Logging PIC time w a Frac

transpac

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Lord Wakefield said:
I haven't seen the SWA app in a while (can't afford a U.S. ATPL 737 type after piling up the debt here in anticipation of Kicka$$ pay) but that doesn't make sense as an instructor meets the part 1 definition.

Not necessarily. The instructor may or may not be the FAR 1 PIC.
 

Lord Wakefield

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I suppose if he's the safety pilot, which raises the question: Can you log SIC in a 172?
 

Lord Wakefield

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I suppose if he's the safety pilot, which raises the question: Can you log SIC in a 172?
 

FracCapt

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WMUSIGPI said:
so according to SWA all those hundreds of hours sitting in the right seat of (take your pick airplane) flight instructing I can't count as PIC and in fact all of the time instructing pre private or pre multi students noone could log that time as PIC???

A CFI is fully qualified to be PIC, AND in the eyes of the FAA they are ultimately responsible for the flight. If you want to talk semantics, then remember the key word RESPONSIBLE. The person that is designated as SIC is not ultimately RESPONSIBLE for the flight....therefore, they are not PIC. They may be able to LOG PIC, but they are NOT PIC. Get it now? Clear as mud?
 

transpac

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FracCapt said:
A CFI is fully qualified to be PIC, AND in the eyes of the FAA they are ultimately responsible for the flight. If you want to talk semantics, then remember the key word RESPONSIBLE. The person that is designated as SIC is not ultimately RESPONSIBLE for the flight....therefore, they are not PIC. They may be able to LOG PIC, but they are NOT PIC. Get it now? Clear as mud?

Shift that paradigm a tad, please. Please quote the regulation that makes a CFI responsible for a flight. There are many active CFIs without medical certificates and flight reviews who can't legally be the PIC. Such a CFI is not responsible for anything other than the quality of instruction. Nevertheless, 61.51 states that he/she can log all flight instruction given as PIC time.
 

dogg

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Why not use your log book as a journal? Log everything that you fly....left seat, right seat, safety pilot sic, pic, x-country, night, ifr, approaches, etc...... but.... make sure that you keep seperate columns....And when you apply to an airline, ask the recruiting people for their definition of PIC, TOTAL TIME, TURBINE etc....every airline is different...and the HR department does not use the FAR's as a guide when they come up with their list of requirements. To some, pilot in command is defined as "captain time" and to others they use FAR 1/61. Also while you are checking with them about requirements, find out what the mean by a college degree. There is a large difference there as well. To some, you have to have physically attended a college and to others you can do it all through correspondence......and the place for these answers is not flight info . Go straight to the source, get the answers and plan accordingly.......
 

CRAWDADDY

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dogg said:
Why not use your log book as a journal? Log everything that you fly....left seat, right seat, safety pilot sic, pic, x-country, night, ifr, approaches, etc...... but.... make sure that you keep seperate columns....And when you apply to an airline, ask the recruiting people for their definition of PIC, TOTAL TIME, TURBINE etc....every airline is different...and the HR department does not use the FAR's as a guide when they come up with their list of requirements. To some, pilot in command is defined as "captain time" and to others they use FAR 1/61. Also while you are checking with them about requirements, find out what the mean by a college degree. There is a large difference there as well. To some, you have to have physically attended a college and to others you can do it all through correspondence......and the place for these answers is not flight info . Go straight to the source, get the answers and plan accordingly.......

Great idea, but a lot easier said than done. I log every leg with a brief description and have been able to extrapolate acccurately for most applications. It takes a lot of time though.

A word to the wise from recent personal experience. Those of you who are applying from NJA; the company ,as their way of complying with PRIA, will send your prospective employer a printout of your flying at NJA. Only that time during which you were assigned as the PIC will be reflected as such. Don't find yourself trying to explain any large disparities with the interviewer.
 
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