Netjets Gv Pay

[Majik]

I don’t mean to chest thump. It just seems to me it is to big a gamble for the “A” guys. Again it is my opinion.

We have what we have. If we win, we have what was promised years ago. If we lose, we still have what we have fought for and achieved.

NJI guys are caught in the middle between Santulli's former promise of combining both groups and NJA pilots trying to hold him to that promise. So why do you feel it's a big gamble for the NJA guys?

 

[RTRHD]

We have what we have. If we win, we have what was promised years ago. If we lose, we still have what we have fought for and achieved.

NJI guys are caught in the middle between Santulli's former promise of combining both groups and NJA pilots trying to hold him to that promise. So why do you feel it's a big gamble for the NJA guys?

If the single carrier thing fails I think you will lose a lot of leverage for your next contract. Because then NJI will definitely be a totally separate company. You will have no scope at all with regards to NJI. Again it is just my opinion, it starts to get very confusing at this level of the labor laws.

 

[Majik]

If the single carrier thing fails I think you will lose a lot of leverage for your next contract. Because then NJI will definitely be a totally separate company. You will have no scope at all with regards to NJI. Again it is just my opinion, it starts to get very confusing at this level of the labor laws.

I don't see us losing any leverage if we lost the single carrier bid. Our current scope says we get all fleets excluding the Gulfstream IV's and V's. Our last contract had that language. The contract before that had that language.
Santulli could ask us to give up that scope in 2010 but why would we ever agree to that? Losing the single carrier case has zero affect on what we negotiate in future contracts. Now, if we win the single carrier bid we will have a lot of leverage. No real loss if we lose, potential big gains if we win.

 

[RTRHD]

I don't see us losing any leverage if we lost the single carrier bid. Our current scope says we get all fleets excluding the Gulfstream IV's and V's. Our last contract had that language. The contract before that had that language.
Santulli could ask us to give up that scope in 2010 but why would we ever agree to that? Losing the single carrier case has zero affect on what we negotiate in future contracts. Now, if we win the single carrier bid we will have a lot of leverage. No real loss if we lose, potential big gains if we win.

OK, You win.

 

[Majik]

OK, You win.

I enjoyed the discussion.

 

[Spyguy]

Do you really think it's because "SOOOO" many pilots dont want to be represented (which is what you meant to say) by 1108 and thats the reason they are applying to NJI??? C'mon dude! You dont think that perhaps the fact that you can be based basically anywhere with NJI has anything to do with it right now, do yah??? Duhhhh???

I think it's pretty easy to understand why you guys have "SOOOO" many more resumes than NJA.....I would rather live at home too than have to move to LA or CMH.

But hey, maybe YOU can "enlighten" us on something that we dont know about why you have "SOOO" many resumes over there at NJI???

OK rocker,
If you feel that because pilots can live anywhere is the key issue as to why there are so many applications at NJI, then why was it not a more important issue for the 1108 on this past contract? If I was one of the new pilots over there I would be pissed that the union is busy trying to go after NJI over a vendetta for some of the older guys there, than trying to secure home basing for the junior personel. Here's a thought, if it came down to only affording one battle, which do you think your senior leadership is going to choose? Do you honestly think Big Brother Teamster is going to go toe to toe or better yet dollar for dollar (because that is what businesses and oh by the way unions are all about) with NTS? I guess time will tell and right now all anyone can do is speculate. But I will leave you with this....why doesn't the union try to go for Home basing now instead of waiting three years???

 

[Spyguy]

I forgot, it's not a vendetta, it's because NTS promised. Well, you can promise in one hand and crap in the other and we'll see which one get's filled first. Again, I would not be too happy if I were one of the newer guys over there. The NMB will not be cheap at all, coming right when a new contract is being negotiated. How will the integration of NJA and NJI benefit the dues paying memebers of the 1108? I bet if you put it to a vote that most of your members two years from now, they would vote for HBA over NJA/NJI everyday.

 

[RTRHD]

Don't Worry Be Happy

Don’t Worry, Be Happy.

As Sung by RTRHD

(Insert Reggae melody here.)

Let me tell about this frac I know.

The Union tells em to just vote no.

Don’t Worry, Be Happy (chorus)

Their going to sell out their new FO’s

Their going to tell em that’s how it goes.

Don’t Worry, Be Happy (chorus)

They our going to lose their scope

“O” Well that’s how it goes.

Don’t Worry, Be Happy. (chorus)

NJI will say By By

And then they will streak thru the skies.

Don’t Worry, Be Happy (chorus)

Then the A Jets only go six nine.

The union say’s we need more time.

Don’t, Worry Be Happy. (End chorus):beer:


Sorry for being an Idiot.

 

[Majik]

OK rocker,
If you feel that because pilots can live anywhere is the key issue as to why there are so many applications at NJI, then why was it not a more important issue for the 1108 on this past contract? If I was one of the new pilots over there I would be pissed that the union is busy trying to go after NJI over a vendetta for some of the older guys there, than trying to secure home basing for the junior personel. Here's a thought, if it came down to only affording one battle, which do you think your senior leadership is going to choose? Do you honestly think Big Brother Teamster is going to go toe to toe or better yet dollar for dollar (because that is what businesses and oh by the way unions are all about) with NTS? I guess time will tell and right now all anyone can do is speculate. But I will leave you with this....why doesn't the union try to go for Home basing now instead of waiting three years???

If you were a new hire at NJA (and you did a little research) you would know that NJA pilots had a choice of a significant raise OR HBAs for all. You may not have come to NJA if we hadn't achieved a significant raise but it would have been a choice YOU made. So now every new hire has to make a decision. Do I accept the job knowing that I have to use one of the 5 domiciles? You say if you were a new hire and made the decision to accept the offer you would be pissed??? At yourself for making the decision or at the pilots that fought to increase wages? We can't go after changing the domicile thingy until 2010 because we signed the contract. The single carrier thingy is totally different and the only part of single carrier that we agreed to in the contract was to not take it to court until Nov 2008. Totally different animals. We will pursue HBAs for all when the Railway Labor Act allows us to. I wish we could always pick and choose which rules to follow but it doesn't work that way Sport.

So the question boils down to this - Will the court rule that NJA and NJI are similar companies within the same corporation and was NJI created separately from NJA to avoid unionization?

 

[Guitar rocker]

Thanks Majik.

 

[Hogprint]

Spyguy posted:

....why doesn't the union try to go for Home basing now instead of waiting three years???

Yeah, this was the turd in the punchbowl from the contract. No doubt about it. It was the issue that kept me waiting to vote until the bitter end.

The way I understand it is management floated this stinker in at the last minute (as a wedge issue for now or later?) and it was presented to us to vote on. The good out weighed the bad and we have what we have now. Is it perfect? No.

My gamble was the HBA would not work and the company would ask for relief. We still have stacks of resumes and people lined up to come to work here. Looks like that hand may not pay off. Time will tell.

In answer to your question though, the ball is in managements court on this one.

 

[Majik]

Delaying the contract another year may have permanently crippled NetJets. We fought over 4 years and both sides were getting bloodied. In the end it was my hope that not enough pilot applicants would be willing to move to one of the 5 domiciles or would not be willing to commute long distances. If the company could not attract enough pilots, they would be forced to expand the choices for new hires.

So far it appears there are plenty of qualified applicants that are willingly choosing to take the job under the conditions offered. If they're happy then I'll accept their decision to take the job. We'll address this issue in about 4 years unless the applicant pool dries up before then.

 

[wolfpackpilot]

We (NJA pilots)Let's just stop all of the chest thumping and let the courts decide. I promise to live with the decision if you will.

That's the most wise statement you've ever made. I agree.

Im off to fly the world and screw up the radio calls in Europe.:nuts:



Hog,

I dont know the numbers for this year, but its under 15.

 

[Majik]

Here was my original post:

We (NJA pilots) feel that NJI was formed as a separate company specifically to avoid unionization (letting the pilots have a choice). Let's let the courts determine if that's true. Santulli promised that they would later be combined. He lied. We would like all of our pilots to have the same ability to fly from home like NJI. Santulli says fly from home is too expensive.

Again, it's not some stupid vendetta on NJI although I understand why you want to try to spin it that way. I have a choice and I choose to pursue the single carrier thingy. You don't have a choice. You chose not to have a choice. You brag about not having a choice. Let's just stop all of the chest thumping and let the courts decide. I promise to live with the decision if you will.

Here's what you cut and pasted to make it look a quote:

We (NJA pilots)Let's just stop all of the chest thumping and let the courts decide. I promise to live with the decision if you will.

I was tempted to type something out of context and misquote you in return but I think it serves a better purpose to point out that you intentionally falsified my original post. Now why would you do that? Couldn't debate the issue on merits so you made something up? How does that make your side look? You must be taking a page out of Santulli's playbook - Lie when the truth doesn't suit your purpose...

 

[ghostrider64]

SPy who is this "NTS" you keep speaking of? I'm confused...