Is the 'worm turning'? Could SWA finally be going international (Canada)?

[GuppyWN]

Arrogance knows no boundaries.....

Outsource Winnepeg all you want, I'll be in Prague next week, lemme know how it all goes for your codeshare dreams!!

You don't always have to be a prick.

It's business and I want Southwest to win. I don't need Prague but I'm glad you're happy with it.

Gup

 

[1080P]

That's the reason I want to work there, someone else can have my share of the international flying that's the "life", rather go where my cell works and be overpaid.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Stare in the mirror SWA Friends.....

You are us 15 years ago......it all could come crashing down, glass houses and whatnot....Herb's gone, and probably the accountants are moving in eyeballing your "overpaid" "cell phone operable" airline and it's destinations and could easily get Republic to do it. Until the regionals get 2 aisles and a range better than 5 hours, my job's safe.....how's yours? Sure you could strike and mobilize the 5900 strong at SWAPA, but ya know at the end of the day, you can be replaced pretty easily. Anybody see that new C series? I'll bet it's just like a 737!!

For the record, I don't wish any bad on all SWA people, just the ones on here bragging about the money they make......pretty damn arrogant!!

 

[General Lee]

I am not all fired up. I agree with all of the above and that's not a bad thing.

To each his own, but with as much as you repeat the same thing over and over, one can only surmise that you are insanely jealous of WN guys.

I mean, WHY else would you repeat the same stuff, ad nauseum? Really, why do you care if I have LBB layovers (I haven't even landed there in a year or 2, much less overnighted)? You don't want to do it, great, you're not doing it. I don't mind them, since a hotel is a hotel is a hotel, and I am not at work to socialize or sightsee. I socialize on my days off and can sightsee on vacation on my own time.

International flying is over-rated. It's fun for a while, but in the end, I'll take my well paid, 12 day per month "regional" job (that covers the entire US) over 20+ years of sleep deprivation.


I am happy with my job at WN, and you say you're happy with yours, why not give it a rest? I shudder to think of what my life would be like had I gone to DAL in '98, but I'm glad your happy......

Oh, and I love ISP overnights. I've got free lunch in every direction (including my folks house) there. I wish I could get more of them!

Insanely jealous? Come on now. I just love it when I say that "I wouldn't want what you have except the better pay", and that sends you guys into a tailspin. It's like you all think you can walk on water and have the best situation around. Why again would I want multiple leg days in the same plane forever? I understand that FOR NOW you are the best paid pilots flying 737s. That is FANTASTIC for you, but not going to last forever. When the legacies get their acts together and the government allows labor to prevail (which is happening now with Becker being appointed to the NLRB) more often, legacy pay will go UP. Combine the better pay and more variety in routes, planes, trips, etc----the legacies will attract more pilots again like they did pre-9-11. SWA Captains were leaving for United pre-9-11----regardless of what you guys say---it happened.


You say a hotel is a hotel. That is what most SWA pilots say, since your trips don't allow for 24 hour layovers or as many downtown layovers. All you see is the hotel after your drunk stuper the night before thanks to the 1 2 3 rule. Since you have never experienced a longer, relaxing layover, then I can see why you don't understand. But wait, you may say "I would rather spend my time at home then on the road...." We have duty rigs that give us extra credit time for time away. Most of our 5 day trips to Hawaii are worth close to 30 hours---but only 20 of that is spent flying---a further 8 hours are credit, or free money. A 6 day trip to Europe is worth up to 40 hours with the credit. Do 2 of those a month, have up to 80 hours pay, 18 days off, and see Europe 4 times with nice layovers that have interesting things you CAN'T do in CLE or ISP. In the middle of that trip you fly to JFK, and have a Manhattan layover, which is great because everyone knows a special restaurant that makes their "favorite" meal. Can you see what I am talking about yet? You think a hotel is a hotel, and don't seem to care. (unless you are near your family in ISP) We have favorite places to go to see cool things, eat good food, etc, and not just for 12 hours. But to top it off, even our INTL category has domestic trips. If you do get tired of INTL flying, you can switch it up, fly a 3 or 4 day and see nice places like SAN, MIA, or BOS. It is all about variety, and the pay will come again, it is just a matter or time.

And, I am happy that you are happy with your job at WN. Great. It again amazes me that you guys get so riled up when someone states that he/she would not want what you have. But if you like ISP for your family, then by all means bid it and be happy. In the back of your mind though, you always know that ELP and LBB are somewhere out there, waiting for you. Regardless, you seem like a good guy, and I hope you do enjoy it there. Good luck to you.



Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

You don't always have to be a prick.

It's business and I want Southwest to win. I don't need Prague but I'm glad you're happy with it.

Gup

Sure I do Gup.....when I get a rise out of you, me being an out of character prick as you put it, makes it so much more enjoyable.

It is business, you are correct, unless there's a slot sale or swap, then it's just "unfair"! Good luck to SWA, somebody needs to do good in this mess of a career.

 

[General Lee]

General, you sound happy your company gave away more flying?

First of all, nothing has happened, yet. We don't even know what could be involved, and DALPA has to approve ANY codeshare. Also, as I stated earlier, DL mainline doesn't fly anywhere in Canada except Winnipeg (DC9s), and Calgary (319s), and if a codeshare would mean more passengers on BOTH sides going from here to there, then maybe Mainline would use larger planes than RJs. Again, all current flights to Vancouver, Toronto, Montreal, Edmonton, and Ottawa are on RJs. Those could be upgraded to DC9s or something larger if there is an influx of passengers. And, the CURRENT offer to WestJet from LGA (with slots provided by DL) has NO current DL service. (only Air Canada and AA Eagle fly LGA to YYZ now) Throw Westjet on there and that could hurt OneWorld and the Star Alliance. It is all about hurting the other alliance these days, which really can add revenue to a "member" carrier. Will SWA join an Alliance someday? You never know..... I wonder if you have the ability to deny that? You didn't have much say with Volaris or Westjet to begin with.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[dicko]

Arrogance knows no boundaries.....

Outsource Winnepeg all you want, I'll be in Prague next week, lemme know how it all goes for your codeshare dreams!!

Indeed you are correct. Prague rocks. I enjoyed the free ride in DAL biz class. My girlfriend says thanks for the biz seat also ( Z fare ). Five days in Prague on your dime ..... Delicious.

Meanwhile you are out earned by the LCC guys and we spend our days off eating your excellent food and sleeping in your nice comfy lie flat seats.

Thanks.

 

[dicko]

Currently RJs do the flying, and there are NO flights currently between LGA and Toronto (YYZ), where the first tie up is proposed. DL mainline hasn't flown to Canada (except YVR nonstop from ATL--too far for RJs) in years! Bye Bye--General Lee

You are a real gem :laugh:

 

[Tripower455]

Insanely jealous? Come on now. I just love it when I say that "I wouldn't want what you have except the better pay", and that sends you guys into a tailspin. It's like you all think you can walk on water and have the best situation around. Why again would I want multiple leg days in the same plane forever? I understand that FOR NOW you are the best paid pilots flying 737s. That is FANTASTIC for you, but not going to last forever. When the legacies get their acts together and the government allows labor to prevail (which is happening now with Becker being appointed to the NLRB) more often, legacy pay will go UP. Combine the better pay and more variety in routes, planes, trips, etc----the legacies will attract more pilots again like they did pre-9-11. SWA Captains were leaving for United pre-9-11----regardless of what you guys say---it happened.


You say a hotel is a hotel. That is what most SWA pilots say, since your trips don't allow for 24 hour layovers or as many downtown layovers. All you see is the hotel after your drunk stuper the night before thanks to the 1 2 3 rule. Since you have never experienced a longer, relaxing layover, then I can see why you don't understand. But wait, you may say "I would rather spend my time at home then on the road...." We have duty rigs that give us extra credit time for time away. Most of our 5 day trips to Hawaii are worth close to 30 hours---but only 20 of that is spent flying---a further 8 hours are credit, or free money. A 6 day trip to Europe is worth up to 40 hours with the credit. Do 2 of those a month, have up to 80 hours pay, 18 days off, and see Europe 4 times with nice layovers that have interesting things you CAN'T do in CLE or ISP. In the middle of that trip you fly to JFK, and have a Manhattan layover, which is great because everyone knows a special restaurant that makes their "favorite" meal. Can you see what I am talking about yet? You think a hotel is a hotel, and don't seem to care. (unless you are near your family in ISP) We have favorite places to go to see cool things, eat good food, etc, and not just for 12 hours. But to top it off, even our INTL category has domestic trips. If you do get tired of INTL flying, you can switch it up, fly a 3 or 4 day and see nice places like SAN, MIA, or BOS. It is all about variety, and the pay will come again, it is just a matter or time.

And, I am happy that you are happy with your job at WN. Great. It again amazes me that you guys get so riled up when someone states that he/she would not want what you have. But if you like ISP for your family, then by all means bid it and be happy. In the back of your mind though, you always know that ELP and LBB are somewhere out there, waiting for you. Regardless, you seem like a good guy, and I hope you do enjoy it there. Good luck to you.



Bye Bye--General Lee

I am not riled up. I couldn't care less if you or anyone else don't want to work at WN.

It's just that for YEARS now, you bring it up on any thread that even mentions WN (and many that don't), and often completely out of context.

Really, you need some new material! How about bashing code share? Age 65? Cabotage?

One can only conclude that you want desperately to be at WN and are lashing out at those you consider to have what you can't.

Face it....... you really want those nice long LBB or AMA overnights!

I am not interested in international flying and the inherent issues that come with it, and you aren't interested in flying domestic. Sounds like we are both happy to be where we are, so what's the issue? I wouldn't trade places with you, even if the pay scales were identical. My dad flew international for the first 21 years of his career, and went domestic when he finally upgraded. After seeing the marked difference in his demeanor, health and attitude when he stopped the international stuff, I concluded that it might be fun for a while, but not as a long term thing.

I turned down a UAL and DAL interview in my first few years at WN. I have never regretted either, even before 9/11. I can guarantee that the few guys that DID leave WN at that time are now sorry that they did (I have heard of a few FOs ;eaving, but not any Capts FWIW).

You don't see me or any other WN guy jumping on EVERY thread that even mentions DL and berating you for what and where you fly.

So why the constant obsession with WN?

 

[redflyer65]

I'll gladly continue to fly to the small cities making major airline pay while Delta Connection does that for you guys. To each his own.

 

[General Lee]

I am not riled up. I couldn't care less if you or anyone else don't want to work at WN.

It's just that for YEARS now, you bring it up on any thread that even mentions WN (and many that don't), and often completely out of context.

Really, you need some new material! How about bashing code share? Age 65? Cabotage?

One can only conclude that you want desperately to be at WN and are lashing out at those you consider to have what you can't.

Face it....... you really want those nice long LBB or AMA overnights!

I am not interested in international flying and the inherent issues that come with it, and you aren't interested in flying domestic. Sounds like we are both happy to be where we are, so what's the issue? I wouldn't trade places with you, even if the pay scales were identical. My dad flew international for the first 21 years of his career, and went domestic when he finally upgraded. After seeing the marked difference in his demeanor, health and attitude when he stopped the international stuff, I concluded that it might be fun for a while, but not as a long term thing.

I turned down a UAL and DAL interview in my first few years at WN. I have never regretted either, even before 9/11. I can guarantee that the few guys that DID leave WN at that time are now sorry that they did (I have heard of a few FOs ;eaving, but not any Capts FWIW).

You don't see me or any other WN guy jumping on EVERY thread that even mentions DL and berating you for what and where you fly.

So why the constant obsession with WN?

Thanks for that Dr. Phil......???? Only one can conclude WHAT again???? Where did you come up with that? Really.

First of all, I do fly domestic, sometimes. The ATL 767ER category has both. I am senior enough to fly just INTL, but I usually do about 75% INTL, and the remaining 25% domestic. Any open trip is fair game to swap for or pick up, and I usually start out with all INTL trips but give one away to trade for a domestic trip. That gives me the best of both worlds, and plenty of landings. The key here is variety, and that is something that DL has, and SWA does not. While your pay is great, you also know that you will have to WORK for it, and that means plenty of legs per day, which to me is tiring. Even the domestic trips I fly have one or maybe two legs a day max (I try to get 4 leg 4 day trips), which allows me to relax a bit. So do longer layovers, allowing me to sleep and enjoy the layover. Your compact 3 or 4 day trips are stuffed with legs, because that is how your business model works. That is pretty much what you have to look forward to FOREVER. If I wanted to do that, I would bid the MD88, which is another example of variety. Different fleet types do different missions, and your mission is to fly, a lot. That just isn't something most pilots really want to do. I thought the goal was to get paid a lot (which you do) to fly a little. As you get older, you will understand that. I wince if I see more than one leg per day. But, if you like that stuff, good for you. Enjoy it.

How long have you been on this board? I usually bring up LBB or something like that to get a rise out of guys like Gup or Redflyer69, but I usually state that I think SWA's pay is great, the stews are nice, and management is great (so far). There are a lot of things I like about SWA, but I just don't like the flying (legs) or the lack of variety. The people are great (mostly), but some people just don't want to do it. That really irks some people, and it is interesting to watch them become very defensive. I point out some perceived flaws, and I get jumped all over.

So, you enjoy your job, and I will enjoy mine. I am not insanely jealous of SWA pilots. I just like to see them get all bent when someone doesn't want what they have.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Delta Muscles Way to Canada Code-Share
By Ted Reed 03/31/10

ATLANTA (TheStreet) -- Delta may push ahead of Southwest to become the first U.S. carrier to code share with WestJet.

Calgary-based WestJet, a low-fare carrier built on the Southwest model, flies Boeing 737 jets to 69 cities in North American and the Caribbean. On its Web site, it says its goal is "to be one of the five most successful international airlines in the world."

In this regard, a code-share agreement with a U.S. carrier would be beneficial. In July 2008, Southwest and WestJet said they had reached an initial agreement on a code-share deal that would create a cross-border low-fare partnership.

But now CEO Gregg Saretsky said WestJet may code share first with Delta. Delta "has an interest," Saretsky said recently, in an interview with the Financial Post. "They have a capability. We like the Southwest partnership, but they've signaled to us that they're not going to be ready."

Before joining WestJet in June 2009, Saretsky worked at Alaska Airlines, where he led the development of an alliance strategy that included forming an alliance with Delta in 2008.

More recently, Delta and US Airways offered WestJet slots at New York's LaGuardia airport, as the devised slot exchange deal that would offer slots to four of North America's leading low-cost carriers. They excluded Southwest, the largest low-fare carrier.

Since acquiring Northwest to become the world's biggest airline, Delta has not rested on its laurels -- if anything, it has become more competitive. In Asia, it sought to replace American as partner to Japan Air Lines. Now, it is apparently seeking to elbow ahead of Southwest in Canada.
-- Written by Ted Reed in Charlotte, N.C.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Whataburger]

Insanely jealous? Come on now. I just love it when I say that "I wouldn't want what you have except the better pay", and that sends you guys into a tailspin. It's like you all think you can walk on water and have the best situation around. Why again would I want multiple leg days in the same plane forever? I understand that FOR NOW you are the best paid pilots flying 737s. That is FANTASTIC for you, but not going to last forever. When the legacies get their acts together and the government allows labor to prevail (which is happening now with Becker being appointed to the NLRB) more often, legacy pay will go UP. Combine the better pay and more variety in routes, planes, trips, etc----the legacies will attract more pilots again like they did pre-9-11. SWA Captains were leaving for United pre-9-11----regardless of what you guys say---it happened.


You say a hotel is a hotel. That is what most SWA pilots say, since your trips don't allow for 24 hour layovers or as many downtown layovers. All you see is the hotel after your drunk stuper the night before thanks to the 1 2 3 rule. Since you have never experienced a longer, relaxing layover, then I can see why you don't understand. But wait, you may say "I would rather spend my time at home then on the road...." We have duty rigs that give us extra credit time for time away. Most of our 5 day trips to Hawaii are worth close to 30 hours---but only 20 of that is spent flying---a further 8 hours are credit, or free money. A 6 day trip to Europe is worth up to 40 hours with the credit. Do 2 of those a month, have up to 80 hours pay, 18 days off, and see Europe 4 times with nice layovers that have interesting things you CAN'T do in CLE or ISP. In the middle of that trip you fly to JFK, and have a Manhattan layover, which is great because everyone knows a special restaurant that makes their "favorite" meal. Can you see what I am talking about yet? You think a hotel is a hotel, and don't seem to care. (unless you are near your family in ISP) We have favorite places to go to see cool things, eat good food, etc, and not just for 12 hours. But to top it off, even our INTL category has domestic trips. If you do get tired of INTL flying, you can switch it up, fly a 3 or 4 day and see nice places like SAN, MIA, or BOS. It is all about variety, and the pay will come again, it is just a matter or time.

And, I am happy that you are happy with your job at WN. Great. It again amazes me that you guys get so riled up when someone states that he/she would not want what you have. But if you like ISP for your family, then by all means bid it and be happy. In the back of your mind though, you always know that ELP and LBB are somewhere out there, waiting for you. Regardless, you seem like a good guy, and I hope you do enjoy it there. Good luck to you.



Bye Bye--General Lee

Average SWA 4day: 29-30 tfp
Important: Days at home with family
No as much: Days with crew at "special" eateries.

Just had a delta fo on jumpseat who's 5day to South America paid less credits than my 3day, do you think that's good?

 

[flint4xx]

24 hours in xxx...

I'll be back home before you lobby.

 

[General Lee]

Average SWA 4day: 29-30 tfp
Important: Days at home with family
No as much: Days with crew at "special" eateries.

Just had a delta fo on jumpseat who's 5day to South America paid less credits than my 3day, do you think that's good?

A 5 day to South America may pay less than 29 or 30 "trips", but about 1000 hot chicks swarm all over you, and you get to sleep all day and lounge around the pool at a very nice hotel (for security reasons). Yeah, I think I would take a 27 hour 5 day trip than your 4 day with more than 20 legs. If I wanted 20 legs on me, I would go to South America. (women BTW) Bad example Whataburger. I bet you and DL pilot are equally exhausted, but for different reasons.


Bye Bye---General Lee