How hot is your cockpit?

[Typhoon1244]

Our new CRJ's, ones that have less than a year of flying on them, cool very well. Sometimes, even though it's 95 degrees outside, you have to turn the cockpit thermostat up to be comfortable.

On the other hand, our older jets (and when I say older, I'm talking about 98-99 vintage) are getting downright uncomfortable...no, uncomfortable's not a strong enough word. "Inhuman" might be better. Yesterday, N835AS's cockpit vents were putting out no air at all...just a piddly little gasp from the "eyeball" vents on the side panels. It was like working in a sauna. When my F/O shut off the packs to start the engines, I was about ready to pour my water over my head to cool off.

And I know why this happens: pilot comfort is not a priority for our mechanics when C-check time rolls around.

Is this problem unique to my little corner of the Delta Connection, or do the rest of you have the same problem with your fleets?

 

[WrightAvia]

If you don't like the airconditioning at your job, you come out by us and crane your neck and sweat for hours on end while looking at the foot ball sized chunk of crystaline beauty growing on the brake calipers when flying in moderate icing at and below the flight levels in the great lakes winter time.

 

[PropTrash]

The Dash-8, especially the older -100 series is VERY toasty during the summer... darn near dangerous on some days. This is due to the cardboard (REALLY!) ducting used for the environmental system. A little condensation, the ducts get wet and SUCK... They close right up.

The ATR was hot too... especially on the ground with no APU. My airline had the bright idea to pull of the prop brake in the name of fiscal savings. Wouldn't want those passengers too comfortable, would you?

 

[saabtrash]

I just finished a three day, did alot of sweating today...to the tune of two beers=dizzy. I think I'm a bit dehydrated.

 

[SquirrelDog]

You want HOT!

Try sitting in 110F heat in the middle of July waiting for 15 cessnas in front of you to take off and no circulation in the pit except this little d*mn window. Sweat pouring down so fast the avionics start not working.

Even HOTTER! A couple of years ago in that same setting one of our lear pilots (with no window) measured the temp in the shade on white paper in the Lear (again no air circulation)...140F...!!!!

 

[EagleRJ]

The Saab doesn't do too bad, as long as you run the system right. Like in most planes, it's possible for a ham-fisted pilot to freeze the moisture in the air ducts and crack them, resulting in all your cold air leaking out before reaching the vents. The automatic mode is supposed to prevent that, but people do it manually in a quest for the coldest possible air. The planes are best right after they come out of a heavy check, since MX has repaired all the blown ducts.

Our Saabs that have good A/C will cool the cockpit down fine, but only keep things borderline in the cabin. The planes that are screwed up (75% of the fleet) are always playing catch-up. They really don't cool down unless you can get up to a cool altitude and stay there for 90 minutes or so. Needless to say, that's rare!

The ERJ cools off great. It will freeze the crew and the passengers if you turn it down all the way. Sometimes though, they'll dispatch one with just one pack working. It usually gets overloaded and falls off line before you even take off, so then you have a sealed metal tube sitting in the sun, filled with 50 people who are getting angrier by the second!

It all doesn't seem so bad, though, when I see a Cherokee taxi past with the door propped open. That's one part of instruction I don't miss!

 

[NuGuy]

Hiya Typhoon,

Yep, you are seeing a pretty common phenomenon. Most AC cool like gangbusters when new, but as they age, the air cycle machines wear out, and just don't put the air out that they used to. Even if they replace the ACM, most of the rest of the pack is pretty worn out.

This along with cracked and/or disconnected ductwork and there you have it...toast-a-rama.

Best thing to do is write it up and keep writing it up until it's fixed. The Fed's really don't like repetitive write ups, and if they see a whole bunch of the same thing in the logbook with "ops check normal" as the sign-off, it raises a big red flag, even for something like air conditioning.

If you have external AC or an APU, another thing you can do is get a good set of sun shades. You wouldn't believe what a difference that makes. I notice that all of NWAs DC-9s have sunshades as standard equipment now. Make sure the FAs close all of the shades in the cabin, and opens all of the eye vents.

Best,
Nu

 

[Mookie]

Our CRJ's get downright nippy, new and old vintage If someone had told me that I'd be spending hours each day folding blankets during quick turns, I'd have stayed in the Brasilia!!! we average about three calls an hour from the fa asking for more heat in cruise. Every cpt i've flown with has his/her own idea of how to "outthink the temperature control unit...eh", riiiiiigggghhhhht.

It's pretty nice though when it's 115 C in PSP!!!


Mookie

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

I defy anyone to find a hotter cockpit than a T-34 in Corpus Christi in the summer. Wearing a helmet, Survival vest and Parachute adds to the pleasure.

 

[CAP10B]

Hugh,

T-37....Del Rio.....summertime

feel my pain

 

[TXCAP4228]

I'm disapointed.


I figured you meant hot chicks riding up front.....



Bummer.

 

[I.P. Freley]

"115 C in PSP"

Gawd, I hope you meant 115 F! What would 115 C be... 239 F??

From my own personal experience, my current experience of stewing in my own juices in a Saab A-model notwithstanding, the worst offender in the "hot aeroplane" department is a 1900 with the VCM MEL'd (the Beech ACM is nearly useless). Nearly had an open revolt in a fully-loaded Beech on the hottest day in memory in HPN, summer 2001... Sitting off the ramp, waiting for a gate, OAT over 100deg F, and after half an hour I was very nearly being threatened by the passengers... Who were actually coming up to the cockpit and yelling at us! Finally shut down #1, opened the main door and the cargo door, threw down the hinged part of the divider between the cabin and the cargo compartment, and sat for another 15 mins like that before we got a gate.

The funny part?

The REASON we didn't have a gate was that Allegheny was delaying their departure until their FO arrived (for those who don't know, HPN routinely makes arrivals wait until a gate is vacated by "company", even if it's only "company" in the sense that you serve the same system).

WHERE was that FO?

In the back of our airplane, of course, being verbally assaulted by the passengers. Poor guy was in uniform, incurring the wrath of the pax who were lashing out at the horrible airlines.

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

Hugh,

T-37....Del Rio.....summertime

feel my pain

I've felt that pain too. Trust me on this one. I think the difference might just be the survival vest underneath the Parachute, not to mention the canopy must be closed at all times while the engine is running (except as I remember during hot student swapouts with the IP on O2).

 

[Typhoon1244]

Now remember, I'm bitching within the context of a spoiled airline pilot flying a modern air-conditioned (?) jet. Those of you in 182's, 310's, T-37's, and so on and so forth are on your own!

(Like they told us in the Army: "DRINK...WATERRRRRRR!")

 

[Typhoon1244]

Sitting off the ramp, waiting for a gate, OAT over 100deg F, and after half an hour I was very nearly being threatened by the passengers...who were actually coming up to the cockpit and yelling at us!

During boarding in Chicago, my younger brother had a woman yell at him that he was a lousy captain because of the heat in the Saab. (Or maybe it was cold. I can't remember. It was "too" something.) She became so abusive that he finally threw her off the aircraft.

A couple days later he was in the chief pilots office. They wanted to know why he'd thrown their parent company's assistant V.P. of Customer Service off the airplane.

(He didn't get in any trouble...her boss didn't like her either.)

 

[I.P. Freley]

Sweet avatar of the Black Widow, BTW...

 

[nosewheel]

256 pax in a DC-8 with NO packs or fans sittin on the ramp in Jedda(Saudia) for two hours is HOT HOT HOT. You know its bad when it starts raining inside the airplane.

 

[Typhoon1244]

Sweet avatar of the Black Widow...

It's my wife's grandfather's, #9583. 418th NFS, Okinawa.

 

[flight-crew]

With the CRJ, I think the key is to keep the aircraft cool and not let it get hot. If you have the same aircraft all day, then start the APU asap and leave it running anytime that you are on the ground. When it's hot outside, I set the temp. controllers to full cold on the descent. That way when we land, all the ducts and the cabin is cool. If the ducts are cool, then it's much easier to cool the airplane. Another thing that you can do is to have the external air (if available) hooked up and running. Run the external air and the APU and you should get some pretty good flow. And make sure that there are no "kinks" in the external air hose. You won't get much airflow with a kink in the line. As previously stated, open all vents in the cabin, galley, and flight deck. Close all window shades. Use window shades for both cockpit windows. And keep the main cabin door curtain closed to keep the heat and humidity out.

I think it all depends on the APU and how worn out the packs are. I've been in some aircraft where they cool well, and others where the airflow is weak. But with external air, all aircraft cool down quickly.

 

[Kaman]

Hi Guys,
I think I might have all of you best on this one...Try flying around in an SH-60F with the ECS INOP and wearing a wetsuit for three-hours of plane guard. Oh and while you are at how about handling a mail run to the "cowboys" and humping a cabin full of mail while in said wetsuit! I sure don't miss any of that!
So, nowadays when I swelter in the cockpit of a Sundowner I remember what being really hot felt like!

Regards,

ex-Navy Rotorhead