If everyone else can do it, why can't ASA?

73belair

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Why in the world do we have intergration, and why is it still going to be in the next contract?
Who else has this sort of thing? We at ASA don't know what we are going to be doing for the first 3 days of EVERY month. (pretty much no matter what) The company may give you a trip, they may not. Said trip may be worth while (i.e. paid time = time you are giving up) or it may not. (i.e. One leg out, 18hr overnight, one leg back, killing 2 days of your life)
Why would our union even consider keeping this sort of thing here? NO ONE likes it.
There are many other things that we do that the company says they can't get along without, but there are maybe 100s of other airlines that do exactly what we ask for now, and have for some time.

Mostly a rant... But still pi$$es me off!
 

zugzug

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intergration

24 and 7, 100hr, cdo, days off, etc....
 

PCL_128

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We have it at Pinch-Nickle too. I know why you hate it so much. I'm in the top 10 on the DTW FO bid list and I still can't get the 1st and 2nd off unless I force a 30&7 problem. It will be going away though if we ever get a decent pref-bid system on the property.
 

generaltso

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PCL_128 said:
It will be going away though if we ever get a decent pref-bid system on the property.
So will a lot of other things (ability to create conflicts)
 

180ToTheMarker

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Who says we will have intergration in the next contract? EVERYONE I have flown with lately says we have to get the following or they will vote no.

-Eliminate Integtration
-Eliminate the "occurence" system
-100% retro pay
-Complete overhaul of reserve system
-Open time pot time and a half pay

The vote won't pass without at least those things being fixed.
 

IAHERJ

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hmmm?
Looks more and more like you will get whatever SkyWest currently has. The mediator has taken a 2 month vacation and rumor has it that SkyWest is still a serious bidder for ASA in a possible Delta CH.11. Look closely at their "contract" and I think that may predict your future scheduling rules at least for a while.

Could be wrong.

IAHERJ
 

Palerider957

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180ToTheMarker said:
Who says we will have intergration in the next contract? EVERYONE I have flown with lately says we have to get the following or they will vote no.

-Eliminate Integtration
-Eliminate the "occurence" system
-100% retro pay
-Complete overhaul of reserve system
-Open time pot time and a half pay

The vote won't pass without at least those things being fixed.
"The vote," at this rate won't take place until 2016.

I still hear pilots nursing broken planes around, fudging times (i.e. SLC) to give the company stellar on time perf., and generally doing everything they can to keep the Titanic on course.

The only way we will EVER see a new contract (let alone a better contract), is by bringing the company to it's knees. This is the ONLY way Delta will notice us--banners over the stadium are cute, but ineffective.

Skips letters tell us how "well" the company is doing, with record loads, good performence stats, etc. Why? Because pilots aren't putting any pressure on the comany.

As a group, we are a bunch of patsy school girls, and we are getting what we deserve.:mad:
 

Rook

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PCL_128 said:
We have it at Pinch-Nickle too. I know why you hate it so much. I'm in the top 10 on the DTW FO bid list and I still can't get the 1st and 2nd off unless I force a 30&7 problem. It will be going away though if we ever get a decent pref-bid system on the property.
Yeah I hear we're pretty close to getting pref bid. What's it been now 2? 2 1/2 years?
 

MetroSheriff

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Palerider957 said:
"The vote," at this rate won't take place until 2016.

I still hear pilots nursing broken planes around, fudging times (i.e. SLC) to give the company stellar on time perf., and generally doing everything they can to keep the Titanic on course.

As a group, we are a bunch of patsy school girls, and we are getting what we deserve.:mad:
Yeah, right SLC. SLC operates about .05 % of the system block hours and you its the SLC pilots that are dragging things down. Its all pilots in the redneck mecca that have the power to affect change. If broken airplanes are getting flown and times are being massaged, maybe TEAM AY TEE ELL could put alittle effort into slowing things down.

All y'all are the ones that be havin' the power yo'!
 

PCL_128

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Rook said:
Yeah I hear we're pretty close to getting pref bid. What's it been now 2? 2 1/2 years?
Hehe. Yeah, what was the deadline on the old pref-bid LOA? Something like last quarter of '02 or something? Moving right along. ;)
 

Palerider957

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MetroSheriff said:
Yeah, right SLC. SLC operates about .05 % of the system block hours and you its the SLC pilots that are dragging things down. Its all pilots in the redneck mecca that have the power to affect change. If broken airplanes are getting flown and times are being massaged, maybe TEAM AY TEE ELL could put alittle effort into slowing things down.

All y'all are the ones that be havin' the power yo'!
Fair enough. I didn't mean SLC pilots are the only problem. ATL has plenty of company bi.tches....some of them are seriously damaged goods, many more are apathetic.

I guess when your most senior guys are Bandit retreads who never thought they would fly a jet, or make the money they are making; and your most junior pilots are barely old enough to buy a beer, and "just love to fly, especially a JET!" This leaves the middle group, and clearly they are not stepping up to the plate....IMHO.
 

73belair

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One of the ALPA updates I was reading was talking about how they were trying to make intergration easier for the pilots to control by some sort of bidding. Meaning to me that they still have no problem with keeping it in the contract.
 

ATR-DRIVR

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mike,
It's the transition from one month to the next. Say the line itself starts on the 5th with the first pairing - ie - day line, 2 day, 3 day or 4 day. The will put an "I" on the four days prior to see if they can stick more flying on you and keep you under the 97.5 hr cap for the month. They are not counted as days off until the final schedules come out. If for some reason they don't fill in a trip (rare) they would end up being off days. Though most of the time if there is not a 30 in 7 issue forward or back they will put something in there, basically to make sure you don't get any extra time off. You actually have the "option" to "prefer to fly" or "prefer not to fly" for integration. The usual scenario is those who prefer to pick up extra time for whatever reason don't get any and those who don't want to get integrated to get some extra days off usually get hammered. The worst is (for me anyway) when you are a line holder who DOES NOT DO NAPS and have been getting early sign ins for several months, getting stuck with some nap with barely the minimum ground time, 5 or 6 hrs.
Some people like it, some don't. Hope that explains it.
 

michael707767

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ATR-DRIVR said:
mike,
It's the transition from one month to the next. Say the line itself starts on the 5th with the first pairing - ie - day line, 2 day, 3 day or 4 day. The will put an "I" on the four days prior to see if they can stick more flying on you and keep you under the 97.5 hr cap for the month.
So basically, if as you say you have a line with the first trip on the 5th, they can just arbitrarily stick some flying on your line prior to that? Wow. That violates basic seniority. I would imagine if you have something with the family going on in the first 4 days of the month, there is almost no point in bidding it off. Thanks for the explanation, I understand why all concern and talk about it.
 

PCL_128

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IFLYASA

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michael707767 said:
So basically, if as you say you have a line with the first trip on the 5th, they can just arbitrarily stick some flying on your line prior to that? Wow. That violates basic seniority. I would imagine if you have something with the family going on in the first 4 days of the month, there is almost no point in bidding it off. Thanks for the explanation, I understand why all concern and talk about it.
Actually it's "supposed" to be based on inverse seniority. Crew planning takes those who chose to be integrated first, and usually add higher block trips on their integration days. Then it goes to the most junior line holder. They see what can be added, then to the next person, and so on. Ususally the really senior pilots don't get integrated. But I have heard the #1 pilot getting inegrated.
 

michael707767

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IFLYASA said:
Actually it's "supposed" to be based on inverse seniority. Crew planning takes those who chose to be integrated first, and usually add higher block trips on their integration days. Then it goes to the most junior line holder. They see what can be added, then to the next person, and so on. Ususally the really senior pilots don't get integrated. But I have heard the #1 pilot getting inegrated.


Hey, no matter how you slice it, it sounds like BS to me.
 

Stifler's Mom

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It is, especially since that technology exists at Delta already. I find it hard to believe that by being owned by Delta for 5 or 6 years now, archaic processes are still being used here.


(Still waiting for computer sign in)
 

atrdriver

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michael707767 said:
So basically, if as you say you have a line with the first trip on the 5th, they can just arbitrarily stick some flying on your line prior to that? Wow. That violates basic seniority. I would imagine if you have something with the family going on in the first 4 days of the month, there is almost no point in bidding it off. Thanks for the explanation, I understand why all concern and talk about it.
To add to what ATR-DRIVR said, you have ZERO control over the first 3 or 4 days of your month, unless your bid line already flies you on those days. If the company can put flying on an integration day, and keep you legal, they will. Often it is 1 round trip blocked to less than 2 hours, just to make you come in and avoid having you get that magical extra day off.
 
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