Mesa TA passes

[samballs]

Ok who do you work for?


50 seat rates were not negotiated because 50 seats will be GONE very shortly. Why waste negotiating capital on pay rates that will soon be obsolete.

Block or better. What other airline beside air whisky that has our BorB? If u was awarded an 80hr line and all of it was cancelled and only had one 1 hour flight left and it took 2 hours to complete. I will get paid for 81hrs that bid


its tied to PBS because of the practices of past MECs who tried to leverage PBS against the company. It would be suicide for the company to drop PBS. Plus it gives us an out if PBS as well.

Everyone has your block or better. God even skyway had that

 

[Fltlvls]

Everyone has your block or better. God even skyway had that

Key words..Skyway HAD that ...Now Mesa HAS that.

 

[RiddleEagle18]

With all due respect
I totally disagree with the same answer you and the others always give in regards to Mesa and their contract.Like i have said before over and over , where are the FACTS to support your claims of Mesa's contract and how it affects other carriers?.Until i see the FACTS i take these claims as an insult even as a former Mesa guy , and totally disrespectful and unjustified .I hope you are not this unprofessional when in the cockpit whether it be jumpseating or flying the line.A very childish type behavior from someone who is looked at as a professional.Mesa may not have the "industry leading" contract but they are the most professional group of people to fly with.I have no more to say on this since it is and will always be a dead horse that is still being beatin to death over and over thousands of times and the answers never change.I will say that most people posting on FI in the regional section are the most unprofessional sounding and disrespectful individuals i have ever come across.All good things come to an end eventually so enjoy your cushy little "mainline "contract because i'm sure it won't last.

When Delta brought comair into Bankruptcy our new bankruptcy contract was based off of the DCI average. They put graphs in our roadshow packages showing each DCI carrier and then the average line (our new pay rates). Comair and ASA at the top on every payscale and Mesa at the bottom of every pay scale. Your terrible pay scales forced the average down and thus our pay down. Our per diem was cut to DCI average. Our days off per month were cut from 12 to 11 to more align us with DCI average.

Do you get the picture? We were forced to DCI AVERAGE. By being the bottom of every payscale and work rule you directly effected our current contract. If you guys would have at least brought yours up to an industry standard contract the DCI average would have been forced up. Then next time a DCI carrier is in negotiations and the company wants DCI average it would've been higher.

How much harder do you think you just made it for the pinnacle guys. They were shooting for a contract similar to ASA payscales. Now thier management will look at them and laugh throw your brand new piece of ******************** on the table and say if its good enough for them thats all your getting.

 

[Fltlvls]

When Delta brought comair into Bankruptcy our new bankruptcy contract was based off of the DCI average. They put graphs in our roadshow packages showing each DCI carrier and then the average line (our new pay rates). Comair and ASA at the top on every payscale and Mesa at the bottom of every pay scale. Your terrible pay scales forced the average down and thus our pay down. Our per diem was cut to DCI average. Our days off per month were cut from 12 to 11 to more align us with DCI average.

Do you get the picture? We were forced to DCI AVERAGE. By being the bottom of every payscale and work rule you directly effected our current contract. If you guys would have at least brought yours up to an industry standard contract the DCI average would have been forced up. Then next time a DCI carrier is in negotiations and the company wants DCI average it would've been higher.

How much harder do you think you just made it for the pinnacle guys. They were shooting for a contract similar to ASA payscales. Now thier management will look at them and laugh throw your brand new piece of ******************** on the table and say if its good enough for them thats all your getting.

Let me ask you this..Did Comair management try to start an alter ego carrier and try to whipsaw the two pilot groups against each other?Mesa management was literally steal flying from the ALPA carrier ie..Mesa and giving it to the alter ego Freedom and not pay protecting the Mesa guys after they showed up and found out their flight was "cancelled" and given to a Freedom 700 or 900.And there was literally a fist fight between a Mesa guy and Freedom guy on the ramp in PHX because of this.In turn we had a gun to our head which was Freedom and JO was literally stealing the flying Mesa and giving it to Freedom more and more every bid, so in turn we had to stop it by capturing the scope and stopping Freedom.In turn we got nothing else, if that did not happen you have seen Mesa Airlines name changed to Freedom Airlines and being operated by an alter ego carrier, so which would you choose when it came to signing an ALPA contract?Being forced to sign basically the same contract or lose your flying or possibly your job to an alter ego carrier? Ask TSA how GOJets is working for them ..I'm sure you would say leave Mesa and that is a respectful answer but that's not what i'm trying to get at.As far as the new TA, I do not know much about it except they are starting to raise the bar a little bit, but it comes time to go back to the table in 21 months or whatever it is and if other regionals are also back at the table at the same time they should support each other in trying to get what they deserve, I guarantee Mesa guys will have alot more negotiating leverage next time.If other regionals keep kicking the dog (Mesa pilots) they will not come out from under the porch and fight..Maybe a few might..My point is stop kicking the dog, especially now with the economy being a disaster and the massive layoffs of every industry.Read the article about the Big 3 auto makers that may not get the loan or bailout money due to their unions not willing to take paycuts, so they are basically saying burn it down we don't care.The constant beating the Mesa guys take because of the contract they have or had unfortunately has resulted in bad timing, meaning last time was Freedom and this time is the economy.You say your days off went from 12 to 11 BFD..How would you like it if your contract read no less than 8 days off per bid period(Rsv).This is an actual example of the old contract Mesa had.Did you catch the conditional language "no less than" it didn't say that you would only get 8 days off it just said "no less than".Conditional language in an industry leading contract(not talking about pay rates) can turn it into a crappy contract real quick when you have words such as ...shall,may,to the extent possible,a minimum of, etc...I will bet if you had conditional words in your contract your management would also take it and run with it and when you get pissed off about it, the company will say too bad you should have negotiated that in the contract.

 

[pdub20s]

Well lets talk pay rates...

Compare our 900 CA rates to SKW 900 CA pay rates... Mesas and SKW rates are neck and neck up o about a 10 year CA.

Now do the same for Comair. Compare their 700 rates to Mesas 700 rates. 1$ difference. Comair doesn't have 100% cancellation pay

Air whiskey only has CRJ200s no 900 CA pay rates...We know how profitable those -200s are....

Compare Mesas CA 900 rates to Mesabas(Dointime)... our 900 pays more.

Compare our 900 CA rates to Pinnacles...Neck n' neck...

70 seat and 90 seat aircraft are hear to stay. 50 seaters are on their way out(Sad to say). Why waste capital on equipment that will be phases out?

What I'm getting at is our CA pay rates for equipment that matter are indeed industry standard. The 50 market is going down the tubes. I fly a 50 seater but I understand times are changing. No,we did get the pay rates needed for FOs off the bat.No, But that gives us something to shoot for in 21 months. We made significant gains in this TA. Block or better(on top of line Guarantee), 100% cancellation pay, SAP(schedule adjustment period), PBS w/ ALPA input, industry leading hold back pay, and hard language from the "Harris Award". For anyone to say we lowered the bar is complete ignorance....Ignorance

 

[DoinTime]

Compare Mesas CA 900 rates to Mesabas(Dointime)... our 900 pays more.

Lets compare 76 seat CA rates (Mesaba does not have a CRJ-900 or 90-seat rate):

MESA Mesaba
$57.16 $60.99
$58.89 $62.83
$60.67 $64.71
$62.52 $66.65
$64.39 $68.64
$66.33 $70.71
$68.30 $72.83
$70.35 $75.02
$72.46 $77.27
$74.64 $79.59
$76.88 $81.97
$79.19 $84.43
$81.56 $86.97
$84.01 $89.56
$86.54 $92.25
$87.92 $93.84
$89.33 $95.45
$90.75 $97.09
$92.20 $97.19
$93.76 $97.26

You guys aren't even close to Mesaba's bankruptcy contract rates.

Compare our 900 CA rates to Pinnacles...Neck n' neck...

Lets compare those 76 seat numbers again (Pinnacle does not have a CRJ-900 or 90-seat rate):

Mesa Pinnacle
$57.16 $61.27
$58.89 $63.10
$60.67 $65.73
$62.52 $67.70
$64.39 $69.20
$66.33 $71.31
$68.30 $73.32
$70.35 $75.69
$72.46 $78.10
$74.64 $80.73
$76.88 $83.19
$79.19 $85.19
$81.56 $88.35
$84.01 $91.10
$86.54 $93.62
$87.92 $95.72
$89.33 $97.67
$90.75 $99.69
$92.20 $99.69
$93.76 $99.69

These numbers speak for themselves but the reason they are as low as they are is because the arbitrator that set these rates used the bottom barrel Mesa rates in his calculation.

Its sad that people like you try to justify your inadequacies by spinning numbers and falsifying data in the hopes others won't know the truth.

industry leading hold back pay

The reason you even need hold back pay is because your contract allows out of seniority upgrades. Nobody else needs hold back pay because we mandate upgrades in strict seniority order.

 

[OPECJet]

Well lets talk pay rates...

Compare our 900 CA rates to SKW 900 CA pay rates... Mesas and SKW rates are neck and neck up o about a 10 year CA.

Now do the same for Comair. Compare their 700 rates to Mesas 700 rates. 1$ difference. Comair doesn't have 100% cancellation pay

Air whiskey only has CRJ200s no 900 CA pay rates...We know how profitable those -200s are....

Compare Mesas CA 900 rates to Mesabas(Dointime)... our 900 pays more.

Compare our 900 CA rates to Pinnacles...Neck n' neck...

70 seat and 90 seat aircraft are hear to stay. 50 seaters are on their way out(Sad to say). Why waste capital on equipment that will be phases out?

What I'm getting at is our CA pay rates for equipment that matter are indeed industry standard. The 50 market is going down the tubes. I fly a 50 seater but I understand times are changing. No,we did get the pay rates needed for FOs off the bat.No, But that gives us something to shoot for in 21 months. We made significant gains in this TA. Block or better(on top of line Guarantee), 100% cancellation pay, SAP(schedule adjustment period), PBS w/ ALPA input, industry leading hold back pay, and hard language from the "Harris Award". For anyone to say we lowered the bar is complete ignorance....Ignorance

PDubs.... Pinnacle is flying 900s under arbitrator imposed payrates that used an average payrate for that aircraft. Guess who's crap payrates were used in that calculation. Comair's rates were already explained to you. Mesaba rates... once again... bankruptcy rates. OK, so you're neck and neck with Skywest.... Woo freakin' hoo!

I'm glad to see you got good work rule improvements. I can understand buying off on them, then going back to the table in 21 months. Considering your company's financial position, that's good thinking.

Now... Your Mesa cheerleading is getting a little old. There are some good guys flying there, but all in all, your entire operation sucks. Most of us with a few grey hairs, you know, the ones who were out flying while you were in middle school, jerking off to the instruction booklet you found in your mom's box of tampons. We figured this out ages ago, and are a bit concerned you're still wearing a skirt and waving Mesa pom poms. Give it a rest kid, and go get 'em in two years if Johnny O hasn't run that toilet of an airline out of business.

 

[Fltlvls]

The reason you even need hold back pay is because your contract allows out of seniority upgrades. Nobody else needs hold back pay because we mandate upgrades in strict seniority order.[/quote]

Too bad your mandated seniority based upgrades are not what Pan Am had back in the day..When your number came up for upgrade you either took it or they fired your A$$.

 

[Fltlvls]

PDubs.... Pinnacle is flying 900s under arbitrator imposed payrates that used an average payrate for that aircraft. Guess who's crap payrates were used in that calculation. Comair's rates were already explained to you. Mesaba rates... once again... bankruptcy rates. OK, so you're neck and neck with Skywest.... Woo freakin' hoo!

I'm glad to see you got good work rule improvements. I can understand buying off on them, then going back to the table in 21 months. Considering your company's financial position, that's good thinking.

Now... Your Mesa cheerleading is getting a little old. There are some good guys flying there, but all in all, your entire operation sucks. Most of us with a few grey hairs, you know, the ones who were out flying while you were in middle school, jerking off to the instruction booklet you found in your mom's box of tampons. We figured this out ages ago, and are a bit concerned you're still wearing a skirt and waving Mesa pom poms. Give it a rest kid, and go get 'em in two years if Johnny O hasn't run that toilet of an airline out of business.

Another industry leader heard from. GREAT!I thought Mesa was below average, if so then how could those numbers be average Mesa payscales grandpa.

 

[rightseatjocky]

I just wonder, if Mesa is so awesome, why does Delta mgmt hate them so much? Why did Mesa lose their Orlando flying to ASA? Why is Mesa mgmt sucking the life out of their company?
I will tell you......... THEY SUCK!!!!!
uke: