Hey Westies

[Soulfly]

What predictions? MC?

USAPA won. Ok, I figured you guys would. Even a bunch of kindegardners could have won. You won by sheer numbers. WOW, impressive...

Now your new union has to put up or shut up.

Where is the seamless transition? Insurance products?
Aeromedical services? I have not received one single thing from USAPA regarding all of my lost benefits.

One more thing, your union is self appointed for 18 months by EAST PILOTS. Not one WEST PILOT.
You can dress it up all you want, by that is not fair representation. In the merger or fragmentation of this airline it is going to screw all of us.

I will make you a bet. When we merge with another carrier, USAPA will not win the representation election that will take place.

 

[Luke's Dad]

How does it feel being at the highest pay level you have ever had? Plus profit sharing! Must be nice.

Funny, the EAST is at its lowest and the West is at its highest compensation. No wonder you think ALPA is great. You are working under the best conditions you ever had. Thats too funny. You guys remind me of Skybus a year ago. Same talk. Fast upgrades and lots of airplanes on order.

Anyway, good luck trying to get our flying. It won't happen. You will be fenced in your low yield market.
You will enjoy exactly what you had prior to the merger. The desert and about 100 plus airplanes and your attrition. Hopefully you will see some growth in PHX and a few 330, which all belongs to you.

By the way, AWA Pilots could have saved ALPA by creating a 10-15 year fence, which would have protected the majority of us Eastholes and by not putting our reps in trusteeship who were just represting the will of its pilot group.

But no, you wanted it all now. Did you westies ever think that placing a pilot with 17 years of service with a newhire was going to be excepted. Our bottom active pilot went down the entire list. Nic did not merge the lists by using active pilots. Anyone who says MDA were not active USAIR pilots is clueless.
In 10 years there might only be 500-1000 Eastholes left. So, just like a kid who can not wait, you will. Be patient and you will have the airline, just not now.
Rant over.

Marty

Hey Marty,

You are LUCKY to have a job at all. If you
don't enjoy your job, I recommend quitting. Vote for Hilary or Obama. They will save you.

 

[waveflyer]

ok mcdu- you won't answer- that speaks volumes.

Fr8master- that's a good, but incomplete argument- bc as regional pointed out- doesn't acknowledge what seniority is and what it accomplishes. It also doesn't answer why someone should have a better position after a merger than they had before it? I ask the same thing of AA guys. Seniority determines the pecking order of pilots. Who gets what a/c and what schedule and what vacation. The longevity of the last recalled east pilot is about 10 years more than the first new hires there. Their seniority is virtually equal. Think about that.

Please answer this- DID the new hire pilots now on the east property- who are now SOLID line holders- STEAL 10 years of seniority from the last recalled pilots??

your arguments make no sense bc you don't get what seniority is.

Or is it possible that this merger only highlights the fact that you were on the bottom of the list. You guys argue that the west will own the airline after a few short years = The assumption is that the East guys are all a LOT older than the west. This IS NOT TRUE. Most easties were hired in their 20's- most westies- in their 30's- the job's available in the last 10 years have been at the regionals- the Fokker and BAC sized jets that the east were hired into- (which gives the east a lot of the seniority years they argue for in DOH)- are now called RJ's and were sold out by senior pilots to regional airlines. So unless you're willing to give seniority credit to west pilots for their RJ time- DOH would be patently unfair. Which is also something Nic understood- and why MDA pilots were not included on the list.

 

[iflyhigh]

MCDU:

I has hired at UAL in July 2000 spent 4 years on furlough. If no else is hired, I am still on the bottom of the seniority list, less than 500.

Thus after merger, I should be on the bottom of the seniority list. So if UAL merges with CAL are you telling all the pilots CAL hired from 2003 and on should be below me. I would expect some of these guys to be above me.

Now to US... Lets assume you came out of BK 2. Now pilots are retiring. You are calling back 1989 and so on furloughees. Where are they at on the list? AT the bottom. Attrition will help some pilots but not all to upgrade.

With the current environment, oil at $117 a barrell, I highly doubt their would be expansion, and probably US along with all airlines would see aircraft parked, thus whats starting to happen. This would result in less positions and thus furloughees are still at the bottom of the list. (Ok you probably would of hired some to cover attrition.)

Nobody knows for sure where AWA or US Air would be today on their own. Its all speculation, their is no way to run that scenario. (Can't turn back time.) (Though I wish we could, since I know alot of pilots would change their career choice or company.) Unless you a physic, which means you don't need this job, you can only repeat what Parker said and AWA can only state what was in the press.

Time to stop the rants and move on. Everyone should be happy to have jobs in the current environment. It any airline, this includes US, thinks they can't go out of business tomorrow they are living in LALA land. By infighting, we are slowly destroying the airline. If you don't mind telling your children or wife that you can't afford the mortgage in a few months that fine. But remember when you get hired at another company you will be in the right seat again. Unless you are lucky enough get a captains positions, which is rare unless you go overseas.

I am sure all the EAST guys will flame me.

 

[Green]

I'll give it a shot. Seniority is based on your DOH, that is according to both of our sect. 22. That covers everything to do with the job.
Longevity is the length of time actually working.

example. I was hired in April 2000. so for seniority purposes I have 8 years. However for two of those years I was on LOA, plus 1 year of furlough. So my longevity is 5 years.

an example

Wow Fr8mastr you aren't the brightest bulb are you? Seniority as defined by sect 22 has absolutely nothing to do with integrating two airlines. If it did don't you think that attorney you paid upwards of $1,000,000.00 during the arbitration process would have used that as the cornerstone of his argument? So if you merged with CAL instead of AWA you should have been slotted in senior to CA's when you were called off furlough? Haven't we covered this ad-nauseum? Time to shelve the kindergarten debate club arguments...

 

[FR8mastr]

Wow Fr8mastr you aren't the brightest bulb are you? Seniority as defined by sect 22 has absolutely nothing to do with integrating two airlines. If it did don't you think that attorney you paid upwards of $1,000,000.00 during the arbitration process would have used that as the cornerstone of his argument? So if you merged with CAL instead of AWA you should have been slotted in senior to CA's when you were called off furlough? Haven't we covered this ad-nauseum? Time to shelve the kindergarten debate club arguments...

Well if my bulb isn't that bright, where does that put you? Your comprehension skills are severely lacking. Read, if you can, the question I was responding to. Nowhere in my post did I talk about mergers, I was only responding to seniority vs longevity.
Maybe if you would try and read prior to throwing insults, we would not be wasting our time now.

 

[waveflyer]

Well- Fr8- i read the question you were responding to- and though you're no doubt very bright- i don't think you explained ALL the differences between seniority and longevity.

 

[Guppiedriver]

I was hired in April 2000. so for seniority purposes I have 8 years. However for two of those years I was on LOA, plus 1 year of furlough. So my longevity is 5 years.

Hmmm, something is rotten in PHL. When I transitioned to the Bus in 2005, my sim partner was a furloughed US Airways 1989-90 hire and his number hadn't been recalled yet. Now, you're telling us that you were hired in 2000 and recalled in 2003...am I missing something here or are you twisting the truth a bit?

If nothing else, you easties are consistent.

 

[Caspian27]

He said he just made the dates up "as an example."

 

[Deadalus]

How does it feel being at the highest pay level you have ever had? Plus profit sharing! Must be nice.

Funny, the EAST is at its lowest and the West is at its highest compensation. No wonder you think ALPA is great. You are working under the best conditions you ever had. Thats too funny. You guys remind me of Skybus a year ago. Same talk. Fast upgrades and lots of airplanes on order.

Anyway, good luck trying to get our flying. It won't happen. You will be fenced in your low yield market.
You will enjoy exactly what you had prior to the merger. The desert and about 100 plus airplanes and your attrition. Hopefully you will see some growth in PHX and a few 330, which all belongs to you.

By the way, AWA Pilots could have saved ALPA by creating a 10-15 year fence, which would have protected the majority of us Eastholes and by not putting our reps in trusteeship who were just represting the will of its pilot group.

But no, you wanted it all now. Did you westies ever think that placing a pilot with 17 years of service with a newhire was going to be excepted. Our bottom active pilot went down the entire list. Nic did not merge the lists by using active pilots. Anyone who says MDA were not active USAIR pilots is clueless.
In 10 years there might only be 500-1000 Eastholes left. So, just like a kid who can not wait, you will. Be patient and you will have the airline, just not now.
Rant over.

Marty

What is this your excuse for being a scumbag with no integrity. Everyone in this industry knows you are in the wrong and if you had either half a clue or an ounce of integrity so would you. Don't worry what goes around comes around.