I find that type of attitude a sad premonition for the future of your merger with XJT

[Bushhatesyou]

The reality is, that this product has been out there for 5 or 6 years in it's present form. It has been demonstrated at many airlines, and employee groups. To date, not one company has bought the product. That speaks for itself!

Comair used an earlier version of this product as their first PBS system when it was called SLICK bidding system. After a couple of years of utter frustration and contempt, they were able to procure a different bidding system. Part of the complaint was that an award could not be explained--due to the award engine and the way that it worked. Why did they 86 it?

From what has been stated, this Company has no customers, no other products, no evidence that they can support the product, and other than a piece of paper that says they exist, no place of business that could be construed that it is even an established enterprise. It's simply a one-man show and the one man does not even live in this country. Please----I have some snake oil I want to sell you!

The product has only been demonstrated on a PC, and not in a live environment with 400-500 pilots bidding on it at one time! In other words, there is no evidence that this even works, no matter what the chosen logic programmed into the software is. It is still on the drawing board after 6 or 7 years, with NO Customers! Do you want to risk your schedule and quality of life on a beta product?

NOT ME!

Are you a current employee of ExpressJet? Why and what is your motivation for being a disciple of an unproven, and unsold product? Are you getting a bird-dog fee or cut?

Pretty much everything you've said here is not fact, or has been spun Fox News Style.

Ask the guys at Sun Country (pre-bankruptcy) about SmartPref and how it worked in a live system. How about the narrowbody Luftansa guys. Not to mention there are a couple of other U.S. airlines in various stages of testing for their operations (not many line bidders left, should be easy to figure out who)

Not sure what the SLICK program has to do with SmartPref, but show me how they are connected, I couldn't find anything.

What I did find was the developer of SmartPref is the same guy who designed the first PBS system for TWA. TWA pilots loved this new program, this was before management saw the potential to use PBS as a way to harm pilots.

So since past history is important to you, I would consider the SmartPref lineage comes from a bidding system that allows crews a better QOL.

 

[ASAFOE120]

Well, I just got my June schedule and turned my 7 days of vacation into 18 in a row. 2 easy 4 days on both ends. And why would I want to change my PBS for something else?

 

[j3tdr1v3r]

Well, I just got my June schedule and turned my 7 days of vacation into 18 in a row. 2 easy 4 days on both ends. And why would I want to change my PBS for something else?

Well, my buddy got his June schedule nearly 2 weeks ago and turned his 7 days of vacation into 18 in a row. 1 easy 4 day and a 2 day totaling 25 days off for the month. And why would we want to change our line bidding for something else?

 

[ASAFOE120]

Plenty of senior guys hold schedules like your buddy around here. And it doesnt matter to me one way or another if you want to come over to pbs. I am very pleased with the schedules I get with our pbs and was just stating that. From what ive been told, yall get your schedules and just swap and drop trips to improve it. Well, unless there is some "magic bullet" in this new ta, about 95% of your swaps will not be approved due to low coverage and NO trips will be dropped. Thats just how lean Brad and Jerry run this place. Most likely from what I hear, the TA will have a pbs system in it and so I would think you would want a system that is proven and HONORS seniority.

And as far as that crap goes about just keeping us separate if we cant agree on pbs, in case you havent been paying attention in the last however many years since Inc purchased us, Jerry loves the whipsaw. And i can PROMISE you than when the cut happens, it ALWAYS favors the Skywest Airlines side. ALWAYS!

 

[79%N1]

Had one week vaca at the end of April, and one at the beginning of may. I have not worked since April 12th, and I'm off until May 29th for a 3 day. 36 days in a row.

 

[IBNAV8R]

Had one week vaca at the end of April, and one at the beginning of may. I have not worked since April 12th, and I'm off until May 29th for a 3 day. 36 days in a row.

And, soft time (vacation touching with pay) will be the first thing to get whittled out of any contract. The ONLY reason you guys are getting more flying is because you undercut OO and EV/Crj on crew costs. When that's no longer the case, well, "Have a nice day."

 

[j3tdr1v3r]

Plenty of senior guys hold schedules like your buddy around here. And it doesnt matter to me one way or another if you want to come over to pbs. I am very pleased with the schedules I get with our pbs and was just stating that. From what ive been told, yall get your schedules and just swap and drop trips to improve it. Well, unless there is some "magic bullet" in this new ta, about 95% of your swaps will not be approved due to low coverage and NO trips will be dropped. Thats just how lean Brad and Jerry run this place.

No offense, but that just shows that you don't understand our line bidding system, the line improvement windows, and our bad day worse day provisions. Because if you did understand it, you would know that none of what you listed applies, and nothing is there to be "denied due to staffing" in the manner which you suggest.
Like I said in a previous post, SmartPref may, or may not, be the answer. One thing is certain tho (according to extensive subcommittee research)... Your system is a huge step back for us, and no "negotiated improvements" will make it not be a step back for us. So... Do you want to work together for a solution, or tell 2800 of us to go get bent?

 

[Freebrd]

hell yeh "get bent"

 

[ASADriver]

Your LIW's aren't seniority based. That won't fly here.

 

[79%N1]

And, soft time (vacation touching with pay) will be the first thing to get whittled out of any contract. The ONLY reason you guys are getting more flying is because you undercut OO and EV/Crj on crew costs. When that's no longer the case, well, "Have a nice day."

Ummm, I work for LASA on the crj. I am supporting your arguement........Had a nice day at the lake, thanks!

 

[Nevets]

After all these days of letting you air everything out, most of you are still hung up on the writer or me trying to make it personal. Typical ad homenim argument. The point is that your MEC is not doing its due diligence. Have they even polled you? Have they written any blastmails explaining their research? Have they shown you any evidence that documents ANY research? Supposedly they looked at it two years ago. I'll call bs on that unless someone can produce a document that shows the supposed extensive research that went into looking at smartpref. And then show me where this document says why it's not good. This letter shows that your guys were just pretending to look at it this last time only after months of dragging their feet. And to this day, they have not done anything other than what this letter says. Which is to say, nothing. They won't even give our MEC the professional courtesy to give smartpref a real hard honest look.

 

[sweptback]

Nevets,

As a former rep, you have to know that the pilots elect the LEC representatives to represent them. A good rep has his or her finger on the pulse of the pilot group and does not need to poll the membership just to see how the winds are blowing. The only poll that they work off of during contract time is the contract survey, and you and I both know that if a MEC "goes rogue" and starts negotiating for things not ranked highly in the survey, that MEC will not last long.

Now, I am not privy to this information, but I can infer from the lack of action by the ASA MEC that the contract surveys did not rank "changing our PBS vendor" as a high priority, or even a priority at all. If the ASA pilots are not interested in changing, then why on earth should we change?

I support my reps, and I support my MEC. As the ASA pilot group is familiar with PBS, a better bidding system would sell itself over here. The fact that, as a whole, we are indifferent to negative on SmartPref is pretty telling from our side.

You can try and convince us, even call us names, but the bottom line is, our MEC, our choice. It's up for those on the MEC to duke it out between the two airlines.

 

[j3tdr1v3r]

Sweptback,

That's nice and all, but the reps also have a stake in the pilot group as a whole, and in the process of obtaining a JCBA. Wanna guess where "keep our line bidding" ranked on our polls? So should they just ignore the process of joint negotiations and say screw you, we're keeping what we got!

 

[jetfueljunkey]

Nevets,

As a former rep, you have to know that the pilots elect the LEC representatives to represent them. A good rep has his or her finger on the pulse of the pilot group and does not need to poll the membership just to see how the winds are blowing. The only poll that they work off of during contract time is the contract survey, and you and I both know that if a MEC "goes rogue" and starts negotiating for things not ranked highly in the survey, that MEC will not last long.

Now, I am not privy to this information, but I can infer from the lack of action by the ASA MEC that the contract surveys did not rank "changing our PBS vendor" as a high priority, or even a priority at all. If the ASA pilots are not interested in changing, then why on earth should we change?

I support my reps, and I support my MEC. As the ASA pilot group is familiar with PBS, a better bidding system would sell itself over here. The fact that, as a whole, we are indifferent to negative on SmartPref is pretty telling from our side.

You can try and convince us, even call us names, but the bottom line is, our MEC, our choice. It's up for those on the MEC to duke it out between the two airlines.

"as a former rep" were you only listening to the loudest pilots in the crew room or did you really have the pulse of the majority of your pilots... my guess is you listened to the loudest .03 percent in the crew room and based your "pulse of the pilots" off of that..

 

[nerjdriver]

And, soft time (vacation touching with pay) will be the first thing to get whittled out of any contract. The ONLY reason you guys are getting more flying is because you undercut OO and EV/Crj on crew costs. When that's no longer the case, well, "Have a nice day."

We aren't pay protected for the trips that are dropped because of vacation. Wrong again!

 

[Nevets]

Nevets,

As a former rep, you have to know that the pilots elect the LEC representatives to represent them. A good rep has his or her finger on the pulse of the pilot group and does not need to poll the membership just to see how the winds are blowing. The only poll that they work off of during contract time is the contract survey, and you and I both know that if a MEC "goes rogue" and starts negotiating for things not ranked highly in the survey, that MEC will not last long.

Now, I am not privy to this information, but I can infer from the lack of action by the ASA MEC that the contract surveys did not rank "changing our PBS vendor" as a high priority, or even a priority at all. If the ASA pilots are not interested in changing, then why on earth should we change?

I support my reps, and I support my MEC. As the ASA pilot group is familiar with PBS, a better bidding system would sell itself over here. The fact that, as a whole, we are indifferent to negative on SmartPref is pretty telling from our side.

You can try and convince us, even call us names, but the bottom line is, our MEC, our choice. It's up for those on the MEC to duke it out between the two airlines.

As a former rep I can tell you that what you said is BS. You have hundreds o pilots. There is no pulse to take by word of mouth, email, crew room visits etc. Regardless, the point is that you don't know if there is a better PBS system! Your MEC won't let it sell itself! That's my only point.

 

[Tarzan]

Look here for Nevets wavering left and right but never getting anywhere.

 

[IBNAV8R]

As a former rep I can tell you that what you said is BS. You have hundreds o pilots. There is no pulse to take by word of mouth, email, crew room visits etc. Regardless, the point is that you don't know if there is a better PBS system! Your MEC won't let it sell itself! That's my only point.

Why, if it's such a great system, weren't the jungle jet drivers using it already? Obviously, this awesome, fabulous, omnipotent system has been out there a while. If it's so great you'd be saying something like, "We've been using it for years and it's the "bomb".

Instead, the vocal minority is trying sell this unproven system to people that are happy with what they already have.

 

[79%N1]

None of this really matters, does it? First the DAL side is about to be gutted of 40%+ of their flying.....and who knows what the UAL side will bring when they get a joint contract. Nobody will give a sh!t how they bid when they are looking for work in the insurance business! I'm shifting my focus to get as much pay now out of this as can be in the next 2 years, as most 10-12 year guys on the old ASA side will be FO's again, depending how much hiring mitigates job losses here. The single list fight will be a doozy considering the new Delta TA which will gut our airline.

 

[JumpersAway]

None of this really matters, does it? First the DAL side is about to be gutted of 40%+ of their flying.....and who knows what the UAL side will bring when they get a joint contract. Nobody will give a sh!t how they bid when they are looking for work in the insurance business! I'm shifting my focus to get as much pay now out of this as can be in the next 2 years, as most 10-12 year guys on the old ASA side will be FO's again, depending how much hiring mitigates job losses here. The single list fight will be a doozy considering the new Delta TA which will gut our airline.

I'm not subscribing to the doom and gloom just yet. There are several huge factors at play here. It's to the point that our company management isn't even negotiating with us anymore. They're just waiting on the MEC to give them a number for a signature. Does this sound like a panic move by the upper tier for rapidly developing business strategy???? I'd say so. AMR is our life ring, and we're going for as many of the 76 seaters as we can get our hands on with DCI. We're going to be ok, as long as we don't go spastic and panic, or push for something that bumps us out of the running. AMR will be be looking for cheap 50 seat feed to replace Eagle- when the contracts with DAL don't pay, we simply won't provide feed for them anymore and will buy our way into another carrier.

35% of DAL hiring from the DCI ALPA carriers is huge! It doesn't sound like a lot, but it means PCL and ExpressJet will be the getting the lion's share of attrition and movement. That's just the minimum, and I'd suspect to see more than that. ALPA DCI carrier pilot's are essentially "plug and play", in the aspect that we already know the system. Just give us training in a new airframe and send us on our way- ATL, JFK, LGA.........we alread know the drill.