Interesting take on Song

[Race Pilot]

Just remember in the future JB is perfect,everyone is happy and management never makes any mistakes.The sun always rises and sets on them and since the begginning of aviation they are the only airline to do everything better than everyone else.

Why did it take so long to figure this out???

Signed....A low time touchy pilot.

 

[dgs]

No. No. Mr. Intruder. YOU are the idiot! You are one of the few people who routinely posts lies and rumors about jetBlue.

To everybody else -- Since I know Intruder will not understand any more of this post, the rest of this post is addressed to everybody else who reads these forums.

If you take a look at what Intruder calls being "touchy" you will probably notice that we are responding to the lies and rumors that are posted by the likes of Intruder and other posters. We constantly have to set the record straight! Some are innocent questions posted by people who simply don't understand how we can do what we do. Others are simply flame bait. Well... Integrity is a core value at jetBlue and it is important for us to know and tell the truth. We make a lot of effort to set the record straight for those who may not understand what tripe other people are spouting. We are proud of our company and don't want you to misunderstand us based on what the uninformed are saying.

You also need to realize that Intruder has had his feelings hurt because we wouldn't hire him. I'm sure it is obvious to everybody who reads these forums that his personality would never fit here, and that's probably why he didn't get hired. However, you have to realize that by bashing jetBlue he somehow feels better about himself and justifies the fact that he didn't get hired. Of course, it kinda makes you wonder why he interviewed here if he hates us so much!!! It's all sour grapes. I wish this board had a "ban poster" function like the old software for this forum had over a year and a half ago. Then it would be easy to ignore the flaming Intruder, General Lee and others who don't bring much but negativity to these forums.

There was a brief period where we hired a few people who probably didn't have much more than 3,000 hours. It was only for a few months, and only a small percentage of the people we hired in thise months. The earliest guys were VERY experienced, many with A320 Captain time. We have been able to hire plenty of experience since then. During that short time we were a new company and didn't have a record to stand on at that time. It was an opportunity of a lifetime for a select few to fly bigger jets at an airline. However, all those guys probably have 1,500-2,000 of A320 time under their belt at jetBlue now. Not exactly what I would call "inexperienced." Some of those people didn't make it through Capt upgrade the first time because they weren't ready. One thing you can be assured of is that we have some pretty high standards for upgrade, so if they aren't ready, they wait.

Yes we love it here at jetBlue and we aren't ashamed to say so! Why do we say so loudly and frequently? Because we are looking for people who share our core values to join us. We want people who like to have fun in their job. I can't keep from smiling every day I go to fly. I'm very proud to work here and thank God every day for the opportunity. I don't know anybody here who thinks that they are "God's chosen few." We do, however, thank God for being chosen to work at such a great company. BIG DIFFERENCE! I don't think you'll find anybody here who thinks it is "perfect," but we are all working hard to make it that way and management is working WITH us, not against us to make it happen!!!

 

[Jeff G]

Intruder,

You're a one-note poster, but you have an annoying habit of spreading bad information so I find myself forced to respond. Since JB turned you down (I wonder why?) you've made few posts of any substance other than to run down the airline and its people. I'm very sorry you weren't able to find employment, but maybe it's time to swallow your bitterness and move on. You did know that JB hires for attitude? Maybe you didn't get the memo.

Until recently, the total time minimum has never been lower than 3000 hrs. It was lowered to accommodate military pilots with a lot of experience for their total hours. And at the beginning, when you say the airline was hiring low timers, it was 4000 hrs and a lot of large jet PIC experience. Now the TT minimum is indeed 1500 hrs, but unless you're an experienced military pilot just try to get an interview with that time. The average flight time is much, much higher.

For a period of time, from about July 2000 to June 2001, JetBlue interviewed every pilot who applied and met the minimums (still 3000 hrs, 500 PIC or 1500 SIC turbine, 1000 large airplane time) and hired a few who were close to the minimum. Of course, most had considerably more time. Before this period, in order to get the airline running, pilots with a great deal of experience were hired. After this period, interview invitations were made on a competitive basis, which was fierce. Of course, since 9/11 competition has been extremely fierce, and the experience level of the average newhire is very high.

So where does that leave us? There were some pilots (I was one) who were hired during that interview-'em-all period, and have since successfully upgraded, who probably couldn't even get an interview now, post 9/11. And your point is...?

If your point is that some of us "chosen few" (whatever that means) couldn't cut it in today's interview environment, then you'd be correct. I've already said so. I know darn well that even with a fairish amount of turbine PIC (1200 t-prop, 800 jet), an A320 type, 1300 hrs in the A320 (and current), and 5500 total hrs, I'd probably be dead in the water in the current environment. If you think that we're unappreciative of the opportunity, you'd be wrong. I thank God every day that I'm able to do what I do, and I don't know anyone who takes it for granted, especially now.

But if you think that such "low" time (and with 5500 hrs and 2000 turbine PIC I'm definitely on the low end of average total experience among JB's captains) makes me or anyone I fly with unsafe, which is what you seem to be implying, well then you've crossed the line. You have no data other than your own highly suspect judgment to back it up. Please enlighten us further as to your own personal objections so that we can all judge your credibility for ourselves.

 

[Networ-King]

Jeff G, dgs, Race Pilot,

Guys..... come on..... why the heck do let people like intruder get to you like this. Everyone already knows about JB and what kind of a company it has become. Let me redirect your efforts towards another question. Now you can easily look to the left and see Im not new to the A-320. Been there done that, its a great plane, moved on, got furloughed, blah blah blah. I myself am trying to get into JB, but have been unsuccessfull.... I believe its due to the ....ahem.... civilian (only) background. I recently talked to a couple of JB buddies of mine and they tell me that you open time slots are being given to guys sitting reserve. Is this true and is it going to go back to normal or will management keep giving open time out to these guys to keep costs down? These guys have also mentioned that talks of unionization have been circulating. Due to scheduling snafoo's and what have you. I won't get into the specifics unless you ask me to. Im not trying to talk down on ANY airline whatsoever, just trying to find out the real story. This whole thing about the "perfect" airline is nonexistent and anyone that believes there is such a place is a fool.

ps Is your cp still wanting HUD's in the A-320? I met him once (the f18 driver) and thats what he said to me. I told him to push the FPA button and save himself some money.

 

[Skank]

Our CP was never an F-18 driver, but I know who you mean. We still don't need ALPA, but thanks anyway. Yes, we are a little sensitive to the ramblings of the (anal) Intruder and his type. And do you really think the FAA would buy off on a bunch of 2000 hour guys flying around as off the street Captains at a start-up airline? I guess you don't know too much. Sorry, this was a combined answer to some of the above posts. I meant no offense to most of you, and just a little to Intruder.

 

[SpeedBird]

Perfection???

Newtor-King,

The JB folks who post on these boards are not saying, or intimating that working for jetBlue is the end all of airlne flying, and that the company has nothing to improve on. The vast majority of people working here know what its like to be treated poorly, or viewed as an adversary by management in their prior lives at Airline X. For this same group of people coming over to jetBlue has been a wonderful experience because the culture is so much different and better than where they have been before. With the current state of affairs in this industry, this is a welcome refuge for those lucky enough to find employment here. I'll let the others speak for themselves, but that's how I see things.

I listened to John Owen (CFO) speak at a public industry forum the other day. He was asked the question about what will happen when jetBlue employees unionize. He stated that it is the goal of management to prevent the need for employees to unioinize. Meaning that managment must be open, responsive, and cooperative to the needs of their employees when problems arise. As this young airline grows these things surely occur. The difference is that jetBlue makes it a priority to keep in touch with what's going on, and make adjustments as necessary.

Everyone here knows the kind of devastation that can happen when managment and employees lose trust in each other. The carnage that is playing out at almost all the other major airlines today is the final act of a long-playing saga of a culture of mistrust and animosity between the two camps.

Bottomline, jetBlue management must never fail to maintain the trust of their employees, or treat them fairly. If they do it will be their only opportunity to do so. So far they've walked the talk and put up when needed. In return, the employees have worked very hard to provide superior service to their customers, and perpetuate a very enjoyable working environment. The results have been dramatic with the success and growth of our company in the last three years.

Now, jetBlue will always have its minority of detractors and pessimists who feel the need to stir things up with the employees, but until something material happens that cause the majority of employees to feel that they we're being taken advantage of, it is very unlikely at this time that a large-scale unionization effort will gain any traction.

As for your desire to join jetBlue, I wish you the very best. It is worth all your time and effort to make that happen, but don't believe the crew room gossip that jetBlue only hires military this, or civilian that. You won't find a more fair and unbiased hiring process in the industry. It will all come down to you and your attitude. You obviously have the technical skills, but can you exude the five core values that the airline culture promotes?

Good luck to you and everyone else who shares your goals.

 

[JayDub]

Impressive!

Intruder One,

Do you know how proud I am of you??? You made two (count them, 2) posts about jetBlue without ever once mentioning D.U.I., or free airplanes! Man, you get a gold star!!!

For the record, in the early days, the hiring folks decided to hire people with more EFIS time to avoid having to spend extra money on training. Before you can upgrade, you have to get through initial. Seems the folks with the hardest time getting through initial were guys with 10,000+ hours and no glass time. All this means is you can't hold onto old stereo types about what should be successful. For what it's worth.

JayDub

 

[General Lee]

Speedbird,

I am so glad that you found a place to work that will not "screw" with you guys, ever. That really is amazing. It is cool that when you grow and thrive that work rules will not be broken or ignored. I think it is great that when things get to be a lot more profitable for your airline, they will readily share it with you---and all of you will be making well over $150,000 a year, even the FO's.
Your trip pairings will be perfect----with comfortable overnights in hotels that are not scary---like the FLL beach Hotel. (nice location, but slimey) It is awesome that should you ever accidentally do something wrong, management will stick up for you and not fire your a$$. If that really is what your airline is like, I think I would leave mine----well, maybe not---I like Intl flying.

Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Intruder One]

To Race Pilot:

I believe you are the only one that took my post in the spirit to which it was written....congradulations,as for the rest of you,GROW UP,4 or 5 post going on and on nothing except to justify the low tme pilot thing.Boy I did hit a nerve.I believe (Race Pilot) is going to be the only adult working over there.

 

[SpeedBird]

General Lee,

Your sacasm is bleeding through. Please go back and read my post again. I said that as long as nothing "material" occurs then issues can be resolved without the need of standing up a union.

JetBlue has faced all of the "hypotheticals" you've mentioned, and so far everyone involved has figured out a way to resolve potential pitfalls and keep moving forward.

I NEVER SAID that it will always remain so. The ball is in management's court, and the employees must also act responsibly to speak up when things aren't right without asking for the moon and the stars. It's a work in progress. I'll tell you something, we are all observing (and taking notes) the soap opera being played out among all you legacy airlines which have made it popular to utterly destroy what little human capital still remains in this industry. Both you and your respective management team must accept responsibility for this tremendous failure. To claim otherwise is to act like an ostrich.

So tell who's naive general?

Your tired old pontifications about our "low" pay and benefits are playing very poorly these days. Who wants the problems that it has brought to your end of the industry. Things such as arrogance, worker class envy, customer alienation, and institutionalized denial of capital market forces has left a very stark contrast to your "pot of gold at the end of the rainbow" scenario.

I don't want what you're selling so go pile it up at someone else's doorstep.

 

[General Lee]

Speedbird,

I don't really see anything that you stated. All of the employees that I have talked to don't blame us for what is going on. They are all in a shell with management----hence Leo stating,"None of the nonunion people will take a pay cut..." We don't alienate people at all. All of the people that I have thanked getting off our 767-300ER's seem happy to fly with us and don't ridicule us etc. I mostly read things about us in the press---denouncing Labor as the "fault of all bad things," even though we don't make any of the big decisions and are only a "fixed cost" with a contract. I have no clue what you are talking about. The only thing I am upset about is the current furlough situation, which could be fixed here in short order with an arbitration ruling coming out soon, and the unwillingness of the Comair pilots to help our furloughs when we helped them during their strike. When I go to work I have a great experience, flying a big plane to neat places with interesting people. I care about my fellow pilots, and try to help the furloughs. I bring home a great wage and hope other people can do the same someday. I am proud to be employed by Delta and feel lucky at the same time, knowing that I could have been in a different situation. I have no doubt that Delta will ride this current situation out and be a powerful force in the future. Believe what you want about my situation, but you really have no idea. My pot of gold is just that, and maybe you will have one too. You don't want the "pile" on your doorstep? Just wait my friend, it might just happen to you. Let's see how you handle it when the strife begins. Regardless, I still love my job.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[dgs]

Intruder -- You are not "hitting a nerve." It's called spreading lies! You do a disservice to everybody who reads these forums and we spend a lot of time correcting your misinformation. Sure would be nice if you would just go away and quit posting flame bait. You didn't get hired. Get over it and move on! Boy I miss that "ban poster" option!

 

[Intruder One]

To DGS:

Too bad ........I'm sorry you don't like my post but this site is open to all opinions not just the ones that agree with you,get over it.If working at JB means putting up with people like you they did me a favor.

 

[Jeff G]

You're entitled to your opinion. Heck, I solicited your opinion a few posts back, but you ignored it. But deliberately spreading bad information isn't exercising your sacred first amendment right to free speech, it's just lying. Fortunately, the readers on this board have enough intelligence to see for themselves the kind of poster you are, so I don't need to bother with your posts any further. See ya

 

[LearLove]

www.flysong.com

Whats with the ugly kelly green paint?

Also the softcore porno music on the web site has got to go.

 

[dgs]

Jeff G -- Thanks for saving me the effort of responding to Intruder again. Couldn't have said it better myself.

LearLove -- I had to go back to the website to hear the music and I had to laugh when I heard the smooth melody with the pounding beat!! Maybe they will play that as boarding music to get everybody "in the mood!"