Major Airline vs NetJets

[Daveflier]

Daveflier,

LOA 19 of the CBA addresses the "true-up" and catchups (which aren't included in the 50% match). You lose a little interest with the true-up plan; but a 50% match, even in the current incarnation, is still one of the best deals around for a 401K. No matter who I tell about our plan, pilot or not, they are amazed at it! Still in indoc, but sure am happy to be here!

Cheers,
265

I am in total agreement with you. The NJA 401K is excellent. I also very much appreciate the work of Flylow22 who dedicates his time as a union volunteer. As a long time former ALPA member-I can affirm that ALPA cannot match IBT 1108!!

 

[WillFlyFoCookie]

This has been a very informative thread! I'd like to just get back to the Majors vs. NetJets aspect though. I work for NetJets and have worked for a Regional prior to this. I think when it comes to compensation and benefits there is really no question that NJA is better. That's one of the big reasons I came here. But when it comes to comparing to Majors, I don't see NetJets getting quite there. For one thing, there will never ever be an Ultra Captain anywhere that makes $250K. Another thing that I think a lot of people at NetJets forget about is FO pay. This is natural because most guys here are in fact Captains that got the big pay increases with the contract and get the 20% raises for a few years around year 5. FO pay starts at "OK" and pretty much stays there. There's just no contest compared to what an FO makes at say SWA. Also guys being in the FO position at NetJets are going to be there much longer then the Captains before them. Not many are leaving off the top and upgrades are relatively few especially when you consider that most are Captains just switching equipment. I'm not complaining but that's just the way things are now and for a while into the future.

Is NetJets a career place? I think so or I wouldn't be there. Does the compensation at NetJets surpass or equal the Majors now or in the future? I don't think so. Is that necessarily a bad thing? No. Most people can make a decent living here. Do I think the NJA pilots deserve more in the future? Of course I do, and we should if our hard work is continuing to allow the company to make money like it is now.

I wouldn't discourage anyone from trying to work for NetJets. I just wanted to add my two pennies.

Thanks

 

[Twotter76]

For one thing, there will never ever be an Ultra Captain anywhere that makes $250K.

Actually my friend I just flew a tour with one. Now I will grant you he was working my a$$ off but it IS possible. For comparision a 12 year SWA Captain makes $189 an hour and presuming a 78 guarantee (I know this isnt how their system works) then you are looking at a base salary of $174,906. Compared to a 12 year NJA guy on reserve in a Cat 3 aircraft their base is $134,608. Now change that to a class 4 (yes I know there aren't many but hopefully we'll get more) and assume they have 4 years in program now we are talking about $159,050. Really the difference isn't that much.

No one will argue that SWA, UPS, and Fedex have higher monetary compensation but I would put our QOL against theirs any day. How much is that worth to you? Throw in the fact that we don't have to worry (nearly as much) about age 65, cabotage, sabotage, or price wars and I think its pretty dang close between us and them. Now if we could just get into CASS it would be perfect...

 

[theskyking]

Actually my friend I just flew a tour with one. Now I will grant you he was working my a$$ off but it IS possible.

Good for him if he's making that coin and it's not even his a$$ that he's working off.

 

[sweptwingz]

Yet Another Reason as to why people no longer ride the airlines

http://cbs2.com/national/topstories_story_046063757.html

 

[Twotter76]

Good for him if he's making that coin and it's not even his a$$ that he's working off.

And herein people lies the perils of the public educational system. I R Pylot! Doh!

 

[TurboJetCpt]

Thanks for the info guys. Speaking only about retirement, at CAL, the company will contribute 12.75% of your salary(effective this summer). What NJ contributes is good, don't get me wrong, but in year two pay at CAL, the company will contribute more to your retirement (yr two is about 8000) than NJ ever will (Per year contribution) and over a 30 year career, these amounts are significantly different. After upgrade, CAL's contribution would be 20,000+ per year. So I think this is the main reason a person would make this move.

Yeah, we'll see how long THAT lasts...just check out this link for the real story. NJA pays more than the majors....just the facts.

www.airlinepilotcentral.com

 

[SteelerMan]

I guess I'm done trying to post information to help people out, getting idiotic responses like this. Apparently the information I have posted to try and help someone with their career decision concerning retirement is not the "real story" so maybe you could tell us exactly what is the real story and what was incorrect about what I posted.

 

[canadflyau]

Question:

I know 100% of SWA 12 yr capts are guaranteed a min of $174,906. What percentage of the Capts at NJA are Cat 3 or higher currently? What about with future plans (orders?)

Thanks

 

[FLYLOW22]

Question:

I know 100% of SWA 12 yr capts are guaranteed a min of $174,906. What percentage of the Capts at NJA are Cat 3 or higher currently? What about with future plans (orders?)

Thanks

Many variables there...

Right now, most fleets are Class 1-3 and RTS knew it. Further, the way a Class is determined is a bit... slanted. No worries. We accomplished much last time. There are more CBAs in front of us. Many more.

 

[Twotter76]

I would think that CURRENTLY anyone on property who has been here 12 years should be able to easily hold a cat 3 airframe, if not cat 4. Now 5 years from now that may not necessarily be the case due to rapid growth over the last few years and the lack of attrition (hint: this is because our job doesn't suck). A quick glance at the seniority list shows the most junior PIC on cat 3 pay appears to be a G-200 driver with a 1/03 DOH. Most junior cat 4 PIC looks to be a 9/97 hire. Not sure about a percentage breakdown

 

[Cavpilot]

Question:

I know 100% of SWA 12 yr capts are guaranteed a min of $174,906. What percentage of the Capts at NJA are Cat 3 or higher currently? What about with future plans (orders?)

Thanks

First, let me answer your question directly. If you are a 12 guy at NJA, your seniority number would be less than 65 and you are in Cat 4 territory. As a cat 4 PIC, assuming 2 years in the program, your base pay would be about $125,000 or $150,000 depending on schedule. Realistically you could plan on another $15,000 to $20,000 in overtime, extended days, etc.. That is the here and now.

Second, What the future holds for those of us hired during the boom of six years ago and later is totally different. I am currently in approxiamately the top third of the seniority list. I have no expectations of ever making cat 4 PIC pay. There are too many guys in front of me. That's all right though, because my W2 wages are more than 7 and 7 cat 4 base.

Third, I echo what Twotter76 has to say. I too will put NetJets QOL up against any airline, anytime. There are so many positive intangibles here that you would have to experience them yourself. I don't have the words to explain.

Lastly, this job is NOT for everybody. I love my job, but not everyone is down with this type of flying. To me, not knowing where I will be RONing from one night to the next is exciting. To others it is frustrating. Different strokes for different folks.

Even after the enormous growth we have had in the last 7 years, I still think that NetJets is the best kept secret in aviation.

 

[jonjuan]

Many variables there...

Right now, most fleets are Class 1-3 and RTS knew it. Further, the way a Class is determined is a bit... slanted. No worries. We accomplished much last time. There are more CBAs in front of us. Many more.

LOL....

 

[skiandsurf]

Lastly, this job is NOT for everybody. I love my job, but not everyone is down with this type of flying. To me, not knowing where I will be RONing from one night to the next is exciting. To others it is frustrating. Different strokes for different folks.

Even after the enormous growth we have had in the last 7 years, I still think that NetJets is the best kept secret in aviation.

This is very true. I am very happy at NJs. Some days are very tough, while others are easy. I just came off of my 7 day vacation (it was really 21 days). Then I was flying a trip that was a transcon everyday for the first 4 days. Then we are flying into Manzinillo, MX and over to Cabo for the overnight. Doing all of the little stuff isnt hard, it just makes some days long. Dealing with the 1-6 customers is fun for the most part.

I am not going back to the airlines.

 

[acaTerry]

Sorry, I'm a Democrat.

I can forgive the math, but not the being a democrat