too.

I saw a flock of geese this morning flying overhead as I was pulling into a rest stop to take my morning Sokol. Made me think of that blog, and the deed I was about to do. Then I started drawing comparisons of sanctioned men's room activities and current NJA management. It further reinforced my conclusion that they're running the company into the crapper.

 

[realityman]

There's what? 200-250 that live in CMH? And another 50ish in town for school? Given the usual suspects of dyed-in-the-wool drum-beaters willing to drive and the NJASAP officers already in town, yes, I think support for this picket on this issue was soft.

Considering fewer than a dozen NJI types live in CMH, zero were in town since we don't train there, and the vast majority are new to a union, it's not at all surprising none were there. I find it interesting that of the nearly 100 "crossovers" in the GLC, only ONE was there. And he HAD to be.

Nope. Sorry. You seem almost desperate to try and prove that there's a lack of support for our union leadership on this. But you're wrong. Again, a little history. Going back to our '05 negotiations, where we had TREMENDOUS support from the vast majority of the pilots, one of the pickets was right there in CMH. Same location for the picket. And that picket wasn't any larger than this one. In fact, I believe it may have been a little smaller. I'd have to do some research to get better numbers, but my initial memory is that we didn't have the turnout then, that we did for this picket.

Yeah, Gut, we have folks on our own boards who didn't think this picket was a good idea. And we certainly have folks (outside of the GLC pilots) who don't support our leadership. And we even have a few (again, outside the GLC fleet) who don't care for being in a union at all. I have no issue with that. My point is, that the vast majority of pilots here are happy with our leadership, the direction the union is going, and had no problem with this action. Go onto our boards and look up the recent thread where the poll results are posted about satisfaction with our leadership. It's north of 75%.

It's funny to listen to someone who has been in this union for a year, telling someone who has been in this union for 15 years, that they know better about the support for our union. You don't have to believe me, but I KNOW that the turnout for this picket was very indicative that most are not happy with this 401k thing.

 

[G4dude]

Raj,

Go back and re-read the relevant post by me.

Here's the paraphrased version: As far as the loss of vacation in the IBB, I said that I AGREED WITH YOU. It wasn't right, and I spoke up about it at the time. I just said that when taken as a whole, I felt the IBB was an overall win for the pilot group.

Well, at least I can agree with you in part on something, even if it isn't about the whole thing.

And yes, I'm disappointed the GLC group right now, but I stand by my beliefs that the integration was accomplished in about as fair a manner as could be hoped for.

Whether they like the union or not, or will stand with us when the big fights come, is fodder for future posts.

I think most of my buds in the GLC fleet agree with me that integration was more than fair, for which we say thank you.

 

[realityman]

I think most of my buds in the GLC fleet agree with me that integration was more than fair, for which we say thank you.

Uh, you're welcome?

I think I'm going to slowly back away out of this one.

Incoming!!!!

 

[gutshotdraw]

Nope. Sorry. You seem almost desperate to try and prove that there's a lack of support for our union leadership on this. But you're wrong. Again, a little history. Going back to our '05 negotiations, where we had TREMENDOUS support from the vast majority of the pilots, one of the pickets was right there in CMH. Same location for the picket. And that picket wasn't any larger than this one. In fact, I believe it may have been a little smaller. I'd have to do some research to get better numbers, but my initial memory is that we didn't have the turnout then, that we did for this picket.

Yeah, Gut, we have folks on our own boards who didn't think this picket was a good idea. And we certainly have folks (outside of the GLC pilots) who don't support our leadership. And we even have a few (again, outside the GLC fleet) who don't care for being in a union at all. I have no issue with that. My point is, that the vast majority of pilots here are happy with our leadership, the direction the union is going, and had no problem with this action. Go onto our boards and look up the recent thread where the poll results are posted about satisfaction with our leadership. It's north of 75%.

It's funny to listen to someone who has been in this union for a year, telling someone who has been in this union for 15 years, that they know better about the support for our union. You don't have to believe me, but I KNOW that the turnout for this picket was very indicative that most are not happy with this 401k thing.

I'm not the desperate one here. If you think the Echo Chamber is indicative of the rank and file, well, more power to you.

I think most folks don't like being bullied. Whether it's by B19 browbeating anyone for even thinking a union can be beneficial in some cases or if it's by union cheerleaders demanding unity and unwavering support of the party line. I prefer to think for myself and decide each issue on its merits. Sometimes, I'll side with the union. Sometimes, I won't. This time, I didn't.