Lets talk unions....

[RVSM]

1.Perhaps we are looking at this from differing perspectives. I am interpreting "falling" as the rate or velocity at which one falls. I now beleive you are looking at it as the acceleration at which one begins falling, which is a constant. Apples, Oranges, whatever.

2. The biggest difference at SWA is that we all realize that the financial health of the company is in our best interest. I get paid more than many of my peers but I work more, under less restrictive rules than some of them do.
The other difference is that Labor/management interaction has been soured beyond any point of reconciliation by the actions of any particular representative of management.
Many of the poor labor relations in this industry are that way for good reason, on both sides of the argument. Read "Hard Landings" for a short history of the insane financial voodoo that is legacy airline management.

 

[DJRobbioRobbio]

I don't think insane would be quite the right word...Try impossible.

 

[RVSM]

Nope, insane was the correct word. After reading the book you realize that someone had to be crazy to make some the decisions that were made. Violating every tenant of sound business practice.

 

[crjdxr]

Management HATES unions. I HATE rancid sulfur farts.

I can find plenty of words, have found them, and even uttered them. Still get plenty of pressure to make sure I only put 15mins of holding fuel on my jam-packed 50 seat skooter trash RJ going into the world's busiest airport during an arrival bank. Thank goodness the pilots can still put on the gas they want - not what some management puke playing Filthy Sanchez with his cubicle mate wants him to carry.

You know those plastic chair mats make you more productive. I learned that one in college.

Now get back and monitor your console. The phones are ringing, the computer is crashing, and you've got a 2-day White Castle train thundering its way home. Man up, bite a stick, and make sure CFO Bangyerarse enjoys his flight into DCA.

Time for a square and some good ol' cat kickin'.

 

[405]

I plan on firing up the grill this weekend and spending some time with my wife and son. Screw work.

Our jobs are thankless regardless of whether you have a union or not. There are rules either way. Some may be more restrictive than others. I have said my opinion on this. Some of you may agree and some of you obviously disagree. Either way, it doesn't matter. We all have opinions.

I'm done.

 

[quartermile]

Now get back and monitor your console. The phones are ringing, the computer is crashing, and you've got a 2-day White Castle train thundering its way home. Man up, bite a stick, and make sure CFO Bangyerarse enjoys his flight into DCA.

WOW. Thats one of the best rants this side of universe.

405, did you teach crjdxr how to rant like this.

 

[405]

Nope.

 

[405]

.....

 

[Gimpy]

Twu

If any of you are represented by TWU, I pity you.

TWU international publicly opposed the MTA strike in New York. New York's MTA workers represent close to a third of TWU total membership.


Here is a quote from an article
http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=traffic&id=3744460

Peter Dechiara, TWU International Attorney: "The international has indicated to the local that in its view under the TWU constitution this is an unauthorized strike. It has not been approved by the international."
A statement was released by the President of the International TWU Tuesday evening condemning the strike. It reads: "TWU (International) hereby notifies all members of Local 100 of their obligation under the December 13, 2005 preliminary injunctions and the December 20, 2005 temporary restraining orders issued by the New York Supreme Court to cease any and all strike or strike-related activities and to report to work at their regularly assigned work hours and work locations."

Look what they did for the 34,000 Public transportation workers in New York. They helped the MTA, Mayor Bloomberg and Governor Pataki cut the knees out from under the striking workers.

Do you really think the TWU is going to really help 20 to 50 dispatchers at a regional airline?

 

[SierraPapa356]

If you think TWU is bad don't give PAFCA a call.

 

[homerjdispatch]

i dont like unions, but...

If any of you are represented by TWU, I pity you.

TWU international publicly opposed the MTA strike in New York. New York's MTA workers represent close to a third of TWU total membership.


Here is a quote from an article
http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=traffic&id=3744460

Peter Dechiara, TWU International Attorney: "The international has indicated to the local that in its view under the TWU constitution this is an unauthorized strike. It has not been approved by the international."
A statement was released by the President of the International TWU Tuesday evening condemning the strike. It reads: "TWU (International) hereby notifies all members of Local 100 of their obligation under the December 13, 2005 preliminary injunctions and the December 20, 2005 temporary restraining orders issued by the New York Supreme Court to cease any and all strike or strike-related activities and to report to work at their regularly assigned work hours and work locations."

Look what they did for the 34,000 Public transportation workers in New York. They helped the MTA, Mayor Bloomberg and Governor Pataki cut the knees out from under the striking workers.

Do you really think the TWU is going to really help 20 to 50 dispatchers at a regional airline?

The TWU did the right thing in this instance. The MTA strike was an illegal action. If the Union had backed it, they would have been commitng a crime. The TWU (totally Worthless Union) had no choice. If they had said they backed it, then Union leaders could have been thrown in jail.

DOWN WITH THE UNIONS!!!!!!!!

 

[ShutupandFly]

The TWU did the right thing in this instance. The MTA strike was an illegal action. If the Union had backed it, they would have been commitng a crime. The TWU (totally Worthless Union) had no choice. If they had said they backed it, then Union leaders could have been thrown in jail.

DOWN WITH THE UNIONS!!!!!!!!

And there is the rub. "The Union Leaders could have been thrown in jail." God forbid they they put there butts on the line. Thousands of Twu members faced fines and arrest and went out on strike anyway. Just another in a long list of reasons I have such a low opinion of Unions.

 

[Gimpy]

TWU didn't have to support it, but they didn't have to publicly opose it either. TWU Internatinal stated it for everyone to hear, and I believe even posted signs at subway entrances and bus stops. Just my opininion, but they should have just stayed out of the way and keep there mouths shut so as to not sway public opinion against there own members.

 

[Occam's Razor]

And there is the rub. "The Union Leaders could have been thrown in jail." God forbid they they put there butts on the line. Thousands of Twu members faced fines and arrest and went out on strike anyway. Just another in a long list of reasons I have such a low opinion of Unions.

Because they won't break the law?

Got it!

Wearing your Timmy McVeigh t-shirt at the keyboard?

 

[ShutupandFly]

Because they won't break the law?

Got it!

Wearing your Timmy McVeigh t-shirt at the keyboard?

Sorry about that, I must have lost my mind. Union bosses would never think of breaking the law.

I get it.

The Timmy McVeigh t-shirt is at the cleaners. got my Pasco county coastal cleanup shirt on today.

 

[ShutupandFly]

Because they won't break the law?

Got it!

Wearing your Timmy McVeigh t-shirt at the keyboard?

.....

 

[405]

Because they won't break the law?

Got it!

Wearing your Timmy McVeigh t-shirt at the keyboard?

Is it possible for you to look at an issue from other than your extremely focused point of view? Have you ever thought that maybe you're not always so godd*mn correct and that you... aw, f*ck it.

You're the type of a-hole that would argue the point if I said the sun comes up in the east. You would say "no, technically, it's south-southeast." You're always right regardless of what anyone says.

Quite simply, OCD boy, you are an insufferable uptight prick.

 

[Occam's Razor]

Is it possible for you to look at an issue from other than your extremely focused point of view?

I will if you will.

Have you ever thought that maybe you're not always so godd*mn correct and that you... aw, f*ck it.

Have you ever thought that you're overreacting?

You're the type of a-hole that would argue the point if I said the sun comes up in the east. You would say "no, technically, it's south-southeast." You're always right regardless of what anyone says.

You gather that conclusion because I advocate obeying the law?

(And the sun doesn't "rise". The Earth rotates.)

Quite simply, OCD boy, you are an insufferable uptight prick.

That's CAPTAIN OCD Boy to you! And my dog thinks I'm wonderful. (He also thinks you're incapable of countering sound logic, but offers to hump your leg if that'll help.)

 

[ShutupandFly]

That's CAPTAIN OCD Boy to you! And my dog thinks I'm wonderful. (He also thinks you're incapable of countering sound logic, but offers to hump your leg if that'll help.)

Captain OCD boy, give me a break. I'll bet your the kind of guy that puts your uniform on and sits in front of the 7-11 drinking coffee just waiting for someone to come up and say "gee mister are you an honest to goodness real pilot! Golly Gee I wana be just like you when I grow up"

Sorry Dude got my Tim McVeigh shirt back and it must be going to my head.

 

[405]

(And the sun doesn't "rise". The Earth rotates.)

Thank you for making my point for me.

 

[405]

Here we go one last time Captain OCD. No, I'm not overreacting. Your logic is sound in your own opinion. It must be nice to be perfect. You never make mistakes.

I do not see the point of 30 people needing a union when things were running smooth in my office. As I have said more than once, you DO NOT know everything that is going on in our office. We had (and please note I said HAD, most of them have quit now) a lot of young impressionable people who voted this thing in because they were told by one bitter, angry person that this is what they needed to do. So, they did. Now we have it and there's a few (maybe six or eight) people who still think we need it. The rest of us want it out because we did a lot better dealing with management directly.

Unions may work for pilots, flight attendants and mechanics but I don't see it helping us. I am very anxious to see what benefits we get if a contract gets voted in at all. If someone else tells me "management can't abuse you anymore, they can't just fire you at will, etc." I'm gonna throw up. They never did that before.

Captain OCD Boy, if you are happy with your union, then I am truly happy for you. In my opinion, we don't need a union. Yes, a majority voted it in here but now that majority has left the company. What I have said is my opinion. If you don't like it, block me and quit responding to whatever drivel you think I write.

I have dogs so I don't need your dysfunctional dog to hump my leg. Thanks for the offer. I told my dogs you were a real, live airline CAPTAIN. They were completely unimpressed. The went outside and left two really sizable craps. I've read all of your posts to both of them and they still think you're a stereotypical pilot who thinks your own poop doesn't stink. What do they know though, they're just dogs.

You need to go reorganize your closet. Your white shirts aren't all spaced exactly 1.75 inches apart on the hangers anymore. You have a hair out of place also. I bet you just ran to the closest mirror and looked.

Fly 'em safe, Captain OCD Godman.

 

[Occam's Razor]

Thank you for making my point for me.

It was subtle sarcasm. You musta missed the big grin icon.

I'm in a profession that requires attention-to-detail. It's kinda important.

 

[405]

I guess my job doesn't involve any kind of attention detail either. I saw the grin icon.

Go ahead. Tear me up for this badly worded post. I did it fast.

 

[Occam's Razor]

Captain OCD boy, give me a break. I'll bet your the kind of guy that puts your uniform on and sits in front of the 7-11 drinking coffee just waiting for someone to come up and say "gee mister are you an honest to goodness real pilot! Golly Gee I wana be just like you when I grow up"

Ha! You can't do both (grow up and be a pilot)

 

[405]

Ha! You can't do both (grow up and be a pilot)

I agree with you on this one.

Another Occam Novel to follow....

 

[Occam's Razor]

Here we go one last time Captain OCD. No, I'm not overreacting. Your logic is sound in your own opinion. It must be nice to be perfect. You never make mistakes.

Never big ones. If I did, I wouldn't be here to type this. I try to make a series of small mistakes that can be caught and corrected by my diligent F/O's. I also try not to whine. I dislike whining.

I do not see the point of 30 people needing a union when things were running smooth in my office. As I have said more than once, you DO NOT know everything that is going on in our office. We had (and please note I said HAD, most of them have quit now) a lot of young impressionable people who voted this thing in because they were told by one bitter, angry person that this is what they needed to do. So, they did. Now we have it and there's a few (maybe six or eight) people who still think we need it. The rest of us want it out because we did a lot better dealing with management directly.

Interesting backstory, but it's OBE now. If a majority of your co-workers want the union gone, get rid of it. Or just keeping whining about how terrible the union has made your job. Your choice. If your assessment of the numbers is correct, then it can be done quickly by distributing cards.

Unions may work for pilots, flight attendants and mechanics but I don't see it helping us. I am very anxious to see what benefits we get if a contract gets voted in at all. If someone else tells me "management can't abuse you anymore, they can't just fire you at will, etc." I'm gonna throw up. They never did that before.

Well if you don't see them helping you, then that's the way it must be. Given your extensive experience with collective bargaining, you know better than all of us about the benefits of union membership. <--this icon means I'm being sarcastic. (just trying to help!)

Captain OCD Boy, if you are happy with your union, then I am truly happy for you.

Truly? I feel the energy of your warmth. <--this icon means I'm kidding about feeling your energy.

In my opinion, we don't need a union. Yes, a majority voted it in here but now that majority has left the company. What I have said is my opinion.

Sounds simple. If it bothers you, get those cards distributed and see how the rest of your co-workers really feel.

I have dogs so I don't need your dysfunctional dog to hump my leg.

1. My dog functions very well. Try to get through our door sometime while I'm gone and see for yourself.
2. Pity, you two could have really hit it off. My dog doesn't understand unions either!:laugh: <--even MORE sarcasm!

I told my dogs you were a real, live airline CAPTAIN. They were completely unimpressed.

Did you mention my charm, wit, and good looks? If you did and they still aren't impressed, then it could be your dogs are full of crap.

The went outside and left two really sizable craps.

A ha! See? See? I told you! :laugh: <--that means I'm joking.

I've read all of your posts to both of them and they still think you're a stereotypical pilot who thinks your own poop doesn't stink. What do they know though, they're just dogs.

My poop smells kinda "minty". <--that means it doesn't really...I'm going for shock value here.

You need to go reorganize your closet. Your white shirts aren't all spaced exactly 1.75 inches apart on the hangers anymore. You have a hair out of place also. I bet you just ran to the closest mirror and looked.

My shirts are in boxes (they come that way from the cleaners). The only hair I have that's "in place" is sticking out of my ears. I don't have a mirror in my closet.

You're not scoring well here. Suggest you shift the objective back to how much unions have (and surely will) ruin your job.

Fly 'em safe, Captain OCD Godman.

Thanks, I appreciate your sincerity. <--sarcasm reprise

 

[Occam's Razor]

I guess my job doesn't involve any kind of attention detail either. I saw the grin icon.

Go ahead. Tear me up for this badly worded post. I did it fast.

Geez...you even edited it fast! You missed the "to" between "attention" and "detail".

See?

Now that's attention to detail!

 

[405]

I knew another novel would follow. Thanks for pointing out what all of the little icons meant. I never knew any of that before.

Hey, Geoff.

 

[405]

Geez...you even edited it fast! You missed the "to" between "attention" and "detail".

See?

Now that's attention to detail!

You are correct, sir.

I really don't pay any attention to detail in my job. I sit back, play online poker, sleep and SKATE like a mofo. Forecasts? I don't look at them. NOTAM's? What's the point in reading those? You don't need me sitting there watching you professionals fly through weather. You guys know everything already. Adios and have a nice flight.

What's that icon for sarcasm again? Is that it?

 

[Occam's Razor]

You are correct, sir.

Humbly accepted. (Now if I could convince my kids of that too!)

I really don't pay any attention to detail in my job.

Who said anything about your attention to detail on the job? I was pointing out the entertaining irony of typing "attention to detail" incorrectly. You gotta admit that's good stuff.

I sit back, play online poker, sleep and SKATE like a mofo. Forecasts? I don't look at them. NOTAM's? What's the point in reading those? You don't need me sitting there watching you professionals fly through weather. You guys know everything already.

Ouch! I'm getting a whiff of self-esteem issues here, buried inside a light, flaky crust of sarcasm. I hope I'm wrong. No Pt. 121 pilot could possibly know enough to do the job safely. It takes a team.

Adios and have a nice flight.

Always! It's the best job in the world! Thanks ALPA! <--union plug.

What's that icon for sarcasm again? Is that it?

Depends on context.