JetBlue and ALPA

[Fins Up]

In-house would've hr doomed croma the start just lume NPA. We need a CBA ASAP! An in-house would be bled dry before a decent contract is ever achieved. Go where the money and the resources already exist - ALPA. After a contract is in place would be the time to try to go in-house.

 

[$$$4nothin]

If you come to work, come with a smile, a willing to help attitude, and without that chip that you seem to always have on your shoulder about what you don't have compared to everyone else.

This company is buying airplanes. This company is hiring. This company pays better than a LOT of companies. Focus on what you have and not on what you don't. Expecting JB to pay SWA pay and bennies at 13 years of age is like expecting SWA to have paid UAL pay and bennies when they were 13 years old. Guess what? There would be no SWA if they had done that.


A350

How about those of us that come to work with a smile every day, yet want to work to make JB a better place for all of us to work. I love JB, but that isn't keeping me from voluntering for commitees to make your life and my own better. You can thank me in a few years when your life in much better in every way because of it. Just curious which company in our Peer Set other than US Air (for a short while longer) we pay better than. (Entire compensation packages, not just E190 hourly pay rates). Do I expect JB to pay industry standard pay and bennefits even though we are only 13 years old. If course I do. Those who came before me worked hard for that and the company agreed to it. Not only did they agree to it, but it was there plan. So do I expect the company I work for to have the integrity to do what they promised to do. Heck ya I do. I am sure you demand that kind of integrity of yourself and all of those around you, so I am not sure why you don't expect and demand that of the company you work for. Again I am happy everyday and have no chip on my shoulder. I am just trying to help you and a couple thousand others with there careers.

 

[Splert]

If you come to work, come with a smile, a willing to help attitude, and without that chip that you seem to always have on your shoulder about what you don't have compared to everyone else.

Ever gonna finish your sentence stoner?

 

[$$$4nothin]

Ever gonna finish your sentence stoner?

Come on grammer police. We need his vote just like we need every other vote. Rather than calling this guy names while pushing him further to a no vote and furthur alienating him lets try something different, since your way obviously doesn't work. Why don't you explain to this guy in a rational manner why he needs to send an ALPA support card in, take part in the upcoming ALPA survey, vote yes to a CBA and better his career, and the career of thousands of others. Yes I understand after years of trying to explain this simple career saving decision to some of these guys over and over it gets very frustrating. I almost lost it trying to explain this to an ex comair guy in the pad last week. Lets just keep trying for a few more months and we can call them all names after the vote passes if it makes you feel better.

If you are frustrated enough to call guys names on an anonymous chat board I am sure you are frustrated enough to join the OC. PM me if you need details on how to volunteer.

 

[Splert]

Junior

She is a no voter under any circumstances.

If there was an in house drive she would be making up stories that the organizers are making thier boat payment with donations.

Just like last time.

 

[StarChecker]

Our own union will have the horsepower that WE provide. Nothing more, nothing less. I don't know about you, but I am a lot more willing to go to the mat when I spend my own money than when I spend someone elses'.

A350

We can't get 1200 pilots to cough up $10-15 bucks a month for the Blue Pilot Fund....to help distressed pilots! And you think you're gonna get guys to cough up the astronomical start-up costs of an in-house union? Now who's dreaming?

Secondly, if you could see this company from the inside out, as I have...it would be self-evident that an in-house union would be an impotent facade. Please volunteer for one our pilot committees and see for yourself.

JetBlue operates like any other airline. They are not evil, they are not virtuous. They are a business. As soon as you realize that this place is like any other airline, you will realize how vulnerable and powerless we are without professional representation. JetBlue has dozens of professional advocates for whom they pay millions of dollars. There's nothing wrong in demanding the same for our pilots.

Think about it...please.

 

[Frap]

^^^^^^^^^^^

What he said...

 

[Skank]

We can't get 1200 pilots to cough up $10-15 bucks a month for the Blue Pilot Fund....to help distressed pilots! And you think you're gonna get guys to cough up the astronomical start-up costs of an in-house union? Now who's dreaming?

Secondly, if you could see this company from the inside out, as I have...it would be self-evident that an in-house union would be an impotent facade. Please volunteer for one our pilot committees and see for yourself.

JetBlue operates like any other airline. They are not evil, they are not virtuous. They are a business. As soon as you realize that this place is like any other airline, you will realize how vulnerable and powerless we are without professional representation. JetBlue has dozens of professional advocates for whom they pay millions of dollars. There's nothing wrong in demanding the same for our pilots.



Think about it...please.

Well said. This is why I will support organizing. We owe it to ourselves. To hell with the "brotherhood" arguments. We all know that the "brotherhood" will try to eat us alive if we ever merge. We just have to do what we can to protect ourselves from the "brotherhood", and from falling prey to the company's endless stalling.

 

[xjt40]

No bongin here....just letting you guys vent your anguish about your poor career prospects and lack of pay, benefits, and retirement.

Instead of $itching your brains out on this stupid forum, why not spend some time with your family, plan a vacation, or work an extra day to earn some extra $$$.

If you come to work, come with a smile, a willing to help attitude, and without that chip that you seem to always have on your shoulder about what you don't have compared to everyone else.

This company is buying airplanes. This company is hiring. This company pays better than a LOT of companies. Focus on what you have and not on what you don't. Expecting JB to pay SWA pay and bennies at 13 years of age is like expecting SWA to have paid UAL pay and bennies when they were 13 years old. Guess what? There would be no SWA if they had done that.

Get an in house going. It will pass handsomely. I won't start it because I don't have the expertise or the inclination. I do have a checkbook, and I am prepared to use it.

Are you or do you just want to take another hit off the ALPA pipe?

A350

Plan a vacation? How senior are you? 6 Years at B6 and cant even get sept 2 vacation week! You like that or are you that super senior FO afraid to upgrade and you get a week off in the summer? I come in with a smile and have a blast each trip. I dont make standup PAs bashing AA because the furloughed me. I dont stoop down with blue gloves on to clean planes. Im around 30% behind my peers in compensation , my peers are both smaller and bigger. The last 3 captains I flew with are all going back to their previous carrier to be an FO again. Why would they do such a thing when they are Jetblue Captains hmmmmm. Maybe they have shelled out 5000 in medical costs this year or 1500 for meds. Maybe you should walk a mile in their shoes and then see if you still do that pathetic little standup routine or slap on the Blue finger condoms and go deep into those nasty seat back pockets. Point is just imagine someone that doesnt have it as good as you and live their life for a bit and see if you still shoot up that blue juice that makes it all so good.

 

[sligo1]

Plan a vacation? How senior are you? 6 Years at B6 and cant even get sept 2 vacation week! You like that or are you that super senior FO afraid to upgrade and you get a week off in the summer? I come in with a smile and have a blast each trip. I dont make standup PAs bashing AA because the furloughed me. I dont stoop down with blue gloves on to clean planes. Im around 30% behind my peers in compensation , my peers are both smaller and bigger. The last 3 captains I flew with are all going back to their previous carrier to be an FO again. Why would they do such a thing when they are Jetblue Captains hmmmmm. Maybe they have shelled out 5000 in medical costs this year or 1500 for meds. Maybe you should walk a mile in their shoes and then see if you still do that pathetic little standup routine or slap on the Blue finger condoms and go deep into those nasty seat back pockets. Point is just imagine someone that doesnt have it as good as you and live their life for a bit and see if you still shoot up that blue juice that makes it all so good.

Great post. This clown show on Youtube is a disgrace to all professional airline pilots. You want to be a comedian than so be it. You want to be an airline pilot- act like one. AA is reffered to often in the comedy show on Y.T., you will never see an AA pilot downgrade the profession as shown. Nor do customers want to see their pilot perform a circus side show.

 

[Dan Roman]

Just read another thread were that debate goes on so I figured I would toss in some perspective based on our experience from another relatively small airline that's ALPA. We (Hawaiian) are smaller (650 pilots) than JetBue yet there has been no down side from being ALPA at all. The support and resources available from ALPA National has been invaluable to us and instrumental in every contract negotiation we have had. Without it we would not have accomplished what we have, no question about it. It works, we have gone through tough concessionary times and more prosperous times, but the resources of a national union has been extremely important to preserving as much as we could during the tough times and those same resources have allowed us a very good contract that we would not have gotten with an in house union. As with any union, it's really the membership that ultimately drives the results, but don't let anyone tell you that the resources of a national union can't produce huge results.
JetBlue is here to stay, a union will not change anything except yield better working conditions and benefits for the pilot group and if you can keep the internal politics in check you'll do even better.

And this.....I can assure any JB pilot that is concerned about being a smaller ALPA carrier that it is not a problem. Those saying it is are simply wrong. I know the ALPA bashers like to spread that little bit of misinformation, but having ALPA as a resource has been nothing but positive for our 650 pilot sized airline.

 

[davessn763]

Who has a higher E190 pay rate Jet Blue or United?

 

[Fins Up]

Who has a higher E190 pay rate Jet Blue or United?

Looking at pay rates alone is a horrible argument. Why don't we compare healthcare, retirement, profit sharing, sick time and vacation accrual, and career salary expectation. Are there a lot of 12 year 190 CAs at United? I doubt it.

Pay rates are only 1 piece of the puzzle.

 

[B6Busdriver]

Who has a higher E190 pay rate Jet Blue or United?

Who has better retirement, health insurance, work rules, career expectations, merger language, profit sharing, etc?

JetBlue or United?

 

[pilot772]

Who has better retirement, health insurance, work rules, career expectations, merger language, profit sharing, etc?

JetBlue or United?

Lets put in another way how many United pilots have applications in at jetBlue? How many JetBlue Pilots have applications in at United?

 

[Splert]

Who has a higher E190 pay rate Jet Blue or United?

United.

 

[tailhookah]

The only in-house that has ever worked is SWAPA. That's only because the company helped set it up, fund it and supported it. Sure APA is an in-house but that only came after APA voted out Alpa which was an established union. It's easy to go from established national union to an in-house, since you already have a CBA, funding, committees, MEC/LEC reps and a working relationship with your pilots/company.

When you start off cold turkey and without company support (and especially a very hostile company stance from a NY based, Lorenzo disciple Barger) it's suicidal... like showing up to a gun fight w/ a Swiss Army knife.

Alpa is a turn key operation. Funding, support, legal, aeromedical and insurance. Fact... NO ONE legally has to pay a cent of dues money to any union until the date of the first CBA ratification... how long does it take for the average first contract in this industry??? About 2-4 years... so Mr. In-house union guy... who's gonna pay for all those dues that the BOB's refuse to pay during those 2-4 years in your in-house? Now w/ Alpa, they'll try to get you to pay dues, but will cover your expenses in the beginning.

Remember Colgan in KBUF??? Colgan had just voted in Alpa less than 6 weeks prior to that accident. They hadn't even finished voting in their MEC officers, yet Alpa was there w/ FULL support.

Now tell me, in-house union guys, BOBS and Alpa haters... Who would've done that for Colgan had they just voted in a in-house????

NO ONE... that's who.

Don't be soft in the head guys. This is your last chance. The end-game. Vote in your right to negotiate a better career... we've all seen how collaboration has worked... where's that premium again???? vote Alpa.

Tailhookah...

 

[B6Driver]

Another know-it-all.

 

[ATR-DRIVR]

Another know-it-all.

What part is untrue?

 

[Dizel8]

Why go with ALPA when we are having trouble getting 50% of our pilots to
vote yes? The in-house option would have far better participation. If a CBA is what we need go with the sure thing. Yes we all know its expensive......SWAPA did okay

Not happening