Latest at Flexjet?

[GSXR600]

So glad I got some extra drinking money this weekend......

 

[Flyingdog1]

While I certainly won't turn down any extra $$ from the Waterview, money at flex has never really been an issue. As far a holding a union at bay, all I can do is laugh that anyone out there (especially management) thinks that there is any shred of a chance of this group forming a union. I get weak and weary even thinking about thinking of getting my hopes up for that.

But hey if money is more important than work rules & protection from abtritrary and constantly changing threats from management, more power to ya.

I do get kind of a sick chuckle though out of the fact that one of the biggest union bashers flex ever had got his butt canned (rightfully so). I often wonder if he would have felt the need to lie and put others in harms way if he knew he had a union to back him up from jumpstreet. I'm betting he would have handled it differently. Hope that's not a lesson lost on all the other bashers... Oh wait, there I go getting my hopes up again.

Kudos to Flex for giving the 85 some of the bonus. They can't be recalled soon enough in my book, even if that's less pie for the rest.

I'm bored so I'll reply to your thoughts.

1. If YOU want a union, send back the money. Or, put it into a legal fund to protect your rights for your bretheren. And with our current management, there's a chance in hell a union will land here. A union is needed when the governing body is unfair, our management is fair. We are not the highest paid, we probably don't have the best rules, but they are fair. By this, I only ask, show me a union shop that has been sucessful.

2. I have never, in my 10+ years, been threatened by management.

3. The person who was fired, made a mistake in his job. This person was fired because the pilot didn't own up to the mistake. Believe me, honest mistakes are ALWAYS forgiven here.

4.For the 85 laid off here: I would gladly give my bonus back to get at least one guy hired back here. I think most of us would. 60 pilots that got laid off got a bonus, not 85.

5. Flex wife, you're ignorant of what is going on, and I hope you would educate yourself before you decide to speak on this board again.

(Man, that was hard not to tell her to go get back on her dance pole, but I did it.)

Been nice knowing ya'll, but I'm sure I'll be kicked again. CYA!

 

[Dooker]

I'm bored so I'll reply to your thoughts.

1. If YOU want a union, send back the money. Or, put it into a legal fund to protect your rights for your bretheren. And with our current management, there's a chance in hell a union will land here. A union is needed when the governing body is unfair, our management is fair. We are not the highest paid, we probably don't have the best rules, but they are fair. By this, I only ask, show me a union shop that has been sucessful.

2. I have never, in my 10+ years, been threatened by management.

3. The person who was fired, made a mistake in his job. This person was fired because the pilot didn't own up to the mistake. Believe me, honest mistakes are ALWAYS forgiven here.

4.For the 85 laid off here: I would gladly give my bonus back to get at least one guy hired back here. I think most of us would. 60 pilots that got laid off got a bonus, not 85.

5. Flex wife, you're ignorant of what is going on, and I hope you would educate yourself before you decide to speak on this board again.

(Man, that was hard not to tell her to go get back on her dance pole, but I did it.)

Been nice knowing ya'll, but I'm sure I'll be kicked again. CYA!

I tend to agree with all of the above, much as I hate to admit it. I've always been governed by certain anti-authoritarian, anti-capital, anti-management sentiments, which may be part of why I chose a flying career in the first place.

Still, even I have to admit that the management at Flex has demonstrated remarkable restraint and good judgement during the time I've been here (although I have to be honest here: my feelings tend to shift, depending on the circumstances. When I thought I was gonna get furloughed, I was seeing red. Now that it seems my job might be safe after all, my views have moderated somewhat).

I think it's funny and a little ironic that our managers have been repeatedly bashed for being shrewd enough to keep a union off the property. It's almost as though some would prefer to see them come out and do something blatantly stupid, something which would open the door to an organizing push.

That said, I'm glad there are unions out there, because the constant threat of one has given us the next-best (or, perhaps, the best) thing: a set of (mostly) reasonable work rules, a reasonably cohesive pilot group, and managers who tread pretty carefully around us. It ain't perfect, but it could be a lot worse.

You've got to give these guys some credit. They've steered us through one of the worst downturns this industry has experienced and we remain viable. Part of why we remain viable is the flexibility that not having a union on the property has allowed us to maintain.

Flame on.

 

[wacoflyr]

I tend to agree with all of the above, much as I hate to admit it. I've always been governed by certain anti-authoritarian, anti-capital, anti-management sentiments, which may be part of why I chose a flying career in the first place.

Still, even I have to admit that the management at Flex has demonstrated remarkable restraint and good judgement during the time I've been here (although I have to be honest here: my feelings tend to shift, depending on the circumstances. When I thought I was gonna get furloughed, I was seeing red. Now that it seems my job might be safe after all, my views have moderated somewhat).

I think it's funny and a little ironic that our managers have been repeatedly bashed for being shrewd enough to keep a union off the property.

Flame on.

Hmm. I find myself in the same boat. I work for somebody else, of course, and the future over here remains murky. We have not had any furloughs, we just got stock options(which may or may not prove to be worth the paper they are printed on) and I got an unexpected pay raise a year ago. There are some negatives that I won't discuss here, but they keep the balance sheet about even. I don't want us to unionize, but that sentiment is not shared by all. I hope our management recognizes this, and gives a little to keep the peace, for all our sakes. I know we won't get everything we want. I just hope management realizes that they won't, either.

The gorrilla in the room is the economy. We all want to get well, and there is just less to go around these days. Counting on our pac and management to find common ground is nerve wracking, but that balance is more important now than ever before. I hope they get it right.

 

[unclepetey]

Flex was/is a good job. However, its hard to see recalls happening when some guys are picking up as many as 6 overtime days each bid for a total of twenty.

 

[ArtVandalay]

While I certainly won't turn down any extra $$ from the Waterview, money at flex has never really been an issue. As far a holding a union at bay, all I can do is laugh that anyone out there (especially management) thinks that there is any shred of a chance of this group forming a union. I get weak and weary even thinking about thinking of getting my hopes up for that.

But hey if money is more important than work rules & protection from abtritrary and constantly changing threats from management, more power to ya.

I do get kind of a sick chuckle though out of the fact that one of the biggest union bashers flex ever had got his butt canned (rightfully so). I often wonder if he would have felt the need to lie and put others in harms way if he knew he had a union to back him up from jumpstreet. I'm betting he would have handled it differently. Hope that's not a lesson lost on all the other bashers... Oh wait, there I go getting my hopes up again.

Kudos to Flex for giving the 85 some of the bonus. They can't be recalled soon enough in my book, even if that's less pie for the rest.

And we're still supposed to believe you're not a flexjet employee? uhuh, right.

 

[Photoflight]

Flex was/is a good job. However, its hard to see recalls happening when some guys are picking up as many as 6 overtime days each bid for a total of twenty.

wait...seriously?

I've had a few OT days this year but its all been weather related BS.

Are there guys seriously bidding 20?

 

[Dooker]

Flex was/is a good job. However, its hard to see recalls happening when some guys are picking up as many as 6 overtime days each bid for a total of twenty.

While I agree that the OT sodomites aren't doing anybody any favors, I have to wonder whether that "6 OT days per bid period" to which you refer to might be more urban legend than fact.

I fly with some big-time OT addicts, and all they do is complain that they can't get it.

 

[DirtyBeech]

It seems a bit far fetched, but if you've got guys bidding 17 and taking OT days then it's not too hard to see guys bidding 14 and then picking up as many OT days as possible.

Hope they're loving that mcmillionaire lifestyle. What little they get to live.

 

[Flyingdog1]

We should not do OT while guys are the street. I'm not talking forced OT, we all get screwed into that one. But really, asking for or accepting OT is akin to being a scab. Do what you will but we live/work in a very small community.

 

[vixin]

1. By this, I only ask, show me a union shop that has been sucessful.

I dont have a dog in this fight, but SWA is one of the most unionized companies in the industry. They seem be doing pretty well.

 

[Flyingdog1]

I dont have a dog in this fight, but SWA is one of the most unionized companies in the industry. They seem be doing pretty well.

You're right there. But, that's is not the norm.

I'm not a union basher or supporter, nor do I drink the company koolaid. I just look at what's going on at other companies and weight the pros and cons. Good or bad, some companies need a union, but AT THIS TIME, I don't see a reason for a union here.

 

[unclepetey]

wait...seriously?

I've had a few OT days this year but its all been weather related BS.

Are there guys seriously bidding 20?

20 days is true. I personally flew with this guy before getting furloughed. I obviously don't want to mention names but he is a VERY senior 604 captain.

 

[DirtyBeech]

You're right there. But, that's is not the norm.

I'm not a union basher or supporter, nor do I drink the company koolaid. I just look at what's going on at other companies and weight the pros and cons. Good or bad, some companies need a union, but AT THIS TIME, I don't see a reason for a union here.

Also not a here or there argument, but one might say that the fractional industry leader seems to be doing ok as a union shop.

 

[Nolife]

You're right there. But, that's is not the norm.
I'm not a union basher or supporter, nor do I drink the company koolaid. I just look at what's going on at other companies and weight the pros and cons. Good or bad, some companies need a union, but AT THIS TIME, I don't see a reason for a union here.

Sounds like some former colonists prior to the revolution. "The King isn't so bad, do we really need independence..." The power to collectively negotiate and have a seat at the table means a lot to most people especially when decisions made greatly affect your quality of life.

Unions are neither good nor bad, it depends on memebership and their relationship with management. There are several examples of companies that do well "in spite" of being heavily unionized; FedEx, UPS, SWA, AAL, Ford, Toyota, Kia, United States, etc.