Less experience showing through at Skywest and others...

[viper548]

How far out were the planes?

 

[bmpilot2003]

Wow someone actually supplied some usefull info here. The point I was making by posting what SOMEONE ELSE said on another message board is that experience is down and some guys arent sure what they are supposed to do. Hundreds of new FO's are a problem. A bigger problem is captains who got the quick upgrade and dont have much experience to draw on and having not had the time to learn from a veteran pilot they flounder a bit when something out of the ordinary presents itself. Flame away but its a point worth considering.

PS- for the toolbag who asked, I fly for a 121 Major where I assure you they are not hiring guys with 1000/100.

Lets debate horrible decisions made by Major airline captains with tens of thousands of hours. Who do you work for we can debate bad decision made at your airline. As for 1000/100 what do you have against skywest? Skywest has some of the highest mins in the industry. By the way most of the people at Skywest who got quick upgrades came from other airlines and had prior airline experience. But you wouldn't know that from the outside looking in would you? Tool box huh... how old are you?

 

[Metro752]

It was a normal day in Denver... THE DAY ALL HELL BROKE LOOSE!!!

I've scene it too! Awesome!

 

[Way2Broke]

It was a normal day in Denver... THE DAY ALL HELL BROKE LOOSE!!!

My favorite FAA video of all time!

 

[Sedona16]

Lets debate horrible decisions made by Major airline captains with tens of thousands of hours. Who do you work for we can debate bad decision made at your airline. As for 1000/100 what do you have against skywest? Skywest has some of the highest mins in the industry. By the way most of the people at Skywest who got quick upgrades came from other airlines and had prior airline experience. But you wouldn't know that from the outside looking in would you? Tool box huh... how old are you?

I flew for a Delta Connection carrier. I have no doubt we crossed paths at least once in my years of regional flying. Funny thing is we probably are in full agreement RE the Skywest 65% unless I am missreading your avatar. The point I was making in posting what another said is that with the relative inexperience at the regional level and low time teething, documented and undocumented screwups are on the increase. I have lots of friends at skywest, many who are some of the sharpest pilots I have ever met. They often times are baby sitting guys with record lows in experience, at least in the past few decades. Add some low time captains (those not from other carriers) and the risk goes up.

I assure you in my flying at the majors i see far fewer mistakes especially where it is related to experience. Do we still have some cowboys who make poor choices. Yes they are out there. Day in and day out though I can tell you the professionalism I see on a daily bases is incredible. The detailed briefings and carefull thought processes I see in action are much higher than what is being taught and many time used at the regional level. It makes me realize how poor my own communication was as a regional captain. These are my observations...flame away.

 

[Bako Cap]

The big question is; Was it their freedom leg and did they have a tight connection for their commute?

 

[pilotshan]

It was a normal day in Denver... THE DAY ALL HELL BROKE LOOSE!!!

Best movie ever!! Can't wait until recurrent to see it again!

 

[Crash Pad]

Ok I'll admit it... It was me. There I was on final in my CRJ 200! Microburst Alert + or - 60 knots on short final.

I look to my right. This kid must have been about 21 years old with 500 total. Panic in his eyes. "should we go around?" I look this Riddle puke right in the eyes and tell him "on time arrivals are job one here at SKYW! You want a bonus or do you want to go around?"

I turn up the volume on my IPOD so I can here it over the GPWS... I left my backpack in an overhead! Looks like I won't be able to video tape this approach and post it on youtube.

Persperation is forming on my mirrored sunglasses and my frosted, spiked hair is suddenly starting to show wear... Then the turbulence starts and... out of nowhere a voice comes over my IPOD "SKYW 342 do you want to go around".

FEDS! How will I show Southwest I can handle the 737 if I can't even land the RJ in these conditions. What will continental think if I don't at least try to force a landing. Reluctantly I shove the power forward. Riddle puke to my right has soiled himself so I tell him to go in back and clean up so I can sulk alone.

2400 total with 900 PIC turbine and still no stories about how I handled an emergency.

 

[shamrock]

This is yet another Skywest bashing flamebait......


Maybe ALPA should push for higher experience requirements....... Sorry what was I thinking......

You take issue with "Skywest bashing flamebait" but overlook the fact that you do much the same thing when you use virtually every thread as a forum for your anti-ALPA views.

 

[John Pennekamp]

This is yet another Skywest bashing flamebait...... The experience level is getting scarry everywhere.... Some of the worst examples I have seen come from Mesa..... I watch them take off in AVL on a regular basis without turning on the runway lights..... I assume they don't know about PCL..... I have watched Delta land in thunderstorms with microburst conditions.....

This isn't a Skywest issue...... this is an industry issue.....

Maybe ALPA should push for higher experience requirements....... Sorry what was I thinking......

Well said!

 

[JohnnyP]

.....

Ok I'll admit it... It was me. There I was on final in my CRJ 200! Microburst Alert + or - 60 knots on short final.

I look to my right. This kid must have been about 21 years old with 500 total. Panic in his eyes. "should we go around?" I look this Riddle puke right in the eyes and tell him "on time arrivals are job one here at SKYW! You want a bonus or do you want to go around?"

I turn up the volume on my IPOD so I can here it over the GPWS... I left my backpack in an overhead! Looks like I won't be able to video tape this approach and post it on youtube.

Persperation is forming on my mirrored sunglasses and my frosted, spiked hair is suddenly starting to show wear... Then the turbulence starts and... out of nowhere a voice comes over my IPOD "SKYW 342 do you want to go around".

FEDS! How will I show Southwest I can handle the 737 if I can't even land the RJ in these conditions. What will continental think if I don't at least try to force a landing. Reluctantly I shove the power forward. Riddle puke to my right has soiled himself so I tell him to go in back and clean up so I can sulk alone.

2400 total with 900 PIC turbine and still no stories about how I handled an emergency.

Good stuff!

 

[Cpt Oveur]

Well said!

Can't have your cake and eat it too. Jack the mins up today; complain about being extended tomorrow.

Honestly, do you expect ALPA to urge companies to increase hourly mins and experience if it risks ALPA not getting more union dues? ALPA is interested in the preservation of ALPA. Maybe companies will realize that 35 and 50 seat jets are less effective than 70 and 90 seaters in more ways than just fuel costs.

 

[prtyprtyprncss]

See below

 

[prtyprtyprncss]

And who do you work for? Lets debate poor decisions made at your $hity regional. Come on Mesa, Pinnacle, Masaba etc... i can recall some pretty stupid decisions that didn't end as well as this one did. Again who do you work for?

It's "Mesaba"...and when have they made a decision that mashed up a batch or got them on TV with an accident where folks were killed? I'm asking 'cause I don't know of any....

 

[prtyprtyprncss]

It was a normal day in Denver... THE DAY ALL HELL BROKE LOOSE!!!

YES! I love the "albino" dude that says, "So then I said...let's get the HECK outta here!"...I wonder if he was disciplined for using profanity on the flight deck....a close second is the Air New Zealand with the false LOC capture...."GEW REHUND, GEW REHUND!"....priceless.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Can't have your cake and eat it too. Jack the mins up today; complain about being extended tomorrow.

Honestly, do you expect ALPA to urge companies to increase hourly mins and experience if it risks ALPA not getting more union dues? ALPA is interested in the preservation of ALPA. Maybe companies will realize that 35 and 50 seat jets are less effective than 70 and 90 seaters in more ways than just fuel costs.

My, my, touchy today aren't we? Guess I'm going to have to feed you some more beers this weekend and calm you down.

Yes, to answer your question, I do encourage ALPA to do that. It's been said many times, where would doctor or lawyer salaries be without the AMA and ABA limiting entry to the profession. ALPA could get involved with the puppy mills to control entry and curriculum as the professional associations do with law school and medical school. Then they could lobby the FAA to institute a system of controlling entry to the profession such as passing the bar exam.

It wouldn't be that difficult, it would just involve ALPA diverting its resources away from the BS they currently waste their money on.

 

[prtyprtyprncss]

I assure you in my flying at the majors i see far fewer mistakes especially where it is related to experience. ... The detailed briefings and carefull thought processes I see in action are much higher than what is being taught and many time used at the regional level. It makes me realize how poor my own communication was as a regional captain...

Okay, you "flew" at a regional (past tense)...you realize how poor your communication "was" (past tense again) as a regional captain...so we're to assume that now you've climbed to the top of the airline heap (MAJOR air carrier) and now you can look down rom on high at the regionals and say, "Boy, I remember when I was there...how inexperienced and green I was! I thank the aviation gods that I'm not like those poor lepers!)...I notice that you have 7500 hours TT...that's pretty low for the MAJOR airlines...so I guess you're just a pup...maybe bigger than some, but a pup nonetheless...maybe when you have another 10,000 tacked onto that, you'll look back and realize how "little" you know now! If a crew f##ks up, none of the dead and very few of the injured are gonna care what their TT was or what kind of airplane it happened on...so stop flattering yourself because you "made it" to the MAJOR airlines and shouldn't you be on the MAJOR airline part of the forum and not posting here with the minor leagues?

 

[prtyprtyprncss]

Ok I'll admit it... It was me. There I was on final in my CRJ 200! Microburst Alert + or - 60 knots on short final.

I look to my right. This kid must have been about 21 years old with 500 total. Panic in his eyes. "should we go around?" I look this Riddle puke right in the eyes and tell him "on time arrivals are job one here at SKYW! You want a bonus or do you want to go around?"

I turn up the volume on my IPOD so I can here it over the GPWS... I left my backpack in an overhead! Looks like I won't be able to video tape this approach and post it on youtube.

Persperation is forming on my mirrored sunglasses and my frosted, spiked hair is suddenly starting to show wear... Then the turbulence starts and... out of nowhere a voice comes over my IPOD "SKYW 342 do you want to go around".

FEDS! How will I show Southwest I can handle the 737 if I can't even land the RJ in these conditions. What will continental think if I don't at least try to force a landing. Reluctantly I shove the power forward. Riddle puke to my right has soiled himself so I tell him to go in back and clean up so I can sulk alone.

2400 total with 900 PIC turbine and still no stories about how I handled an emergency.

HA! THAT WAS AWWWESOME! It's about time we have some humor here! (And funny 'cause it's true!)

 

[Sedona16]

Okay, you "flew" at a regional (past tense)...you realize how poor your communication "was" (past tense again) as a regional captain...so we're to assume that now you've climbed to the top of the airline heap (MAJOR air carrier) and now you can look down rom on high at the regionals and say, "Boy, I remember when I was there...how inexperienced and green I was! I thank the aviation gods that I'm not like those poor lepers!)...I notice that you have 7500 hours TT...that's pretty low for the MAJOR airlines...so I guess you're just a pup...maybe bigger than some, but a pup nonetheless...maybe when you have another 10,000 tacked onto that, you'll look back and realize how "little" you know now! If a crew f##ks up, none of the dead and very few of the injured are gonna care what their TT was or what kind of airplane it happened on...so stop flattering yourself because you "made it" to the MAJOR airlines and shouldn't you be on the MAJOR airline part of the forum and not posting here with the minor leagues?

I would say you entirely missed the point. Instead you turned this into a post about ego of which it was never intended. Re-read the original post. This is about low time/inexperience pilots who struggle under nonstandard conditions. Nothing more.

PS- I edited my profile flight time for your benefit.

 

[say again]

Why are some of you getting so defensive over this??? Learn from it, whatever airline you work for. Things happen at ALL airlines, and Skywest just happened to be in this example.