My Rant on the STUPID & SPINELESS Flight Options Management!

[netjetwife]

Fred, I didn't want to rain on Fisch's parade, but you have brought up an important point. We're looking at the Buick Enclave and the GMC Acadia. Both are at the top of a list of recommended mid-size SUVs which US News has compiled. The article has been very helpful. Those in the market can start their research here. They ranked all types of vehicles.
http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/cars-trucks/rankings/Affordable-Midsize-SUVs/

Unfortunately, many FltOps pilots will have to wait until they are paid decently. Vehicle prices are going up so this is another--on a long list--of missed opportunities the FLOPS are responsible for....

 

[Galaxy]

Fred,
I ran into the same issues here. I still ended up with the Odyssey as I needed a car that would not cause hassles while I was away. I have owned both foreign and domestic and the foreign cars just are easier to own in my book. Perhaps when the american car mfgrs listen to what we want instead of putting a new body on an old frame I will go back.. The Chevy Volt has my eye....
Sorry about the thread jack...

Lets get on with the show..

FLOPS sucks!!!! SHUT it down!

 

[Publishers]

I am sure that if the cutbacks do not take hold and the bleeding stops, they will consider that option. You can bring it back pretty far and just wait for the economy to pick up and Embraer to start deliveries.

 

[B19 Flyer]

NJ PILOTS WHO SERVE THE UNION DON'T MAKE EXTRA MONEY. THE UNION GIVES THEM A STIPEND SO THAT THEY CAN BREAK EVEN. BEFORE THAT THOSE PILOTS WERE LOSING MONEY WHILE VOLUNTEERING AND BURN-OUT WAS A CONCERN.

NJASAP DIRECTORS DON'T GET THE STIPEND FROM 1108....DUH...I STOPPED COUNTING MY FAMILY'S FINANCIAL LOSS WHEN IT HIT 5K

PERSONAL TIME THAT VOLUNTEERS DONATE TO THE UNION IS NOT REIMBURSED--ONLY THE FLYING INCOME THEY MISS WHILE WORKING ON UNION AND/OR JOINT PROJECTS IN CMH. NJA VALUES INPUT FROM THE PILOTS AND HAS A FAIR SYSTEM WITH THE UNION TO COVER THE PILOTS WHO SERVE ON COMMITTEES AND ALSO FLY THE LINE

FUD-FLINGERS ARE AN INSULT TO PILOTS WHO FIGHT FOR THEIR CAREER, THEIR FAMILY, AND THEIR PEERS IN THE INDUSTRY. THOSE WHO WISH TO SHOW SUPPORT TO THE OPTIONS PILOTS CAN GIVE B19 THE BOOT AND HELP CLEAR HIS FUD OFF THIS THREAD.

I still wonder what Warren Buffet thinks about a pilot that was hired to fly airplanes not flying and producing the entire amount of revenue for the company he was hired to fly for.

Mr. Buffet still has to pay for the training of your husband, taxes on his income, insurance for your family, earned vacation, sick pay and all the benefits that the union contract provides. Yet, your husband only flies a portion of what he was hired to fly because he is working on union business on company time.

If the union volunteer only flies 50% of the hours he was hired to fly, and Uncle Warren is paying 100% of his benefits via the contract, Uncle Warren comes out the loser. I honestly wonder what he thinks.

The stipend might cover lost income for you and your family NJW, but who is the one paying the rest of it that you take for granted?

Considering you haven't a business backround, you wouldn't understand that, would you?

(Perhaps it's because you are only a pilots wife?)

 

[skanza]

you'll love this...

Way to support stuggling union workers (and their families) by buying a non-union built car from a foreign owned company.

So you're saying buy American to support a union? So it must take a union to produce a quality product, right? The American auto industry is the worst example of labor unions bleeding a company dry to provide workers with high wages/benefits. "Let's pay someone $40/hr to put door handles on this piece of sh!t Chevy all day, then sell it for a loss." Great plan! Now the UAW is upset because GM is closing plants that make the gas guzzling Hummer and Tahoe. But it's not GM's fault that nobody's buying these monster machines, but it is thier fault they are so far behind the foreign carmakers in enginuity. Toyota and Honda are both non-union manufacturers and produce quality products and make a profit. It is possible, and they prove it. It's not my responsibility to support American workers, if the product they buld is crap, I won't buy it! I support companies that provide quality, so I guess its all Honda/Toyota for me, suckers!

 

[netjetwife]

Here's your sign--FUD--and my black boot!

We got our answer. Obviously, B19 is only posting here to spread his slimy FUD. He cares nothing about the pilots that were fired for bogus reasons. He shows complete disregard for the purpose of the thread, behaving like an obnoxious jackass. Many of us have him on ignore but still his lying rants continue. I wonder if Fud and Harassment agents work by the hour or are they on salary. Or is B19 part of management at FltOps? We all have noticed that he refuses to answer questions about his current position... His silence on that speaks volumes!

Yet he spends a lot of time posting a bunch of garbage about a subject he knows nothing about. His sole aim is to discredit the Union pilots who dare to stand up to corporate greed and mismanagement. Those with a decent bone in their body are posting here to support the Options pilotgroup. The vultures on the board (luckily very few) are trying to pick apart the morale of pilots in an uphill battle.

Only a word-twisting fudspinner has a motive for hijacking the thread and turning attention away from the disgusting behavior of the FLOPS. It's suspicious, but not surprising, that B19 doesn't want to talk about the STUPID & SPINELESS Flight Options Management. Apparently he's on their side. His behavior on this thread certainly places him in the same category--SICKENINGLY SELFISH.

THE FLOPS AND THEIR UNION BUSTING LEECHES ARE WASTING THE MONEY THAT SHOULD GO TO PAY THE OPTIONS PILOTGROUP THE PROFESSIONAL WAGES THEY HAVE ALREADY EARNED.

 

[B19 Flyer]

We got our answer. Obviously, B19 is only posting here to spread his slimy FUD. He cares nothing about the pilots that were fired for bogus reasons.

I only care, that why I think unions are disgusting.

He shows complete disregard for the purpose of the thread, behaving like an obnoxious jackass. Many of us have him on ignore but still his lying rants continue.

What was lying about my statement? Does your husband or any union volunteer get 100% of Netjet benefits while only flying a partial schedule and recieving a stipend from the union to cover lost take home wages?

I wonder if Fud and Harassment agents work by the hour or are they on salary. Or is B19 part of management at FltOps? We all have noticed that he refuses to answer questions about his current position... His silence on that speaks volumes!

I've posted ad nauseum and truthfully about what I have done and accomplished throughout my aviation career. I stopped bothering to respond because everybody has their opinion.

Yet he spends a lot of time posting a bunch of garbage about a subject he knows nothing about.

NJW, you've never worked in the industry, drawn a paycheck or spent a moment protecting any pilot except as a cheerleader from the sideline. I don't have to prove anything to you, but it's laughable statement that you make.

His sole aim is to discredit the Union pilots who dare to stand up to corporate greed and mismanagement. Those with a decent bone in their body are posting here to support the Options pilotgroup. The vultures on the board (luckily very few) are trying to pick apart the morale of pilots in an uphill battle.

Not at all, the pilots that chose the union are getting exactly what they asked for. A couple of years ago I made the statement to be careful and don't just think a union is the answer. I feel bad for all the guys that lost jobs, like them when I lost mine as a direct result of union activity, I was upset too. I have empathy because I've experienced what they went through. You on the other hand, bailed out of AA and went to NJ. You think that the FLOPS pilots should hang in there and be solid to create a strong union, when you bailed out yourself. Sad.


Only a word-twisting fudspinner has a motive for hijacking the thread and turning attention away from the disgusting behavior of the FLOPS. It's suspicious, but not surprising, that B19 doesn't want to talk about the STUPID & SPINELESS Flight Options Management. Apparently he's on their side.

I'm on the side of all the employees, owners, managers and most of all the industry that is suffering right now because of the union intervention.


His behavior on this thread certainly places him in the same category--SICKENINGLY SELFISH.

Tell Mr. Buffett that. I think he would have a different opinion.


THE FLOPS AND THEIR UNION BUSTING LEECHES ARE WASTING THE MONEY THAT SHOULD GO TO PAY THE OPTIONS PILOTGROUP THE PROFESSIONAL WAGES THEY HAVE ALREADY EARNED.

Great quote from a pilot's wife. Classy.

When I started posting a couple of years ago, there are several themes that I have never waivered from:

Putting a union into an airline is ugly, dirty work, lots of people get hurt, many lose their jobs and there is nothing fair about it.

The process takes many years, creates mass turmoil and creates great divides amongst employees.

When economic times are tough, unions are incredibly slow in reacting. They will protect the top 2/3 of the seniority list and sacrifice the bottom third which is why those poor folks at Flight Options who lost thier jobs are toast. If the union wasn't on the property, my guess is that black Friday wouldn't have happened and that the pay issues wouldn't be as severe as they are now.

So, you never addressed my question.

What do you think Mr. Buffett's opinion would be of an employee that only produces half or less of what is expected of him while he's working for a union within the company and being compensated for lost wages?

Is Mr. Buffett also compensated for half the training, half the taxes, half the vacation pay, have the holiday pay etc. etc?

NJW, you don't understand basic business. You want to call me names, but when asked the tough questions that surround the industy, you can't answer them because you have no business background.

Mr. Buffett will go down in history as one of the sharpest investors of all time. I would think he would frown on the fact that your husband receives 100% of the training and benefits while only flying a partial schedule.

 

[Galaxy]

So you're saying buy American to support a union? So it must take a union to produce a quality product, right? The American auto industry is the worst example of labor unions bleeding a company dry to provide workers with high wages/benefits. "Let's pay someone $40/hr to put door handles on this piece of sh!t Chevy all day, then sell it for a loss." Great plan! Now the UAW is upset because GM is closing plants that make the gas guzzling Hummer and Tahoe. But it's not GM's fault that nobody's buying these monster machines, but it is thier fault they are so far behind the foreign carmakers in enginuity. Toyota and Honda are both non-union manufacturers and produce quality products and make a profit. It is possible, and they prove it. It's not my responsibility to support American workers, if the product they buld is crap, I won't buy it! I support companies that provide quality, so I guess its all Honda/Toyota for me, suckers!

Holy crap sandwiches! You have almost 100 posts and I finally agree with you on one.. Bravo....

 

[Galaxy]

Don't you know anything.....B19 will never answer questions unless it is " Are Unions good or Bad."
Even though he admitted to being on the board earlier of the review comm. He will never answer anything that might lead to who he is. Mostly due to he is not who he says he is....
He never answered the question on what his job title was both times he was laid off because of the union.

 

[fischman]

Way to support stuggling union workers (and their families) by buying a non-union built car from a foreign owned company.

Fred,

First of all, I love that skit on SNL.

Secondly, I have a very young family I have to be responsible for. We did our research and found the Odyssey to be the safest ride for our family. The front and side curtain airbags, DVD player, Nintendo hookup, wireless headset, XM radio, voice activated navigation system, braking system, engine, fuel economy, tire pressure monitoring system, heated mirrors, tri-zone voice activated climate control, and many other features help make it the least distracting ride out there. I have peace of mind my family is going to arrive alive in the Odyssey. For that reason it is worth every penny I paid for it.

If it makes you feel better, I also have a Pontiac Sunfire that was built by Union workers, and have had 2 Ford Mustangs, and a Ford Escape. When it comes to minivans, the American car makers are not in the same league as Honda. My decision was for my family.

 

[learflyer]

double post

 

[learflyer]

Does anyone (besides the posters) actually read each and every boring a$$ post in this thread line by line? You guys will do this for the rest of your careers and all of a sudden you'll have 30 years of nothing to show for it but bitterness. "The fight", "stand together", "FUD", "rising tide lifts all boats", SHEESH! No i'm not mgmt, yes I voted for the union at flops. But $hit, after several yrs of crap I'm at peace doing something else and have moved on. Just an observation. Alot of my friends including **** lost their jobs a couple weeks ago. Some of you MUST have other ideas you can do with your lives, no?

 

[netjetwife]

I'll share the info that I have to help answer LF's question. Those who are bored need not read...

Regarding my posts, my husband and I are both regularly told by pilots (who read but seldom post) that they enjoy them. (Thanks for the feedback, guys!) It sounds like they follow the posting here. I didn't ask how much they read as that is a personal choice.

LF's statement that others will only have bitterness to show for standing together and fighting back is way off-base. Things are much better at NJA now. Other frac pilots are also pleased by improvements in the industry. The Options pilots are negotiating for a badly needed contract. Their bitterness stems from management's mistreatment not their valid expectation that a rising tide would lift their boat. They've had to watch that happen over and over --twice each at NJA and CS. Didn't Flex get a raise, too? That's why they're bitter--not because they choose to fight for the industry standard. I'm glad they are. The FLOP's out of control race to the bottom has got to be stopped.

It seems LF's decision to move on from FltOps was a good one for him, but it doesn't mean that those who stayed behind could or would choose to do the same. Those who find posts "boring" can just quietly skip them. That would be a lot fairer than misapplying gloomy predictions and indirectly insulting those choosing to spend their time posting and/or reading here. As to LF's suggestion that you guys do something else with your lives career-wise, I think that's a personal decision best left to you and your family. I wish you all the best.

DL, you have my sympathy, shared disgust, and best wishes for a favorable outcome. Good Luck! NJW

 

[waka]

Does anyone (besides the posters) actually read each and every boring a$$ post in this thread line by line? You guys will do this for the rest of your careers and all of a sudden you'll have 30 years of nothing to show for it but bitterness. "The fight", "stand together", "FUD", "rising tide lifts all boats", SHEESH! No i'm not mgmt, yes I voted for the union at flops. But $hit, after several yrs of crap I'm at peace doing something else and have moved on. Just an observation. Alot of my friends including "Dimeline" lost their jobs a couple weeks ago. Some of you MUST have other ideas you can do with your lives, no?

As I told someone else....maybe it was you. Some of us choose to fight for what is right while others just lay back and take it. Sure, move on but, don't just let FLOPS management get away with anything they want. There is nothing wrong with looking to one's own future. However, that doesn't mean that you cannot participate in suing their evil asses in the mean time.

Quote for you;

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those *cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat."

Theodore Roosevelt

*underline added by me

 

[netjetwife]

Waka, excellent quote! Thanks for sharing it. Your words were good, too...

 

[learflyer]

As I told someone else....maybe it was you. Some of us choose to fight for what is right while others just lay back and take it. Sure, move on but, don't just let FLOPS management get away with anything they want. There is nothing wrong with looking to one's own future. However, that doesn't mean that you cannot participate in suing their evil asses in the mean time.

Quote for you;

*underline added by me

Sorry all. Next time I'll just turn the station. Flops drove me nuts. Sorry I took it out on my FI family! Should have worked out BEFORE I posted...:0

 

[netjetwife]

Now that's a nice post, LF! I particularly liked the phrase "FI family".
To me, being in an online community is the best part of posting here.
Regards,
NJW

 

[B19 Flyer]

Now that's a nice post, LF! I particularly liked the phrase "FI family".
To me, being in an online community is the best part of posting here.
Regards,
NJW

Thankfully that community has differing opinions.

I still wonder how fair it is that your husband (or any union "volunteer" for that matter) gets 100% of his benefits paid by NJ, yet only flies a partial schedule because he is conducting union business when he was hired as a flying pilot.

As you claim you are all about fairness in this community as you support the union way of life.

Please explain the fairness in that for Mr. Buffett?

It's funny how none of the union supporters will touch that one. I guess it hits too close to home, eh?

 

[cougar12]

Idiot!

 

[brokeflyer]

Thankfully that community has differing opinions.

I still wonder how fair it is that your husband (or any union "volunteer" for that matter) gets 100% of his benefits paid by NJ, yet only flies a partial schedule because he is conducting union business when he was hired as a flying pilot.

As you claim you are all about fairness in this community as you support the union way of life.

Please explain the fairness in that for Mr. Buffett?

It's funny how none of the union supporters will touch that one. I guess it hits too close to home, eh?

ill touch it....its because if it wasnt for the "union business" then managent types who couldnt cut it in the real world (like you) would $hit all over him. Then the only people who really suffer are his children.......who you don't care about.

this thread is now closed as well.....

cya