Hold on tight

[el raton]

Flex has 6 months to organize.

 

[Pervis]

Flex pilots have been assured that our pay will remain the same

I would like to see a response from a former Travel Air pilot. Seems they were told one thing and realized another. It would be most wise to join 1108 to cover your buttoxes. Even if you remain separate and require your own CBA, it will be with the same local.

 

[johnsonrod]

Another guess would be Wheels Up linking with an established player - maybe Netjets given the owner's previous partnership with Marquis Card. QUOTE]

Welcome to Netjets...here is you brand new shiny...ummmm.. King Air:erm:


:beer:

Evidently the King Air 350i will be very well equipped. I doubt the founder would fly anything dumpy - it will probably set the standard in that category if he wants to sell 70-100 airplanes worth of shares.

Who knows - just speculation..............

 

[Club ORD FO]

I would like to see a response from a former Travel Air pilot. Seems they were told one thing and realized another. It would be most wise to join 1108 to cover your buttoxes. Even if you remain separate and require your own CBA, it will be with the same local.

Agreed. I don't think any of us flex folks know much about the details Of travel air. If anyone has knowledge and specifics, please share what happened.

 

[AeroBoy]

I will have to respectfully disagree. FO management likes nothing better than to slap our Union in the face. I expect that they will treat the non-union Flex side much better than they treat us for that very reason.

IMO, Fresh Air is absolutely correct here. Also, Kenn doesn't want a union at Flex, so that's why there won't be any pay/benefit cuts -- he knows that if he would do any cuts, the pilots would vote in a union really, really fast.

Also, let's not rewrite history when it comes to how the union came about at Flight Options. The union drive started under Raytheon's rule because they were greatly mismanaging the company. Kenn announced he was buying Flight Options just weeks before the union vote and asked the pilots to vote no and give him a chance. The problem was that the pilots were already so abused by that point and didn't want to have to wait another year (per NMB rules) to be able to do another union drive/election if he didn't deliver. Scared and abused, they voted in the union, but it wasn't Kenn's fault. Also remember that when the Flight Options transaction closed, he pledged to work with the pilot union on the initial contract. How many other execs have you seen do that lately? Yeah, he negotiated hard with the union reps. He also negotiated hard with Raytheon, Sentient, Bombardier, Everest, etc., when he bought properties from them. Kenn's a good negotiator -- that's why he's successful in the bizav segment when other companies aren't (Beechcraft and Avantair come to immediate mind here). You don't honestly believe that he was just going to roll over and play dead during the Fl Ops pilot negotiations, do you?

 

[doylehargraves]

I'm not at flex anymore but, ran into crew in SAN today and overheard the conversation and they seemed nervous about losing 401k match and vacation stuff more than seniority type issues and union junk. I'm not so sure that this is a good deal or not, only time will tell but; based on how the options folks feel about their boss, it doesn't sound too good. But, then again, how bad can it be when you've worked for the Fred and Dave show?

 

[ProFracPilot]

Directional Aviation Capital is going to need ALL pilots pulling in the same direction. We are the front line marketing people, doesn't matter which side of the house we're on.

So if Kenn's intent is to continue with two brands, one would think it is in the best interest of the holding company to NOT have a divided pilot group.

With that in mind who's to say they won't merge pilot groups, and put fences in place for the existing fleets for the time being?

AeroBoyeee said it. Hold on tight. Time will tell just how bumpy this ride will be.

As an aside, 1108 leadership has had NOTHING to say on today's announcement so far.

 

[BlueNose]

IMO, Fresh Air is absolutely correct here. Also, Kenn doesn't want a union at Flex, so that's why there won't be any pay/benefit cuts -- he knows that if he would do any cuts, the pilots would vote in a union really, really fast.

Also, let's not rewrite history when it comes to how the union came about at Flight Options. The union drive started under Raytheon's rule because they were greatly mismanaging the company. Kenn announced he was buying Flight Options just weeks before the union vote and asked the pilots to vote no and give him a chance. The problem was that the pilots were already so abused by that point and didn't want to have to wait another year (per NMB rules) to be able to do another union drive/election if he didn't deliver. Scared and abused, they voted in the union, but it wasn't Kenn's fault. Also remember that when the Flight Options transaction closed, he pledged to work with the pilot union on the initial contract. How many other execs have you seen do that lately? Yeah, he negotiated hard with the union reps. He also negotiated hard with Raytheon, Sentient, Bombardier, Everest, etc., when he bought properties from them. Kenn's a good negotiator -- that's why he's successful in the bizav segment when other companies aren't (Beechcraft and Avantair come to immediate mind here). You don't honestly believe that he was just going to roll over and play dead during the Fl Ops pilot negotiations, do you?

I think your opinion's right, but whatever else you're remembering, it's not history. The RTA merger happened in 2002, with an RTA union drive underway. Kenn lobbied the pilots hard, brought them all to CGF for a personal pitch pre-merger and pre-vote, and made some promises that Raytheon couldn't legally make (since he wasn't management yet). The pitch worked, they voted not to unionize. Kenn was ousted by RTN corporate in 2003, and they brought in John Knowitall as CEO. He was their M&A wonderboy with an MIT MBA, but didn't know jack about aviation and lasted less than a year.

Then began the Reign of Scheeringa, who came in as COO in '03, and helped put the knife in JN's back to take over in '04. He brought his management expertise and love of pilots from US Air, and soon had the union drive going again, stronger than ever. He and his right hand Sanjay were a union organizer's dream team, and worked hard to alienate the pilot group. By the spring of '05 when the vote happened, guys who had been anti-union all their lives were ready to bring in the Teamsters - they would probably voted for Satan himself at that point, if he promised protection from Scheeringa. The joy continued until mid '08, after RTN had already sold the company to a VC group, who finally sold interest back to Kenn, through Directional and Resilient, and the old Options management team was back in the driver's seat by that fall, after a five year hiatus. Kenn hates the idea of a union, but he wasn't even on the property when it was voted in. His team took over negotiations when he came back, and finally agreed on a contract by 2010. A contract with the lowest payscale in the industry and a scope clause that's as effective as the proverbial screen door on a submarine. And here we are.

 

[Fresh Air]

.....

 

[jetwash]

I think the office staff have more to worry about then the pilots. How many travel air office staff moved to Cleveland when their jobs went there from Whitcha? The same might happen to the Flex office staff.
Lately in Cleveland they have been re arranging the desks and now have lots of unused space in one area. The OCC is also huge and under utilized you can cut lots of overhead with all of that in one building.
On a plus side fuel contracts could be better for both Flex and FO if they negotiate and buy in bulk.

 

[Frac Cap]

Not to start and argument, but it was my recollection that when RTA came over, during that time frame we were told that we would always be the highest paid fractional. And don't forget this famous statement, "When Net Jets gets their contract, you will get that and then some". Well, history speaks louder than words. We have been the lowest paid fractional and I'm sure most pilots in Flight Options have never even seen six figures on their year-end W-2 yet.

 

[Ludicrous Speed]

AA: Why no, Silly! St. Louis will continue to be an important hub in the new TWA/AA post-merger business model!

USAir: Why no, Silly! Pittsburgh will continue to be an important hub in our future!

UAL: Why no, Silly! Cleveland will continue to be an important hub in the new UAL/CO post-merger plan!

DAL: Why no, Silly! Cincinnati will continue to be an important hub in the new NW/DAL post-merger business plan!

DAL: Why no, Silly! Memphis will continue to be an important hub in our future!

DHL: Why no, Silly! Wilmington will continue to be an important hub in our future!

Is there a pattern here?

 

[Jack Campbell]

This --> Flight Options Parent Company To Buy Flexjet
http://www.ainonline.com/aviation-n...-05/flight-options-parent-company-buy-flexjet
"All Flexjet employees will be retained, Ricci noted."

 

[BlueNose]

This --> Flight Options Parent Company To Buy Flexjet
http://www.ainonline.com/aviation-n...-05/flight-options-parent-company-buy-flexjet
"All Flexjet employees will be retained, Ricci noted."

But how many of the office staff will want to move to Richmond Heights?

I know, "We were told nobody's job would be moving." See post #87 above. Every one of those statements was true, when stated and for a certain period of time afterward. Then circumstances changed. It'll take months for the integration, plus having to train all the new agency pilots on the Options FOM. Then circumstances will change. Vertical ingegration, economy of scale, lean operations - call it what you like, but long term there's little need to maintain separate support operations and lots of reasons to integrate. Maybe I'm wrong and Kenn's just a sweet soul who has nothing but your best interests at heart. Or maybe the threat of a lawsuit by the union will drive the need to keep conspicuously separate companies. Otherwise, you might want to start shopping snowblowers. Be sure to get a two-stage for those Ohio winters.

On the pilot side, I think you'll do fine, being Kenn's shining example of how he treats a non-unionized force of 'trusted' employees. I think they honestly thought their coming back to Options would spark a decertification drive. When it didn't happen, they considered the pilot group a disloyal bunch.

 

[Praetorian]

Nevermind. The definition of "Parent" contained in Section 1 doesn't extend beyond Flight Options Holdings II, Inc (i.e., Directional Capital is free to do as it wishes).

Check out the Directional Capital LOA at the very end of the CBA.