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Mesa TA passes

  • Thread starter Thread starter NoJoy
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We don't support you because you consistently stab us all in the back.

I don't work for Mesa anymore, but i still keep in touch with what is going on by friends i still have there...If i remember correctly , each airline negotiates contracts for themselves and not for other airlines.I don't remember seeing the names of Comair, ASA,ExpressJet etc ..on my contract when i was there. Define how they stab you in the back!
 
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Ok the contract is better, but not by much. Here are the negatives;

1 Ready (airport) reserve has no limits as to the amount of days per bid a person can sit. I could possibly sit 20 days a bid on airport reserve for 8, 10 or 12 hrs per shift.

2 Junior Assignment still exists with no limits.

3 No trip or duty rigs.

4 No pay increases; except for fo's.

5 IF PBS is cancelled, block or better and line guarantee can be taken away with a 45 day notice from the company
(WHAT A JOKE!!!!)

6 The min days off of 11 are actually a maximum, as the company has shown in the past.

Feel free to add anymore
 
We don't support you because you consistently stab us all in the back.
Again Doin........
Amen Brotha.....
Why do we bash Mesa..
Mesa pilots are brothers and sisters, but we have to ask why do they always screw other companies. If they don't have deep pockets, as they used to because their mgmt is always trying to screw over other companies.. hence Aloha.. Mesa lost the first law suit had to pay... They lost the 2nd and could possibly fly the Aloha flag and only have to pay 2 million?
This is why we are so upset at Mesa, as a pilot you do the same job we do. As a pilot group, we can't stand you for what your company stands for...
Does that SPLAIN IT LUCY!!!!
:uzi:
 
I don't work for Mesa anymore, but i still keep in touch with what is going on by friends i still have there...If i remember correctly , each airline negotiates contracts for themselves and not for other airlines.I don't remember seeing the names of Comair, ASA,ExpressJet etc ..on my contract when i was there. Define how they stab you in the back!

With all due respect, I think you fail to see the big picture, how one pilot group's actions affect all the others. Every pilot group's negotiations begin with one simple question: what is the rest of the industry paying recently? If it's a good number and getting better with each subsequently signed contract, the pilot group has a decent shot at getting improvements. If the number is low and getting lower, they're screwed. So every pilot has a responsibility to all the others to at least hold the line on industry average, for the good of both themselves and everyone else. To do otherwise is short-sighted and irresponsible.

I think all union pilots, especially those of us who haven't been happy with Mesa up to this point, would have stood firmly beside every Mesa pilot in demanding average compensation or better. We would have refused to fly struck work. We would have joined the picket lines with you. But you never gave us the chance.
 
With all due respect, I think you fail to see the big picture, how one pilot group's actions affect all the others. Every pilot group's negotiations begin with one simple question: what is the rest of the industry paying recently? If it's a good number and getting better with each subsequently signed contract, the pilot group has a decent shot at getting improvements. If the number is low and getting lower, they're screwed. So every pilot has a responsibility to all the others to at least hold the line on industry average, for the good of both themselves and everyone else. To do otherwise is short-sighted and irresponsible.

I think all union pilots, especially those of us who haven't been happy with Mesa up to this point, would have stood firmly beside every Mesa pilot in demanding average compensation or better. We would have refused to fly struck work. We would have joined the picket lines with you. But you never gave us the chance.

With all due respect
I totally disagree with the same answer you and the others always give in regards to Mesa and their contract.Like i have said before over and over , where are the FACTS to support your claims of Mesa's contract and how it affects other carriers?.Until i see the FACTS i take these claims as an insult even as a former Mesa guy , and totally disrespectful and unjustified .I hope you are not this unprofessional when in the cockpit whether it be jumpseating or flying the line.A very childish type behavior from someone who is looked at as a professional.Mesa may not have the "industry leading" contract but they are the most professional group of people to fly with.I have no more to say on this since it is and will always be a dead horse that is still being beatin to death over and over thousands of times and the answers never change.I will say that most people posting on FI in the regional section are the most unprofessional sounding and disrespectful individuals i have ever come across.All good things come to an end eventually so enjoy your cushy little "mainline "contract because i'm sure it won't last.
 
With all due respect
I totally disagree with the same answer you and the others always give in regards to Mesa and their contract.Like i have said before over and over , where are the FACTS to support your claims of Mesa's contract and how it affects other carriers?.Until i see the FACTS i take these claims as an insult even as a former Mesa guy , and totally disrespectful and unjustified .I hope you are not this unprofessional when in the cockpit whether it be jumpseating or flying the line.A very childish type behavior from someone who is looked at as a professional.Mesa may not have the "industry leading" contract but they are the most professional group of people to fly with.I have no more to say on this since it is and will always be a dead horse that is still being beatin to death over and over thousands of times and the answers never change.I will say that most people posting on FI in the regional section are the most unprofessional sounding and disrespectful individuals i have ever come across.All good things come to an end eventually so enjoy your cushy little "mainline "contract because i'm sure it won't last.

Amen! Amen!
 
All good things come to an end eventually so enjoy your cushy little "mainline "contract because i'm sure it won't last.

The Mesa pilots are doing everything they can to ensure that respectable working conditions and pay won't last in this profession.
 
With all due respect
I totally disagree with the same answer you and the others always give in regards to Mesa and their contract.Like i have said before over and over , where are the FACTS to support your claims of Mesa's contract and how it affects other carriers?.Until i see the FACTS i take these claims as an insult even as a former Mesa guy , and totally disrespectful and unjustified .I hope you are not this unprofessional when in the cockpit whether it be jumpseating or flying the line.A very childish type behavior from someone who is looked at as a professional.Mesa may not have the "industry leading" contract but they are the most professional group of people to fly with.I have no more to say on this since it is and will always be a dead horse that is still being beatin to death over and over thousands of times and the answers never change.I will say that most people posting on FI in the regional section are the most unprofessional sounding and disrespectful individuals i have ever come across.All good things come to an end eventually so enjoy your cushy little "mainline "contract because i'm sure it won't last.

With absolutely no respect (you deserve none),
Are you truly so ignorant as to think you exist in a vacuum? I mean are you really that dumb. Do you really believe your blather?

Those cushy contracts already have come to an end thanks to you and yours. People on this forum are often unprofessional and disrespectful. That said, others on here are so utterly devoid of intelligence they deserve no respect. Yes, I am referring to you.

I almost feel like I am picking on a retard. Your inability to grasp simple concepts like cause and effect are mind-boggling. What facts are you requesting? What would you do with them? Perhaps put them in your mouth like some infant crawling around on the ground that found something shiny?

At AWACS contract talks several years ago (this is probably before your time, back while the best part of you was running down the crack of your mothers @$$), the mesa contract was thrown on the table from management. The negotiators were informed that this was what they had to compete with. FACT...
 
With absolutely no respect (you deserve none),
Are you truly so ignorant as to think you exist in a vacuum? I mean are you really that dumb. Do you really believe your blather?

Those cushy contracts already have come to an end thanks to you and yours. People on this forum are often unprofessional and disrespectful. That said, others on here are so utterly devoid of intelligence they deserve no respect. Yes, I am referring to you.

I almost feel like I am picking on a retard. Your inability to grasp simple concepts like cause and effect are mind-boggling. What facts are you requesting? What would you do with them? Perhaps put them in your mouth like some infant crawling around on the ground that found something shiny?

At AWACS contract talks several years ago (this is probably before your time, back while the best part of you was running down the crack of your mothers @$$), the mesa contract was thrown on the table from management. The negotiators were informed that this was what they had to compete with. FACT...

Feel better now?
 
Ok who do you work for?


50 seat rates were not negotiated because 50 seats will be GONE very shortly. Why waste negotiating capital on pay rates that will soon be obsolete.

Block or better. What other airline beside air whisky that has our BorB? If u was awarded an 80hr line and all of it was cancelled and only had one 1 hour flight left and it took 2 hours to complete. I will get paid for 81hrs that bid


its tied to PBS because of the practices of past MECs who tried to leverage PBS against the company. It would be suicide for the company to drop PBS. Plus it gives us an out if PBS as well.
Everyone has your block or better. God even skyway had that
 
With all due respect
I totally disagree with the same answer you and the others always give in regards to Mesa and their contract.Like i have said before over and over , where are the FACTS to support your claims of Mesa's contract and how it affects other carriers?.Until i see the FACTS i take these claims as an insult even as a former Mesa guy , and totally disrespectful and unjustified .I hope you are not this unprofessional when in the cockpit whether it be jumpseating or flying the line.A very childish type behavior from someone who is looked at as a professional.Mesa may not have the "industry leading" contract but they are the most professional group of people to fly with.I have no more to say on this since it is and will always be a dead horse that is still being beatin to death over and over thousands of times and the answers never change.I will say that most people posting on FI in the regional section are the most unprofessional sounding and disrespectful individuals i have ever come across.All good things come to an end eventually so enjoy your cushy little "mainline "contract because i'm sure it won't last.

When Delta brought comair into Bankruptcy our new bankruptcy contract was based off of the DCI average. They put graphs in our roadshow packages showing each DCI carrier and then the average line (our new pay rates). Comair and ASA at the top on every payscale and Mesa at the bottom of every pay scale. Your terrible pay scales forced the average down and thus our pay down. Our per diem was cut to DCI average. Our days off per month were cut from 12 to 11 to more align us with DCI average.

Do you get the picture? We were forced to DCI AVERAGE. By being the bottom of every payscale and work rule you directly effected our current contract. If you guys would have at least brought yours up to an industry standard contract the DCI average would have been forced up. Then next time a DCI carrier is in negotiations and the company wants DCI average it would've been higher.

How much harder do you think you just made it for the pinnacle guys. They were shooting for a contract similar to ASA payscales. Now thier management will look at them and laugh throw your brand new piece of ******************** on the table and say if its good enough for them thats all your getting.
 
When Delta brought comair into Bankruptcy our new bankruptcy contract was based off of the DCI average. They put graphs in our roadshow packages showing each DCI carrier and then the average line (our new pay rates). Comair and ASA at the top on every payscale and Mesa at the bottom of every pay scale. Your terrible pay scales forced the average down and thus our pay down. Our per diem was cut to DCI average. Our days off per month were cut from 12 to 11 to more align us with DCI average.

Do you get the picture? We were forced to DCI AVERAGE. By being the bottom of every payscale and work rule you directly effected our current contract. If you guys would have at least brought yours up to an industry standard contract the DCI average would have been forced up. Then next time a DCI carrier is in negotiations and the company wants DCI average it would've been higher.

How much harder do you think you just made it for the pinnacle guys. They were shooting for a contract similar to ASA payscales. Now thier management will look at them and laugh throw your brand new piece of ******************** on the table and say if its good enough for them thats all your getting.

Let me ask you this..Did Comair management try to start an alter ego carrier and try to whipsaw the two pilot groups against each other?Mesa management was literally steal flying from the ALPA carrier ie..Mesa and giving it to the alter ego Freedom and not pay protecting the Mesa guys after they showed up and found out their flight was "cancelled" and given to a Freedom 700 or 900.And there was literally a fist fight between a Mesa guy and Freedom guy on the ramp in PHX because of this.In turn we had a gun to our head which was Freedom and JO was literally stealing the flying Mesa and giving it to Freedom more and more every bid, so in turn we had to stop it by capturing the scope and stopping Freedom.In turn we got nothing else, if that did not happen you have seen Mesa Airlines name changed to Freedom Airlines and being operated by an alter ego carrier, so which would you choose when it came to signing an ALPA contract?Being forced to sign basically the same contract or lose your flying or possibly your job to an alter ego carrier? Ask TSA how GOJets is working for them ..I'm sure you would say leave Mesa and that is a respectful answer but that's not what i'm trying to get at.As far as the new TA, I do not know much about it except they are starting to raise the bar a little bit, but it comes time to go back to the table in 21 months or whatever it is and if other regionals are also back at the table at the same time they should support each other in trying to get what they deserve, I guarantee Mesa guys will have alot more negotiating leverage next time.If other regionals keep kicking the dog (Mesa pilots) they will not come out from under the porch and fight..Maybe a few might..My point is stop kicking the dog, especially now with the economy being a disaster and the massive layoffs of every industry.Read the article about the Big 3 auto makers that may not get the loan or bailout money due to their unions not willing to take paycuts, so they are basically saying burn it down we don't care.The constant beating the Mesa guys take because of the contract they have or had unfortunately has resulted in bad timing, meaning last time was Freedom and this time is the economy.You say your days off went from 12 to 11 BFD..How would you like it if your contract read no less than 8 days off per bid period(Rsv).This is an actual example of the old contract Mesa had.Did you catch the conditional language "no less than" it didn't say that you would only get 8 days off it just said "no less than".Conditional language in an industry leading contract(not talking about pay rates) can turn it into a crappy contract real quick when you have words such as ...shall,may,to the extent possible,a minimum of, etc...I will bet if you had conditional words in your contract your management would also take it and run with it and when you get pissed off about it, the company will say too bad you should have negotiated that in the contract.
 
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Well lets talk pay rates...

Compare our 900 CA rates to SKW 900 CA pay rates... Mesas and SKW rates are neck and neck up o about a 10 year CA.

Now do the same for Comair. Compare their 700 rates to Mesas 700 rates. 1$ difference. Comair doesn't have 100% cancellation pay

Air whiskey only has CRJ200s no 900 CA pay rates...We know how profitable those -200s are....:rolleyes:

Compare Mesas CA 900 rates to Mesabas(Dointime)... our 900 pays more.

Compare our 900 CA rates to Pinnacles...Neck n' neck...

70 seat and 90 seat aircraft are hear to stay. 50 seaters are on their way out(Sad to say). Why waste capital on equipment that will be phases out?

What I'm getting at is our CA pay rates for equipment that matter are indeed industry standard. The 50 market is going down the tubes. I fly a 50 seater but I understand times are changing. No,we did get the pay rates needed for FOs off the bat.No, But that gives us something to shoot for in 21 months. We made significant gains in this TA. Block or better(on top of line Guarantee), 100% cancellation pay, SAP(schedule adjustment period), PBS w/ ALPA input, industry leading hold back pay, and hard language from the "Harris Award". For anyone to say we lowered the bar is complete ignorance....Ignorance
 

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