Goodbye usapa!!!!!!

[Boeing747Driver]

However, as Judge Silver notes in her Jan. 10 decision in the Addington case, "when USAPA is no longer the certified representative, it must immediately stop participating in the seniority integration."

 

[St. Nic]

Silver got it wrong. Shes a dingbat judge from the dessert. USAPA isnt going any where. Sorry to burst the westicles bubble

 

[Boeing747Driver]

St. NIC is getting the NIC.

 

[71driver]

Whether you like it or not, in the Southwest/AirTran SLI, the written agreements were stuck to. There was "hardball" played by both sides, but all the written agreements were adhered to. The only pending legal/NMB action is against your union (ALPA), and no one else.

Some people on both sides are unhappy, and bitch about the result. However, if we had gotten to binding arbitration as per the agreements (which we did not), then we would have gone along with the results. And arguably, the exact same people would still be unhappy and bitching.

By the way, how did this suddenly morph into an AirTran/Southwest thing? I thought this thread was about USAPA. Back to East vs. West: "You suck!".... "Well, you suck more!"

Bubba

Bubba,

You are forgetting a very significant part of that highlight. We were told "take the tird sandwich or you WILL ultimately lose your job"

Anywho I understand why the Southwest guys are unhappy....they didn't get their organic growth...I get that. Many of us at Airtran would have preferred to stay a stand alone airline and just swap out our CEO for someone with a set of balls.

What I don't understand.....is the collective inability of the Southwest Pilot to understand why many of us at AT are upset...losing 25%-33% of your seniority/quality of life/and Captani seat....and in many cases being to old to recapture it...in addition too that having ATL's base practically shut down forcing many of us to commute.
I don't know if it's denial, ignorance or arrogance but it has played a significant role in the anomosity between the 2 groups

buenes nachos

 

[SWA Bubba]

Bubba (a fitting name), while what you say is technically true, the threat was that the agreements would not be adhered to. I didn't see you or waveflyer screaming about how that threat was dishonest or unfair. So you need to "own it." Chiming in on an Airways thread and taking USAPA to task for doing exactly what you threatened to do (not honor binding arbitration) is the height of hypocrisy.

Union Thug (a very fitting moniker for you as well),

Nobody at Southwest ever threatened to "not honor binding arbitration." Ever. You're wrong about that, and it's nothing like USAir east, no matter how indignant you feel. Essentially, what Gary did was force you to put an agreement to a vote. And he did that only after ALPA made it clear that it had no intention of putting any agreement to a vote; its only desire was to wait it out until arbitration (ALPA: "the worst we'll get in arbitration is DOH."). And this was after all sides, including ALPA, agreed in the process agreement that they desired a negotiated settlement instead of arbitration, and after Gary made it clear that he wanted every pilot to vote. You played hardball; he responded in turn, forcing you to live up to what you agreed in the PA: Let the pilots vote.

If either agreement had been voted down by the pilots instead of just your gang of 7, then you would have gotten your precious arbitration, just as the agreement stipulated. In my opinion, it would have been similar to what was agreed upon, other than FAT guys who were senior enough to be captains on the overall list probably should be. Personally, I think they should have at transition, instead of waiting until Jan 2015.

Bubba

 

[SWA Bubba]

Bubba,

You are forgetting a very significant part of that highlight. We were told "take the tird sandwich or you WILL ultimately lose your job"

Anywho I understand why the Southwest guys are unhappy....they didn't get their organic growth...I get that. Many of us at Airtran would have preferred to stay a stand alone airline and just swap out our CEO for someone with a set of balls.

What I don't understand.....is the collective inability of the Southwest Pilot to understand why many of us at AT are upset...losing 25%-33% of your seniority/quality of life/and Captani seat....and in many cases being to old to recapture it...in addition too that having ATL's base practically shut down forcing many of us to commute.
I don't know if it's denial, ignorance or arrogance but it has played a significant role in the anomosity between the 2 groups

buenes nachos

Hey, I get it. I know why a lot of you are upset. A lot of us are upset as well. I know that a lot of you would have preferred to stay a stand alone company; but I bet an even higher percentage of us (Southwest pilots, that is) would have preferred that as well. However, that wasn't up to us, anymore than it was up to you.

I'm ready to move on as well; I'm just sick of people like PCL mischaracterizing certain things, to rationalize one of the biggest fukc-ups ever perpetrated on a group of pilots by its "leadership."

Bubba

 

[redflyer65]

What I don't understand.....is the collective inability of the Southwest Pilot to understand why many of us at AT are upset...losing 25%-33% of your seniority/quality of life/and Captani seat....

buenes nachos

And there's your problem 71driver.

Did you really think that you'd keep your 23-33% seniority coming across to a much larger carrier? Please. Your expectations were inflated if that's the case. A career at SW didn't equal a career at AirTran. I'm not saying AirTran wasn't a good gig for many, it just all changed when your CEO hit the cash register.

 

[Guppiedriver]

Silver got it wrong. Shes a dingbat judge from the dessert. USAPA isnt going any where. Sorry to burst the westicles bubble

Unless your union appeals her decision and wins, what she wrote is the law.

It's desert, numbnuts.

 

[PCL_128]

Union Thug (a very fitting moniker for you as well),

Thank you!

Nobody at Southwest ever threatened to "not honor binding arbitration." Ever.

You're either a bad liar or just really clueless. Not only did Gary threaten it, but your very own Steve Chase did as well. Hell, go back and look at the threads from 2010-2011 right here, and you'll see plenty of brethren threatening the same thing.

(ALPA: "the worst we'll get in arbitration is DOH.").

ALPA never said that. More lies.

If either agreement had been voted down by the pilots instead of just your gang of 7, then you would have gotten your precious arbitration, just as the agreement stipulated.

No, according to Gary, we would have been kept separate at best, or shut down and out of our jobs at worst. Not that I actually believe any of those crazy threats, but they were threats, and most of our pilots did believe them.

 

[PCL_128]

Unless your union appeals her decision and wins, what she wrote is the law.

It's desert, numbnuts.

Not quite. That part of the ruling was just her discussion about how she reached her decision. The only part that is "law" is the part at the end. But she certainly handed the APA a great argument on a silver platter.