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National Seniority list

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ArcticFlier said:
There's a difference between a guild (which is what is being talked about here), and a government run system.

Seems to me, a guild would remove labor cost from the overall cost equation. Might actually shine the spotlight where it belongs: On management's ability (or lack thereof) to run an airline.

Your retirement would be portable from company to company

You wouldn't have to start over at the bottom of another seniority list

Pay would be based on your number within the guild, not the airline.

On and on.

But alas, a wet dream.




AF :cool:

Also what goes up can go down. You could be bumped onto the street by a pilot whose company went out of business.
 
wms said:
Also what goes up can go down. You could be bumped onto the street by a pilot whose company went out of business.

No. Training costs would go through the roof. You would have to wait for an opening. No job bumping.

AF :cool:
 
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The airlines would probably pay more to keep people from leaving and running training costs up. I like the idea
 
Great Thread! Thanks for keeping it top of mind why I would never even consider flying for an airline...
 
why would an airline bring in a pilot at 10 year pay when they can get a newbie at 1st year pay? because he is more experienced? because we know how important the safety experience brings is more important to management than getting it done on the cheap...see NWA
 
hbrow15 said:
why would an airline bring in a pilot at 10 year pay when they can get a newbie at 1st year pay? because he is more experienced? because we know how important the safety experience brings is more important to management than getting it done on the cheap...see NWA

Because if we did this right, they would have no choice. You want a pilot? Here's the list.

Before anyone says, "well they'll just get around the guild and get a job." Why? First year pay is first year pay. Why screw up a career by going around the guild for a job you would get anyway?


AF :cool:
 
Here's an idea,

Let's have a real ATP written test with no kidding all the classroom academics akin to a JAA certification. Not only will that get our FAA tickets recognized and therefore enable us to purse positions overseas, but it will also limit the number of folks that become professional airline pilots.

Research has indicated that the supply of labor, more than anything else, is the driving factor in a natural increase/decrease of wages. A union creates a barrier to entry, sort to speak, and therefore limits the supply of labor. However, our union does not create that barrier. We don't require folks to go through an apprenticeship program (perhaps flight instructing and other time-building employment) in the traditional sense. And the fact that 500 hr bridge programs exist do not help the profession since the traditional flight building path has been bypassed.

Lets put some academics (of course grandfather all us that are in good standing) in our profession and watch the growth of the supply of pilots, at least possibly, slow down...and in the long-run, reverse the current wage trends.

My $0.02
 
Legal problems aside, a national senority list would lead to some interesting situations. For example, Captains making less than half what their FO is making, senior pilots going from company to company cherry-picking the best jobs at the expense of other pilots who have worked hard.

Beware the law of unintended consequences.
 
And who gets on the list in what order? 25 year veteran of numerous non-union or foreign airlines that has only been ALPA for one year getting put junior to a 23 year-old Mesa 1900 captain because he's been ALPA for 2 years? Not a good idea unless EVERYONE started at about the same age.
 

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