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letter from retired AAA captain

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Green

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 1, 2005
Posts
1,108
I wonder would USAPA be able to spend $500,000 just to save the careers of 2 pilots?

Fellow US Airways pilots:

For those of you who don’t remember me, let me introduce myself. My name is XXX
XXXXX, and I spent over 20 years of my airline pilot career as an ALPA safety
representative. Starting at the original Piedmont Airlines, then at US Airways, I held a
number of leadership positions, including accident investigator, Local Safety Committee
member, MEC Chief Accident Investigator, MEC Safety Chairman, and ALPA Int’l
Accident Investigation Board member. Finally, I rounded up my ALPA work by serving
as the ALPA Int’l Executive Air Safety Chairman from 1999 until I retired from US
Airways at the end of 2004.

During all those years I spent doing safety work, I saw firsthand the resources available
to assist ALPA members during difficult times. And I’ll be the first to tell you that an
independent union will never have the resources and the expertise available that you may
need to protect yourself and your career if you find yourself involved in an aircraft
accident or serious incident.

Over the years as an ALPA representative, I’ve helped plenty of pilots out of difficult
situations. I know firsthand what calling that number on the orange card means to a pilot.
It means that ALPA resources are available to protect you, no matter where you are or
what happened. Countless pilot representatives like myself, backed up by professional,
full-time staff, spend their careers guarding the reputations and careers of ALPA
members by bringing about safety improvements to our profession.

Take the accident involving US Airways Flight 5050, for example.

In September 1989, ALPA pilots were involved in a high-speed rejected takeoff at
LaGuardia airport. Unfortunately, the aircraft overran the end of the runway and ended
up in the East River. The aircraft broke into three pieces upon impact and was destroyed.
I remember it well because I was a member of the ALPA accident investigation team that
came when those pilots called the number on their orange card.

The accident scene quickly turned ugly for the flight crew. In addition to the technical,
operational, and training issues involved in the accident sequence, our pilots faced the
threat of criminal charges being filed against them by the local New York District
Attorney.

That’s when ALPA’s Legal Department stepped in. In addition to the ALPA lawyers who
were on the case, ALPA hired criminal attorneys to represent our pilots in criminal court.
After the conclusion of the accident investigation, ALPA Legal and Engineering and Air
Safety Department resources also helped them keep their jobs when faced with
disciplinary action by the airline.

ALPA’s expertise and access also helped them keep their airman’s certificates when
facing certificate action by the FAA, saving the pilots’ flying careers. Simply put,
ALPA—with the help of safety representatives like myself—saved their jobs, their
reputations, and their livelihoods.

This help is not cheap, by the way. A typical accident investigation will cost ALPA about
$200,000. Add any sort of complication, however, and those costs can skyrocket. The
threat of criminal prosecution and/or a disciplinary attack, for example, drives the costs
up exponentially. The criminal attorney costs in this case alone ran about $500,000, and
that was almost 20 years ago.

This story is just one of many I can tell. During the 20 years I spent as an ALPA safety
representative, I participated in the investigation of dozens of accidents and serious
incidents. I testified on behalf of countless pilots involved in FAA certificate action
cases, and I represented dozens of ALPA members involved in disciplinary hearings
before their airlines.

There is now a question about an independent union for US Airways pilots. I can tell you
that if you choose to go it alone with an independent union, then you will indeed be
alone. I know that an independent union can never replace the ALPA resources needed to
protect a pilot in case of an aircraft accident or serious incident.

As a safety representative, I know that safety and politics have to remain separate.
However, when it comes to a representational decision, it must be an informed decision.
Leaving the ALPA fold means leaving behind your orange card—along with all the
resources and expertise that come with it. Do not forget just how many resources a single
accident can exhaust, because USAPA cannot go it alone. Before you cast your vote, ask
yourself if you can afford to lose your orange card—the one ALPA resource you pray
you never have to use.

Fraternally,
 
Excellent letter and he's right on all counts.
 
If the politics are against you the representation doesn't matter because your still going to be hung.

ALPA doesn't help those it doesn't like if the company wants you gone.

A private lawyer is the only chance someone in trouble on the wrong side has.
 
If the politics are against you the representation doesn't matter because your still going to be hung.

ALPA doesn't help those it doesn't like if the company wants you gone.
.

Evidence? I'd love to see it.

The writer of this letter is absolutely correct. USAPA will be unable to support it's pilots with the same services ALPA provides initially. One day? Perhaps, although I quiver at the thought of how much that assessment might be.

All of this to overturn binding arbitration you have no hope of overturing? Seems very foolish.

Fight the battles you can win, I say.
 
I used to work for an airline that had alpa on the property I have since left and I am now part of an independent union. I had a health issue come up and alpa handled it perfectly, my independent union well it was ok. Its all about resources. I hate alpa and overall I am glad I ma not part of them, however I will say that all bad things considered they do have alot of resources available to help.
 
I have really no idea, but I like to see what representation that the surviving Comair pilot is getting from ALPA. He is being sued by everyone and their brother.

I can't state with any fact, but I believe he has had to or has obtained private legal representation.

Please correct me if I am wrong and tell me that ALPA is covering him to the fullest.
 
I have really no idea, but I like to see what representation that the surviving Comair pilot is getting from ALPA. He is being sued by everyone and their brother.

I can't state with any fact, but I believe he has had to or has obtained private legal representation.

Please correct me if I am wrong and tell me that ALPA is covering him to the fullest.

I agree, that would be nice to know. Who knows, maybe the judge has a gag order on some of the participants in the case...

ALPA has fought against authorities holding pilots criminally liable in accidents pretty forcefully. I would be suprised if they weren't at least providing cocouncel to the Comair FO. ALPA definately has a vested interest in the case. A criminal or civil judgement in the U.S. against any pilot would create new law... Law that would be very detrimental to all of us in the profession.
 
The irony of all this is should USAPA prevail, they will buy what services they cannot provide. And they will buy those from ALPA. And IMHO, ALPA will gladly play the role of the whore.

Just watch.
 
The irony of all this is should USAPA prevail, they will buy what services they cannot provide. And they will buy those from ALPA. And IMHO, ALPA will gladly play the role of the whore.

Just watch.

ALPA is delaying the vote counting addresses while running its propaganda "education" campaign.

ALPA does not represent members interest. ALPA represents ALPA national interest.

When ALPA declares the outcome of an issue prior to the issue being decided and pushes it towards that foretold outcome when the majority of its members are polled and want the opposite, that says it all. ie. Cabatoge is not a done deal, but if you talk to an upper level ALPA national hack, they are lobbying FOR cabatoge at the expense of American jobs to be part of the slime ball process. ALPA is a secret organization with politics off the rails.

ALPA is broke! The decert might start fixing the ROGUE leadership.
 
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Go it alone!? How does the APA at American do it? ALthough smaller, how does the IPA manage to protect UPS pilots without ALPA? That letter has a lot of fear mongering in it, IMO.
 
ALPA is full of secrets.

ALPA claims the secrets protect the outcome of its deals. Those secrets also are the sign of a closed organization.

Closed organizations are not working for an individuals protection but for those part of the secret society.

ALPA has no transparency on important career issues. ALPA calls it politics. I call it lying.
 
Go it alone!? How does the APA at American do it? ALthough smaller, how does the IPA manage to protect UPS pilots without ALPA? That letter has a lot of fear mongering in it, IMO.

Pretty sure most independent unions including APA purchase services they cannot provide their members from ALPA....which would be pretty hypocritical coming from USAPA.
 
A criminal or civil judgement in the U.S. against any pilot would create new law... Law that would be very detrimental to all of us in the profession.

Laws are supposed to be made by congress and congress alone, not activist judges.

Yet another pitfall Barak or Hillary supporters don't grasp--the inevitable appointment of judges that legislate from the bench if one of those two lefties are elected.
 
ALPA is full of secrets.

ALPA claims the secrets protect the outcome of its deals. Those secrets also are the sign of a closed organization.

Closed organizations are not working for an individuals protection but for those part of the secret society.

ALPA has no transparency on important career issues. ALPA calls it politics. I call it lying.

well said, and when they stop paying over 500K in salary and bennies to the head of ALPA. I will reconsider, until then forgetaboutit.
 
. A criminal or civil judgement in the U.S. against any pilot would create new law... Law that would be very detrimental to all of us in the profession.

I am not a lawyer like many on this thread seem to be...

There has been precedence set in the US and western countries for pilots being held criminally liable.

The issue overseas is much more of a problem....


Will USAPA have a 'orange card'..... maybe... but it will be yellow......
 
I just find it a little ironic that this would happen to flight # 5050....

Anyone who would get on a plane when the flight number is 5050.......
 
Imagine that, a letter of praise for ALPA from a former rep:rolleyes:
Not surprising, it is loaded with fear mongering.

Of course ALPA is going to come to the rescue in high profile cases which make the front page. If they didn't, it would really raise eyebrows. How many pilots are let go behind the scenes? How many pilots are let go under the mantra: "ALPA is not here to protect the jobs of BAD pilots?" How many times has a pilot been told "ALPA does not have the money to fight for your case."

Hey, if ALPA helped you out with a medical, good. That's what they are there for. In the end, ALPA is looking out for ALPA national's interests.
 
Rez...why are you anti-USAPA?
 

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