NetJets promotes Hansell to president

[Helmsalee]

Also, Wolf, if you get that 51% you can do what you want to the rest. This is where ALPA has a big problem. When one group gets strong enough, they kick another group to the curb. So far, I have not seen any signs of this at NJASAP.
Helm

 

[wolfpackpilot]

This is where ALPA has a big problem. When one group gets strong enough, they kick another group to the curb.

Truer words have never been spoken. ALPA should have been shut down by the Federal Government on many occasions for a complete and total lack of 'duty to fair representation of its own members'. Throughout the 60,70,80,90's groups of United/Delta/Eastern pilots quietly sat by and watch their "brothers" at other ALPA carriers loose everything because they knew it would benefit their own company immensely.

ALPA is a political whale, needing thousands of pounds of food every day to survive.

 

[HiSpeedFlyer]

I will take up for you on these points. Totally unacceptable on behalf of the union. ALPA didn't lock us out when we got furloughed at Midway, and they paid a 1 year membership to a job hunting sight (now I still despise them with all my soul for other things but.) Now, if you were on the boards raising h*ll and going nuts 24/7, then that should be addressed on a one-on-one basis.

If you ever learn anything about unions, remember this: Its a numbers game. Less than 20%, you don't even get an audience with the leaders, and its 50% plus one to make anything happen. Furloughs??? Well you don't really count because you're not feeding the machine any cash right now.

If you're lucky in the job market, you wont have to come back.


Best wishes,

Wolf

Wolf, two points, my friend:

1. We payed for subscriptions for a year to places like climbto350.com and had deals with others, including a resume changing/building service.

2.There is information still being broadcast through several venues, and sent personally if you have the right email adrress on file. It was an E board decision to restrict access to the main forum on the message board, yet they still have read only access to most of the board and a dedicated forum for Furloughees to post and comment on. They havent been given the "slam bam thank you ma'am, and don't let the door hit you on the ass on the way out" as it has been insinuated. The info may not be getting to them that minute it breaks, but it is still presented.

DAS, I am not getting into a pissing contest with you. I just wanted to get these points to Wolf.

 

[CA1900]

... yet they still have read only access to most of the board ...

No, they don't. They can't see any of the regular areas at all.

 

[Jack Mehoff]

Wolf, two points, my friend:

1. We payed for subscriptions for a year to places like climbto350.com and had deals with others, including a resume changing/building service.

2.There is information still being broadcast through several venues, and sent personally if you have the right email adrress on file. It was an E board decision to restrict access to the main forum on the message board, yet they still have read only access to most of the board and a dedicated forum for Furloughees to post and comment on. They havent been given the "slam bam thank you ma'am, and don't let the door hit you on the ass on the way out" as it has been insinuated. The info may not be getting to them that minute it breaks, but it is still presented.

DAS, I am not getting into a pissing contest with you. I just wanted to get these points to Wolf.

I have to call BS on this one. The Furloughed were VERY much given the "slam bam thank you ma'am and don't let the door his you on the ass on the way out" as you put it. Anyone who says otherwise needs a reality check. The climbto350 and resume sites were just some good will showing. Remember this is the same union and pilot group that sold out everyone post 05 with domiciles and NEVER shut up about the pre05 days.

 

[HiSpeedFlyer]

I have to call BS on this one. The Furloughed were VERY much given the "slam bam thank you ma'am and don't let the door his you on the ass on the way out" as you put it. Anyone who says otherwise needs a reality check. The climbto350 and resume sites were just some good will showing. Remember this is the same union and pilot group that sold out everyone post 05 with domiciles and NEVER shut up about the pre05 days.

Whatever, Brother, I see you are another one of the bitter IBB haters. Its your opinion, and you have a choice. If you dont like your union or the pathway it has chosen, there are two options.

Option A. Leave

Option B. Vote them out. Dont whine about the past, its pathetic.

DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.

 

[G200_PILOT]

I didn't know furloughed pilots could vote.


Hmmmmmmm.

 

[realityman]

I have to call BS on this one. The Furloughed were VERY much given the "slam bam thank you ma'am and don't let the door his you on the ass on the way out" as you put it. Anyone who says otherwise needs a reality check. The climbto350 and resume sites were just some good will showing. Remember this is the same union and pilot group that sold out everyone post 05 with domiciles and NEVER shut up about the pre05 days.

Well, if all you can see is the bad in things, then I truly feel sorry for you. Good will showing? I dare say so! What about the refunds of 7 months dues? Yeah, I know, being furloughed sucks bilge water, but that doesn't change the fact that all of you essentially got 7 months of representation for free that the rest of us continued to pay for. You wanna talk contracts? Fine. True, the basing system was changed to only 5 domiciles for new hires starting in '05. But we also got a fantastic HBA system for those already here. And what happened with IBB? The vast majority of pilots here, INCLUDING MOST WHO WERE UTILIZING THE HBA SYSTEM, voted to eliminate that system in order to provide many more basing options for those hired after '05. Sure, we could keep our current HBA, but the HBA SYSTEM was essentially eliminated. Which group of pilots got the biggest percentage increases in pretty much everything with the '05 and IBB contracts? Hint: The junior pilots! Did this pilot group vote away health insurance benefits for our retired pilots, or those close to retiring, so we could make gains in other areas that benefitted the whole pilot group? Yes! Are you having trouble financially? If so, have you tried the NJFF? Originally set up to aid only those current and ACTIVE employees, it was your UNION that altered the program to extend aid to those who were employees but not active (ie. furloughees). Sure, I think it was the right thing to do, but still, a union that was giving you the 'slam bam, thank you ma'am' treatment wouldn't have bothered with something like that. Gone and forgotten?! Hardly!!

I could go on and on about the things the union has done to HELP you. If all you can see is the ways the union HASN'T aided you, then maybe you're the one with the problem, not the union.

We ALL want you guys back quickly! And I have no doubt that returning to work is really the ultimate goal you're all striving for. Unfortunately, that's strictly a company function, much as we wish it weren't so. It sounds like you guys get exactly the same info the rest of get, if not a couple days later. If that's really a big issue, and you can't even acknowledge the good things the union has done for you, and continues to do for you (did someone already mention the collection being taken up to get Xmas gifts for the kids of the furloughees), then why should any of us bother at all with you?

Oh, one minor point that seems to get overlooked: without this union and the rules within the CBA protecting you, you'd be FIRED, not furloughed. I realize recalls may still be a long long way off, but at least it's a SOMETHING, as opposed to 'slam bam thank you ma'am'. But hey, communications are a little slow getting to you, so I guess the union truly is awful.

 

[DC-4]

Hey look guys here is the deal being furloughed sucks the big one. If someone is a bit upset with the union or the company its there right. If they feel like they have been put out to dry they have a right. Its hard for me and my family but lets be honest here, bitching back and fourth will not solve anything. Those that have there jobs don't understand the stresses right now in this economy. However to say the Union essentially sucks is not fair either, they have done many good things. And have done many things poorly too. I don't think any union that has furloughed employees has ever done it right, because its a matter of perception. Point being no one knows the other guys situation. But one thing is true if we all fight against each other its a known fact that the company management wins and we will see the slow painful death of the CBA. Hope everyone is doing well my furloughed brothers and the active line flying pilots.

 

[HiSpeedFlyer]

I didn't know furloughed pilots could vote.


Hmmmmmmm.

Keep out of this, P.

Does it say anywhere he is furloughed? The way he wrote it sounds like he is still here.

Ergo, SO I can satisfy you, G200, I'll post this addendum to my previous post.

If you are furloughed, and you dont like how it been going with respect to communication, call! Communicate! Talk to one of the FWG, email a Steward, Write to an Eboard member,COMMUNICATE YOUR CONCERNS!

There, G200, Satisfied!?!? Jeezus Flippin' Christ!

 

[HiSpeedFlyer]

Hey look guys here is the deal being furloughed sucks the big one. If someone is a bit upset with the union or the company its there right. If they feel like they have been put out to dry they have a right. Its hard for me and my family but lets be honest here, bitching back and fourth will not solve anything. Those that have there jobs don't understand the stresses right now in this economy. However to say the Union essentially sucks is not fair either, they have done many good things. And have done many things poorly too. I don't think any union that has furloughed employees has ever done it right, because its a matter of perception. Point being no one knows the other guys situation. But one thing is true if we all fight against each other its a known fact that the company management wins and we will see the slow painful death of the CBA. Hope everyone is doing well my furloughed brothers and the active line flying pilots.

Thank you for a clean perspective DC.....


I really question my sanity when I get on these boards and participate.

Sigh.

I'm gonna leave now, go tuck my kids into bed, kiss my wife, and read a book about unicorns, ponies and rainbows. If there were any Stag sold in this part of the US, I have myself a few. Who knows, maybe I'd start to feel a little bit awesome tonight.

 

[B747Flyer]

If there were any Stag sold in this part of the US, I have myself a few.

Stag? Heck, a real man needs a Falstaff!

 

[fischman]

Stag is approved as awesome. Falstaff is not. Sorry.

 

[DAS at 10/250]

Wolf, two points, my friend:

1. We payed for subscriptions for a year to places like climbto350.com and had deals with others, including a resume changing/building service.

2.There is information still being broadcast through several venues, and sent personally if you have the right email adrress on file. It was an E board decision to restrict access to the main forum on the message board, yet they still have read only access to most of the board and a dedicated forum for Furloughees to post and comment on. They havent been given the "slam bam thank you ma'am, and don't let the door hit you on the ass on the way out" as it has been insinuated. The info may not be getting to them that minute it breaks, but it is still presented.

DAS, I am not getting into a pissing contest with you. I just wanted to get these points to Wolf.

HiSpeed:

The majority of the posts in this thread seem to have degraded into a general NJASAP bashing or being taken personally by individual pilots (Pervis). Neither was or is my intent. My focus has been on the lack of communication from NJASAP and the ceasing of communication from NJA. All of the benefits provided to the 495 have not been forgotten and were indeed generous.

I shouldn't have to come to FI.com for NJA info nor should AIN be informing me before the union. While the union shouldn't bother itself or the pilots with by the minute updates about the new crew menus, uniform changes, etc, major announcements such as aircraft orders, business buyouts, and new presidents should be cause for such.

I don't doubt your plate is full but the Beacon is dated by the time it hits the press and the 411 is starting to resemble coded BBC messages being sent to the Marquis (WWI reference, not Marquis Jet).

Career decisions are being made out here and timely information is important. Don't forget that the majority of us are not out on the line anymore (with any company) or even remotely involved with aviation. I served under enough commanders who hoarded information. Please don't do the same.

I understand you aren't looking for a pissing contest and neither am I.

If we have read only access that is news to me.

DAS