Houston G3 crash info

[GravityHater]

We get a lot of this in training:
"now Johnny, if you peg the needle at any time, you must go missed.."

but I have never gotten minimum performance criteria before the needles are actually doing their job.

 

[soarby007]

These two very experienced pilots, 19,000 hrs each, had never flown this particular G-3. As I understand it the EFIS system was new to them and also unlike the other G-3 they flew. I've heard that to connect the ILS to the flight director required some unusual switching. Mistakenly it is suspected that although they tuned in the ILS, they did not know it wasn't connected to the flight director and followed instead the angle of attack indicator flag (fast/slow) and flew a perfect angle of attack into the ground. It turns out the flight director was connected to the VOR not the ILS.

This is not official and is obtained from various sources at DAL. This is the scoop anyway.

 

[User546]

Tune and identify.

I got to ask, although I'm sure not many people will admit, but how many people really IDENTIFY the station. IF, and I mean IF, I see people tune in and listen to the morse, they only listen to probably about the first letter, and then shut it back off - having heard the morse, that's all they need. 80% of the guys I fly with don't even do that much.

It's common sense, but I haven't witnessed very much of it in the real world. I can just imagine the complacency that higher time pilots like these two probably have. (Not speculating, just making a general statement.)

 

[GIVSP]

I will take a high time pilot that is complacent, over some young PUNK with < 1500 hrs. Its COMMON SENSE. You my VERY YOUNG friend have alot to learn.

 

[HMR]

I can just imagine the complacency that higher time pilots like these two probably have.

That's a little harsh.

User997- I try to always ID because I often screw up freq's: either by entering the wrong # or forgetting to flip the switch. When I worked charter, all of the 8 or so King Airs I flew had different avionics. I spent a lot of time studying avionics manuals before I would fly each A/C.

 

[jimcav]

Amen to that.

 

[100LL... Again!]

Basic airmanship would have solved this.

ID the station.
Go missed when you realized something was wrong, not continue.

I don't quite put it in the 'mistake' category. We must call a spade a spade. As pilots, we must not fall victim to the need to venerate the dead at the expense of common sense. Complacency kills, as we can see. "Accidents" like this are inexcusable.

Additionally, screwups like this certainly "lower the bar" in terms of the public perception of the professionalism and competence of pilots. If I were John Q. Public and read this, I would think that these guys were a couple of dupes who had no idea what was going on. You may attack me over this, but it only really matters what the public THINKS about us. It is incumbent on us to guard ourselves so that we do not develop an ATTITUDE of complacency that fosters this kind of "accident".

I pity the poor flight attendant and her family.

 

[User546]

I will take a high time pilot that is complacent, over some young PUNK with < 1500 hrs. Its COMMON SENSE. You my VERY YOUNG friend have alot to learn.

Absolutely I have a lot to learn - so did you at my hours and experience. I'm not claiming to have 20,000 hours and typed in every major business aircraft.

What is it with all these Gulfstream pilots that have such big chips on their shoulders?

I hope I didn't offend your kind with that statement about the two high-time guys were probably complacent. If you re-read it again, you will notice at the end that I put that it was a statement in general and not necessarily towards the two involved.

All I did was merely offer my opinion, based on my very little experience in your big aviation world. Don't get all worked up over it - you might blow your next physical next time if you let little stuff like that get to you.

 

[GIVSP]

Yup, your going far in this business. Sounds like you have the chip, with really no reason to have a chip. Good luck, your going to need it with your attitude.

 

[Dumbledore]

What is it with all these Gulfstream pilots that have such big chips on their shoulders?

Because they know that not everyone can become a Gulfstream pilot.

Look, the deal here is that NO ONE flew the plane in such a way as to keep it from hitting the ground. Both of these guys were working a problem that should have been worked by ONE of them while the other one flew the plane until they had it sorted out.

Procedurally, that's just how it has to be - your top priority is to fly the plane. All that other stuff that we experienced guys get so complacent about doesn't matter if you don't do at least that much.