JetBlue and ALPA

[hoover84]

Why go with ALPA when we are having trouble getting 50% of our pilots to
vote yes? The in-house option would have far better participation. If a CBA is what we need go with the sure thing. Yes we all know its expensive......SWAPA did okay

 

[Fins Up]

Why go with ALPA when we are having trouble getting 50% of our pilots to
vote yes? The in-house option would have far better participation. If a CBA is what we need go with the sure thing. Yes we all know its expensive......SWAPA did okay

50% interest cards is way too low to ensure a vote victory. That is what is taking so long. After the last debacle, ALPA wants stronger numbers before filing.

SWAPA "did okay" because they had the blessing from management. We do not have that. Even if they suddenly "changed their minds" and said an in-house is okay, I wouldn't believe them. ALPA is the way to go - at least for an initial contract. I get as frustrated waiting as anyone else but we have to do it right and we only really have one more chance with ALPA. If we burn them again, they are DONE with us.

 

[Chronic Jetlag]

Why go with ALPA when we are having trouble getting 50% of our pilots to
vote yes? The in-house option would have far better participation. If a CBA is what we need go with the sure thing. Yes we all know its expensive......SWAPA did okay

As divided as JB pilots are, an in-house union would be worthless because no one will cough up the seed $$$ to get it off the ground. It will not have $$$, expertise, political clout...nothing; game over.

 

[Ski-N-Fly]

Why go with ALPA when we are having trouble getting 50% of our pilots to
vote yes? The in-house option would have far better participation. If a CBA is what we need go with the sure thing. Yes we all know its expensive......SWAPA did okay

To all those who want an In House, The only thing stopping you from starting one is......YOU. It's been tried before and failed. It will cost a lot more $$$ to start an In House than it will to get ALPA on the property. Good luck with that. We just don't have the resources. SWA's management is union friendly, as they welcomed their unionization. JetBlue management hates unions. Your uphill battle is pretty steep.

But imagine this.....having a union run by JetBlue pilots, elected by JetBlue pilots, and held accountable by JetBlue pilots. And at the same time, you would have access to the best aviation attorneys and doctors on the planet. It's called ALPA. Any union that is ALPA sponsored is actually an In House union with access to ALPA national's many resources. ALPA national does not control any of its sponsored unions. Every decision an ALPA sponsored union makes is up to its own pilots. YOU have the final say......not ALPA. Any bad experiences you may have had with an ALPA sponsored union is the fault of YOUR own airline's union.

This is a business decision. When making a business decision, it is far better to use logic instead of emotion. We need a union ASAP. Whether you want ALPA, In House, Teamsters, Mickey Mouse, etc, please just send in your cards so we can actually vote for some type of representation. Can we all agree that we need to be represented? Let's get past that step first. Send in your cards!

 

[jynxyjericho]

To all those who want an In House, The only thing stopping you from starting one is......YOU. It's been tried before and failed. It will cost a lot more $$$ to start an In House than it will to get ALPA on the property. Good luck with that. We just don't have the resources. SWA's management is union friendly, as they welcomed their unionization. JetBlue management hates unions. Your uphill battle is pretty steep.

But imagine this.....having a union run by JetBlue pilots, elected by JetBlue pilots, and held accountable by JetBlue pilots. And at the same time, you would have access to the best aviation attorneys and doctors on the planet. It's called ALPA. Any union that is ALPA sponsored is actually an In House union with access to ALPA national's many resources. ALPA national does not control any of its sponsored unions. Every decision an ALPA sponsored union makes is up to its own pilots. YOU have the final say......not ALPA. Any bad experiences you may have had with an ALPA sponsored union is the fault of YOUR own airline's union.

This is a business decision. When making a business decision, it is far better to use logic instead of emotion. We need a union ASAP. Whether you want ALPA, In House, Teamsters, Mickey Mouse, etc, please just send in your cards so we can actually vote for some type of representation. Can we all agree that we need to be represented? Let's get past that step first. Send in your cards!

Yeah but if everyone at JetBlue now doesn't want ALPA because they remember how bad their "local" ALPA was run at their previous carrier what would they have to look forward to? Not anymore, but we had a run of guys who would blow big bucks on booze and food for their friends because they used the union as a debit card. The circus has mostly left but I still heard a P2P rep telling his buddy on reserve that he could get him free food every day during the concessionary agreement education campaign. If your soon to be elected union rep believes union = free crap, instead of union = hard work, you're screwed and you should keep your money. Pilots who want to work hard realize they need ALPA and it's wealth of tools to succeed.

Some pilot groups do well with a union, some groups are better off sticking the dues in their pocket. If JetBlue pilots doesn't feel like ALPA can do anything for them, it's probably because they have no ambition to do anything to improve their lot. If you did want to improve your airline, at least if a majority of pilots did, you'd already have a union, in house or otherwise.

Maybe with one more failed union drive, JetBlue will get bought out by a union airline with a contract. Then the <49% of JetBlue pilots who want more from their airline in the way of pay and benefits will get what they want. The other >51% will simply win the lotto and likely complain about it because the SLI won't make any sense to them. Trust me the people who can't be bothered to read the contract are the same ones that can't be bothered to read the SLI award decision. You're better off being stapled, then everyone is unhappy but the process is so dumbed down they'll actually understand why they should be unhappy.

The flippant meter is running in the red tonight.

 

[GuppyPuppy]

Why go with ALPA when we are having trouble getting 50% of our pilots to
vote yes? The in-house option would have far better participation. If a CBA is what we need go with the sure thing. Yes we all know its expensive......SWAPA did okay

And in a perfect world we wouldn't need a union.

But, we don't live there.

Don't vote emotionally, vote logically.

GP

 

[hoover84]

We need our pilos vested in the new union. Any union with weak participation will be pushed around by the company.

 

[ASA_Aviator]

We need our pilos vested in the new union. Any union with weak participation will be pushed around by the company.

If a union is voted in, I think there will be good participation. The 49.9% that voted against it won't participate, but that won't make it weaker. Once there's a CBA it's not like the company can negotiate with the no voters separately.

 

[B6Busdriver]

We need our pilos vested in the new union. Any union with weak participation will be pushed around by the company.

For what your inhouse union will you'll really be vested. Thousands of dollars in assessments and higher dues with weaker representation. No thanks.

That said if you and your buddies that want an inhouse get their act together I'll sign a card.

 

[A350]

Hoover is right on.....

Further....you ALPA toters who think this is the cheaper way to go are being disingenuous. It costs x amout of dollars to unionize a pilot group, regardless of who is doing the representation.

The disingenuous part is that you don't want to cough up the resources out of your own pocket, you want to dip into the pockets of the other ALPA pilots for the resources and that is the pinnacle of hypocrisy.

Not to mention with that subsidy from ALPA for the organization comes the inevitable "strings attached" that is why most of us can't stand ALPA because they want to be a union but are really just a loose association which have policies that are just about as permeable as a bucket with no bottom. Further, at ALPA you will have a voice, but it will be the squeaky little voice way in the back of the room while the elephants like UAL and DAL get whatever THEY want whether you agree with it or not. It is just like government subsidy money for certain things for the states....play by their rules or they cut you off.

In house or nothing. If you believe, then you will pony up the money. If you don't want to pony up the money, then I guess you don't want it bad enough. Our own union will have the horsepower that WE provide. Nothing more, nothing less. I don't know about you, but I am a lot more willing to go to the mat when I spend my own money than when I spend someone elses'.

A350