Miracle on the Hudson: brought to you by Union workers

[Crzipilot]

Along of all the good things that "ALPA" has done, In the past they should have put a clamp down on PFT programs (certain people here would not have the job they have) Should have never farmed out any Jet flying, or even Brand flying for that matter. If it says (insert company name here) on the ticket, then it sure as hell better be flown by pilots on that damn seniority list.

Anything else ALPA has done is eyewash compared to the utterly disgracefull lack of foresight that organization has had regarding the career of a Pilot. For the amount of money that has flowed into the coffers of that forsaken union, scratch that ASSOCIATION, it could very well and should have very well done a MUCH better job at being the custodian of our careers........

 

[CFIT]

I can't believe this is actually a contentious thread. Absolutely ridiculous. If all of you dissenters would get off of your collective ass and do something for your union instead of sitting around bitching about it all the time *cough*JoeyMerchant*cough*, then maybe you could improve some of the things that you perceive are wrong with your union.

I can't believe some total moron has the blatant stupidity to correlate union action to the act of correctly flying an aircraft in a dire situation and supporting the emergency action with just cause. This thread was started to ride the coat tails of a fortunete circumstance without merit, the fact that ALPA was flushed by USAPA speaks volumes of their peformance for the entire pilot community.

The passengers left "Sully's and crew" aircraft successfully.
The pilot's of USAIR left ALPA successfully.

But again, union aliance had zero effect on the out come of this action.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

I can't believe some total moron has the blatant stupidity to correlate union action to the act of correctly flying an aircraft in a dire situation and supporting the emergency action with just cause. This thread was started to ride the coat tails of a fortunete circumstance without merit, the fact that ALPA was flushed by USAPA speaks volumes of their peformance for the entire pilot community.

Um, not to disregard what you said, but the reason the Us Airways pilots left ALPA was to flush the Nicolau award. That and that alone!

The passengers left "Sully's and crew" aircraft successfully.

Agreed!

The pilot's of USAIR left ALPA successfully.

That remains to be seen. How many lawsuits against the new USAPA union?

But again, union aliance had zero effect on the out come of this action.

Agreed!

 

[CopilotDoug]

Um, not to disregard what you said, but the reason the Us Airways pilots left ALPA was to flush the Nicolau award. That and that alone!

Right...this horse hasn't been beaten to death. What a FRESH new approach

 

[PCL_128]

No...I have never held the highly coveted, ethereal position of a Union Officer. I'm out on the line...flying...not looking for an excuse to stay on the ground.

Those of us that are "looking for an excuse to stay on the ground" are the ones doing all of the work that keeps your career from from becoming a minimum wage job with 5 days off a month while you sit on your ass and complain without contributing anything to the cause.

These pilots thanked USAPA.

Correction: the copilot thanked uSAPa. I don't believe Captain Sullenburger has mentioned uSAPa once.

 

[PCL_128]

The pilot's of USAIR left ALPA successfully.

They were certainly successful at bailing out, but they haven't been successful at building a functioning union. Over 2,000 USAirways pilots still refuse to pay dues. Not a single representative has been elected from the West domiciles. uSAPa is a mess.

They'll be back in another year or so. Count on it.

 

[bubbers44]

All pilot unions are a mess. Name one that could stand up to management and go on strike this winter? Hopefully this will change some day. Remember what it was like 20+ years ago? Hopefully some day we will go back to what we had.

 

[CopilotDoug]

Those of us that are "looking for an excuse to stay on the ground" are the ones doing all of the work that keeps your career from from becoming a minimum wage job with 5 days off a month while you sit on your ass and complain without contributing anything to the cause.

The cause of what? Funding Worthless' and Prater's retirement pensions? Go give you're speech to the skywest pilots. It'd probably be easier if you got down from your cross, first.

Correction: the copilot thanked uSAPa. I don't believe Captain Sullenburger has mentioned uSAPa once.

Noted.

 

[Crzipilot]

They were certainly successful at bailing out, but they haven't been successful at building a functioning union. Over 2,000 USAirways pilots still refuse to pay dues. Not a single representative has been elected from the West domiciles. uSAPa is a mess.

They'll be back in another year or so. Count on it.

Actually your wrong on that. Seems that many west pilots are getting paid up and current. Maybe not joining but at least paying the fees.

Also PHX now has a Rep for the domicile, which will also oversee LAS. And guess what, It's a West pilot too. Soooooo it's moving...slowly, but moving....we'll see. Still better than alpa...

 

[Crzipilot]

Oh, and BTW, with your background. I personally feel you have no real position to talk regarding union solidarity or such. Don't care if you've repented or reformed, it just isn't right...

 

[Crzipilot]

Correction: the copilot thanked uSAPa. I don't believe Captain Sullenburger has mentioned uSAPa once.

Oh and BTW Mr. PFT. here's an excerpt from the Capt's letter to the pilots of US..

As pilots and as union members, we are part of a brotherhood. I want to thank USAPA and all of its committee members who protected me and my crew during this trying time. We also thank you, our fellow pilots, for your generous show of support.



I guess he hasn't thanked usapa yet huh?//? Seriously, don't talk where you don't know.

Were you sleeping with Woerthless or mayber Herr Prater???? Play cabin boy for them or something, There has to be some reason for the high hard one towards ALPA.....geeeze.. hump someone elses leg for awhile...

 

[JungleJett]

Oh, and BTW, with your background. I personally feel you have no real position to talk regarding union solidarity or such. Don't care if you've repented or reformed, it just isn't right...

What is his background?

 

[Crzipilot]

Let him answer that......doubt he will....

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

All pilot unions are a mess. Name one that could stand up to management and go on strike this winter? Hopefully this will change some day. Remember what it was like 20+ years ago? Hopefully some day we will go back to what we had.

20years ago? Let's see that was about when Lorenzo was screwing over Eastern which resulted in the Eastern MEC screaming at ALPA Nat'l to endorse Clinton because Bush Sr. loved sleeping with Lorezno....

Also, Pan Am was about finished and CAL was a mess...

Is this the same 20 years you are talking about?

Look, we can sit around and wish and wonder about 20 years ago,

OR we can think about what we want this profession to be in 20 years.... and work from here...

I choose the latter

What is his background?

When he was still a teenager he went to GIA. He is first generation airline pilot so he had no Airline Dad to tell what course to take...

He readily admits GIA was a poor move and now speaks out against it..... advising wanne be's to take another course.... given his age at the time and how he deals with it now..... is it really an issue? For some it is.... oh well....

We can talk about how GIA makes certian people miserable or we can work to make the profession better...

 

[bubbers44]

20+ years ago unions could go on strike. Things weren't great then but unions could use the only leverage they had and that was to strike. Now we can run full page ads and fly safe.

 

[Jet41]

A union has nothing to do with the outcome. Only the training and skill of those involved. The fact that the belonged to a union is not reliant.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

20+ years ago unions could go on strike. Things weren't great then but unions could use the only leverage they had and that was to strike. Now we can run full page ads and fly safe.

I think what you are trying to glorify is the regulation era... most likely the 1950s-1977. This was the highlight and golden age of the airline pilot profession.

The 80s, 90s and 2000s are quite a struggle with a few spikes or prosperity...

The problem is, most pilots are free market capitalist... we have gotten what we have asked for... the radical ups and downs of the free market...


In the end, what makes unions effective is not a small group of leaders working full time to make 75,000 pilots happy....

It is 75,000 pilots willing to invest some of their time at some level on improving the profession.

Simply put management and gov't know that apathy and individualism reign supreme with us pilots. They know how much and how far they can push our profession to be more like a skilled labor description...

Every now and then a Sully and Skiles comes along and we get caught up in euphoria, expecting our union leaders to cash in on the moment...

While 75,000 air line pilots go back to apathy, individualism and the blame game...

Until each pilot expects more of themselves we will cavitate in our mediocrcy.....

 

[CopilotDoug]

They were certainly successful at bailing out, but they haven't been successful at building a functioning union. Over 2,000 USAirways pilots still refuse to pay dues. Not a single representative has been elected from the West domiciles. uSAPa is a mess.

They'll be back in another year or so. Count on it.

Wow, it really eats you up inside knowing that your pilot brothers democratically chose to leave ALPA, doesn't it? Because we all know...ALPA was PERFECT immediately after it's inception. Give it time. The West guys, being the smart group of pilots they are, will have their say at the table.

 

[Crzipilot]

Rez, quite a shocking answer from you. The Hype /Blow up ALPA at every opportunity. If I didn't know better, I'd suspect your screen name was access by the main computers in HQ.

Considering the fact that there were many of us that were/are 1st generation pilots. Who came before Pcl, and were able to be smart enough to understand what PFT was bout, and the strings attached to it. That I'm sure when he went through there was enough information out on the net, for one to became aware of it. And in essence for you to turn a blind eye, at giving a @CaB 35k or so, to fly a B1900???? And from what I understand, a double weaseled nose individual as the owner of GIA. Guess again it's an ALPA thing, they will turn their eyes at stuff when it suits them....etc etc etc

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Rez, quite a shocking answer from you. The Hype /Blow up ALPA at every opportunity. If I didn't know better, I'd suspect your screen name was access by the main computers in HQ.

Considering the fact that there were many of us that were/are 1st generation pilots. Who came before Pcl, and were able to be smart enough to understand what PFT was bout, and the strings attached to it. That I'm sure when he went through there was enough information out on the net, for one to became aware of it. And in essence for you to turn a blind eye, at giving a @CaB 35k or so, to fly a B1900???? And from what I understand, a double weaseled nose individual as the owner of GIA. Guess again it's an ALPA thing, they will turn their eyes at stuff when it suits them....etc etc etc

Not a very valid reply....

GIA is a fast track... a business decision like the flight safety pay for training at so many regionals....

Many pilots have done it and you don't know who they are.... pilots continue to do it...

The point is, PCL did it, he regrets it, he speaks against it....

We all make mistakes, what we do afterwards and how we handle it is what is important....

Again, do you want to spin our collective wheels on GIA or do you want to work on making this a great profession again?