Netjets Globals

[G4dude]

Yes, the majors will be hiring, and their latest contracts include raises as well. NJA pilots will not settle for a cut in their pay and working conditions when the rest of the industry is getting better. Except G4 of course, who is so bad at what he does that he values his abilities at a very low level.

I hope you are right, a raise would be nice in order to pay Obama'a tax increases coming down the pike.

 

[jetlag7]

Yeah, I have recently been wondering about that next contract. I have a feeling it will be a pay and benefits cut.

Says the scab in training.....

 

[Hogprint]

And who will they be hiring?

Gonna see a lot of fractional guys go if we don't get raises here....

Gun, I'm usually in agreement with you, but I think you've missed the boat on this one.

If this had been the case five to seven years ago I'd agree. The demographics just don't support a mass exodus from NJA, no matter how much the majors are hiring. The bubble has crested the 40-45 yr old demo here now and I doubt very many will leave NJA especially in light of their seat position or seniority number.

I can see the FO's bailing but you'll see minimal movement with the Cpt's.

 

[Hogprint]

How many of you guys know about people learning how to fly? I know exactly ZERO. Where is the next generation of people who are willing to spend $150,000 to earn $19,000 going to come from? And now they have to meet ATP mins (thankfully) to fly in the right seat of a 121 carrier. Where are they going to get their time? Flying cancelled checks? Nope. Flight instructing? Nope.

The word is finally out on our profession. It sucks getting started in.

How many line dogs have you had coming up to you with stars in their eyes asking how you got started lately? How many kids driving the van to the hotel ask about the job?

My AME told me that he hasn't issued a student pilot/Class III in over two years! That speaks volumes.

 

[fischman]

Exactly.

 

[gunfyter]

I can see the FO's bailing but you'll see minimal movement with the Cpt's.

Depends on age... If I were an FO with enough years left I would. I am down to 10 more years of this though.

 

[G4dude]

Depends on age... If I were an FO with enough years left I would. I am down to 10 more years of this though.

I think we will lose pretty much all our FOs.

 

[G4dude]

Says the scab in training.....

You better believe it. We NJI types will be in a foot race to see who can cross the picket line first if you morons ever strike NJA. Proud to be a scab in training. I have found the hard core union guys to be lousy pilots and boring travel companions. Seeing y'all with your cute little signs in your cute little uniforms chanting slogans of class warfare will be hilarious. Remember, I didn't bring up this topic on this thread, you did.

 

[gunfyter]

I think we will lose pretty much all our FOs.

The company could just put out massive numbers of PIC bids to stop that.

 

[jtf]

My strike/ furlough fund has enough to last over a year already. If they insist on concessions and/ or they refuse to take the pay up a healthy amount, I will be proud to strike until they pay or until we STMFD. I don't require Southwest money, but I won't accept peanuts or concessions. I honestly don't believe the company would ever let a strike happen, but without the threat of it I don't see moving the contract up at all. I like the job and living where I want without having to commute, but it has to pay more if I'm going to be an SIC for another decade plus.

 

[Praetorian]

You better believe it. We NJI types will be in a foot race to see who can cross the picket line first if you morons ever strike NJA. Proud to be a scab in training. I have found the hard core union guys to be lousy pilots and boring travel companions. Seeing y'all with your cute little signs in your cute little uniforms chanting slogans of class warfare will be hilarious. Remember, I didn't bring up this topic on this thread, you did.

After God had finished the rattlesnake, the toad, and the vampire, he had some awful substance left with which he made a scab.

A scab is a two-legged animal with a corkscrew soul, a water brain, a combination backbone of jelly and glue.

Where others have hearts, he carries a tumor of rotten principles.

When a scab comes down the street, men turn their backs and angels weep in heaven, and the devil shuts the gates of hell to keep him out.

No man (or woman) has a right to scab so long as there is a pool of water to drown his carcass in, or a rope long enough to hang his body with.

Judas was a gentleman compared with a scab. For betraying his master, he had character enough to hang himself. A scab has not.

Esau sold his birthright for a mess of pottage.

Judas sold his Savior for thirty pieces of silver.

Benedict Arnold sold his country for a promise of a commision in the british army.

The scab sells his birthright, country, his wife, his children and his fellowmen for an unfulfilled promise from his employer.

Esau was a traitor to himself; Judas was a traitor to his God; Benedict Arnold was a traitor to his country.

A scab is a traitor to his God, his country, his family and his class.

Author --- Jack London (1876-1916)

 

[Partyfoul]

So a scab is a traitor to God? Country? Family? I would beg to differ, I don't work for a union. I work for a company that I help build and prosper. I doubt you would understand that. BTW, I think you just made G4dude's point.

 

[G4dude]

So a scab is a traitor to God? Country? Family? I would beg to differ, I don't work for a union. I work for a company that I help build and prosper. I doubt you would understand that. BTW, I think you just made G4dude's point.

Thank you, kind Sir.

 

[Praetorian]

So a scab is a traitor to God? Country? Family? I would beg to differ, I don't work for a union. I work for a company that I help build and prosper. I doubt you would understand that. BTW, I think you just made G4dude's point.

So you would join him in crossing a picket line?

 

[Hogprint]

You better believe it. We NJI types will be in a foot race to see who can cross the picket line first if you morons ever strike NJA. Proud to be a scab in training. I have found the hard core union guys to be lousy pilots and boring travel companions. Seeing y'all with your cute little signs in your cute little uniforms chanting slogans of class warfare will be hilarious. Remember, I didn't bring up this topic on this thread, you did.

I don't know whether to be ashamed or afraid for our company...

It really is guys like you that keep the animosity running high. The moron is you sir.

 

[jetlag7]

You better believe it. We NJI types will be in a foot race to see who can cross the picket line first if you morons ever strike NJA. Proud to be a scab in training. I have found the hard core union guys to be lousy pilots and boring travel companions. Seeing y'all with your cute little signs in your cute little uniforms chanting slogans of class warfare will be hilarious. Remember, I didn't bring up this topic on this thread, you did.

GIV, for someone who is not well-liked on an ANONYMOUS message board, who flat-out rejects the concept of banding together with your fellow pilots for the advancement of eachother (i.e. a "union"), who seems to be having difficulty accepting the simple truth we are ONE group by repeatedly referring to the now non-existent NJI/NJA divide -- in other words, someone who doesn't play well with others -- you place an awful lot of faith in the idea that pilots on the GIV/GV fleets will gleefully follow you and your self-serving agenda.

Class warfare? Nice attempt at a re-direct, but you and I both know this is not the same thing. (Side note: I wouldn't exactly call it "cute" but what do you have against the uniform anyway?? )

As for your remark: "I have found the hard core union guys to be lousy pilots and boring travel companions" -- I'm sure an obvious SKY-GOD such as yourself is a joy to fly with as well.

Seriously, are we in the Third grade? Is that your argument? Did you figure pilots are "macho" so you would try to gain support by appealing to that particular personality trait? Do you realize how ridiculous you sound to those of us who actually fly for a living?

 

[ghostrider64]

NJA has lost 100+ a/c over the last 3 years... It has lost 15 since the beginning of summer... What rate can NJA expect to take deliveries of the Globals and Phenoms vs. the existing disposal rate of a/c currently approaching or past the 10 yr. old mark?

Management has missed their mark on sales every period since this all began. So whenever a management type comes in to recurrent (or starts some sales rumor) that they expect sales to shoot through the roof, expect the exact opposite...

You as many pilots consider winning based on total number of aircraft, thereby more pilots. I'm addressing financials, which clearly the cost/sale of a global far exceeds that of 5 or 6 SMALL jets.

So 3 fully sold globals, equates to 15 ultras.....on a profit basis.

Therefore it is a winner....

 

[Bored so Here]

You better believe it. We NJI types will be in a foot race to see who can cross the picket line first if you morons ever strike NJA. Proud to be a scab in training.

Scab away there, sunshine. Best of luck covering all those trips (I guess you can knock them out after you fly the G owner trips). History always remembers the Useful Idiots, I suppose. Also, I wouldn't count on unanimous participation from the GLC folks. There are plenty in that fleet that do have character.

 

[BentOver]

You as many pilots consider winning based on total number of aircraft, thereby more pilots. I'm addressing financials, which clearly the cost/sale of a global far exceeds that of 5 or 6 SMALL jets.

So 3 fully sold globals, equates to 15 ultras.....on a profit basis.

Therefore it is a winner....

That would depend on how much they are selling Global shares for vs. Ultra's... Also how much is the hourly fee, monthly fee, acquisition cost, operational cost to the company, so on and so on... I agree that a profitable company is what everyone needs.. But no pilot at NJA has the answers to those cost questions.. Sure there are pilots who think they do.. (On cue I'm sure someone will tell me they do in about 3 posts)

But on the flip side. The company could possibly be profitable with 50 planes..... Less maintenance, less overhead etc.. But do you really think that is good?

The company turning a profit is fine, but remember you see no part of that profit. So whether they make huge profits or minimal profits, you would still keep your job but reap no rewards. But a smaller company does guarantee 1 thing. Less jobs, less seniority for you and a negative work environment.

The Global may prove to be a winner, but IMO selling 1-2 Globals and maybe 3 Phenoms (and most likely just owners switching a/c) after a whole year of being announced isn't exactly like saying they are lining up at the door to purchase....

Bottom line I believe NJA will continue to shrink.... There are roughly 250-300 Citations, Hawkers, Gulfstreams that will most likely be disposed of... Thats alot of Phenoms and Globals and Challengers to try to make up the difference... History has proven that all orders are generally not exercised. And NJE is getting some of those orders....

 

[johnsonrod]

Here's a great picture of the Global 6000 cockpit:

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Bomb...86812/L/&sid=7229551e26745453d0be554403515e94

Very impressive! Makes the G550 cockpit look archaic... :laugh: