Netjets Ain Article

[SafetyTheSeat]

"Flying" a desk for 14 hours is far less dangerous than piloting a plane that long. I think they will see the difference.

NetJetWife -- please do not make what I do all day sound sooo easy. By your definition, your husband's job is more important and stressful than being the President of the United States (no political discussions to start here).

No one should ever over-estimate the importance of his/her job and think that he/he is irreplaceable. Every CEO of a majpr corporation is replacable, and even the country can, has and will survive a sudden change in leadership.

To reiterate the essence of many of my posts, educating the owners can help the pilots cuase, but irritating, embarrassing or inconveniencing will result in the owners not supporting the pilots.

Fly safe.

Dude,

I can’t handle your comments anymore… Let me make this simple for you because like most people with money your ego will not allow you to see or hear what is being conveyed to you. So here it goes one last time.



Sitting at your desk and making a mistake (one mistake) will not KILL YOU!



Sitting at your desk and making a mistake (one mistake) will not cost you your job!



Sitting at your Desk and Failing semi-annual training will not cost you your job!



Failing to note a safety item (one time) on your desk prior to sitting down will not KILL you!



Not paying attention to detail, hour after hour, at your desk will not kill you!!



Failing a FAA route checked at your desk anytime day or night will not cost you your job!!!



Failing your semi-annual physical will not cost you your job!!



Having High Blood pressure will not cost you your job!!



Working 14 hours a day- day in day out- with only 10 hours of rest will diminish your attention but will not KILL you at your desk!!



Failure in your job can’t kill you only diminish your quality of life.

 

[Turbinehead]

Ok, so then why?

Dude,

I can’t handle your comments anymore… Let me make this simple for you because like most people with money your ego will not allow you to see or hear what is being conveyed to you. So here it goes one last time.



Sitting at your desk and making a mistake (one mistake) will not KILL YOU!



Sitting at your desk and making a mistake (one mistake) will not cost you your job!



Sitting at your Desk and Failing semi-annual training will not cost you your job!



Failing to note a safety item (one time) on your desk prior to sitting down will not KILL you!



Not paying attention to detail, hour after hour, at your desk will not kill you!!



Failing a FAA route checked at your desk anytime day or night will not cost you your job!!!



Failing your semi-annual physical will not cost you your job!!



Having High Blood pressure will not cost you your job!!



Working 14 hours a day- day in day out- with only 10 hours of rest will diminish your attention but will not KILL you at your desk!!



Failure in your job can’t kill you only diminish your quality of life.

If your job is so important, safety, then WHY?

WHY did you accept so little compensation for it when you were hired. WHY didnt you go somewhere else? You hurt the industry as a whole when you told your employer by accepting this job with this level of responsibility for substandard wages that YOU were OKAY with it, and forever after hurt the standard in the industry.

DEAL!

Turb.

 

[ultrarunner]

If your job is so important, safety, then WHY?

WHY did you accept so little compensation for it when you were hired. WHY didnt you go somewhere else? You hurt the industry as a whole when you told your employer by accepting this job with this level of responsibility for substandard wages that YOU were OKAY with it, and forever after hurt the standard in the industry.

DEAL!

Turb.

Turb hit the nail on the head. The NJ pilot group as a whole as set the bar so low, by accepting such substandard wages.

Each and everyone would be better served by moving on to company's that pay a fair wage. They would have more pride in themselves, their family and would take more pride in their jobs.

For some reason, they (the NJ pilot group) I think believes they have this great power to hold management hostage. I don't believe they do.

At what cost due you continue the fight? And at what point do you say to yourselves on your drive home from work:

"...ya know, I am going to move on to a company that values me and what I bring and can offer..."

Each and every time a NJ pilot says that, they will have been set free.

 

[niteflyr]

Amen ultrarunner, set me free!

"...ya know, I am going to move on to a company that values me and what I bring and can offer..."

I hadn't even thought of that for the past 15+ years I have been doing this, thanks for your insight in pointing it out! I guess I will accept one of the MANY offers sitting out there from just such companies, that appreciate me. Thank you again for opening my eyes...(MUCH sarcasm intended)

Why accept this job? Because unfortunately it is still the highest paid job I have had yet. So don't lump all the low paying aviation job problems on the NJA group. We are doing our best to try to change this, in spite of all the others not wanting to pitch in with the effort. Somehow WE have become the bad guys in all this, pretty sad.

 

[NJA Capt]

Well, the "less productive pilots" part just highlights the broad-based ignorance of corporate aviation that resides within the NetJets pilot ranks. How many corporate pilots get 1/3 to 1/2 a month in "hard" days off? How many live somewhere where they aren't based, and commute on company time at company expense? The list goes on. Far from being "more productive", the frac scheme requires hiring an additional 2 to 3 pilots per airplane to sufficiently crew it. A company operating their own flight department buys a he!! of a lot more from a pilot even just in terms of availability than what a NetJets pilot produces.

Let’s reword this:


Well, the "less productive pilots" part just highlights the broad-based ignorance in corporate aviation.

Who are you kidding? 80+% of NJA pilots are former corp pilots. How many corp pilots have former frac experience?
Who knows who better?

How many corporate pilots get 1/3 to 1/2 a month in "hard" days off?

How many corp guys are HOME every night?
How many corporate guys spend 150+ RONs/yr?
How many corp guys fly 4-6 legs/day, every duty day for a week?

How many live somewhere where they aren't based, and commute on company time at company expense?

How many corporate pilots have to travel 200-2000 miles to get the airplane they are assigned to……EVERY week?
How many corp planes return to their "base" 2 times per year?

Far from being "more productive", the frac scheme requires hiring an additional 2 to 3 pilots per airplane to sufficiently crew it.

How many corp planes fly 85 hours/month or 900+ hours/yr?
How many would/could fly that schedule with 1 crew per plane?

 

[Flyingdutchman]

And thats why you guys deserve a better pay!! And we (91 corp and 135 charter) support ya! so don't start a fight with us, fight your managment.

Did you know that first year pay at Netjets Europe is about E 40.500 (+/-
55.000 USD) you guys deserve ATLEAST the same..

However, don't try to start a fight with us. Let's stay united dang it, we are in this crap together.

FD

 

[Daveman]

I deleted my first post since I am no longer a 135 pilot and thought I had "no dog in the fight". Well, I was wrong. I implore the NetJet pilots not to sanction
any type list towards the 135 community. This may/will alienate NJ drivers from potential employers in corporate aviation.
This isn't a hostile post, but rather a strong reminder. I've wished you well in earlier posts and continue the same.
I wish all Frac/pilots luck, no ill-will. But do not list them as scabs, it will come back to haunt you.

Regards,
Daveman

 

[English]

Our company was called yesterday and asked how many hours we could fly for Netjets/EJM this month.

A buddy of mine was just promised 96 hours in April on his aircraft.

It's happening already.

 

[Diesel]

Just a couple of points.

When United struck the pax flew on other carriers which was their choice. United didn't have american come in and start flying under the united schedule with united callsigns. The pax made the choice to fly on american or delta.

Netjets is trying to use it's supplemental lift (charters and vendors) to try and weaken the unions power. Basically bringing in the "replacements" so they can keep flying.

I really hope the union doesn't feel that charters and vendors are going to be scabs. I have a lot of friends in the charter world and this would really suck. I can see both points of view.

Catyaak, and turbine head and the others can spread your hate somewhere else.

 

[Ace-of-the-Base]

Just a couple of points.

When United struck the pax flew on other carriers which was their choice. United didn't have american come in and start flying under the united schedule with united callsigns. The pax made the choice to fly on american or delta.

Netjets is trying to use it's supplemental lift (charters and vendors) to try and weaken the unions power. Basically bringing in the "replacements" so they can keep flying.

I really hope the union doesn't feel that charters and vendors are going to be scabs. I have a lot of friends in the charter world and this would really suck. I can see both points of view.

Catyaak, and turbine head and the others can spread your hate somewhere else.

I guess one big question (acid test, if you will) is whether the operator has been supplying lift for NJ prior to this dispute. If so, they are not doing anything new (business as usual), and, in fact, they have been part of NJs success (good for the employees). Now then, if some companies that were not in a previous relationship with NJ were to take advantage of this situation, that would be profiting from your loss. It is a blurred line as NJ cannot keep their customers happy 100% of the time without using some charter, and now you want the charter pilots to 'side' with the NJ pilots and risk their own jobs, thus preventing them from being a productive part of the whole fractional formula in the future when your contract is complete.

Keep it civil.

What do they say, don't sh$t where you sleep? Something like that.

Ace