Germanwings plane crashed intentionally by F/O

[tico]

The public views and pays pilots as if we're glorified bus drivers. We're now getting glorified bus drivers, with all of the requisite mental baggage, in this job. It's no longer a profession.

More than a few regional pilots with families are eligible for food stamps and far too many are employed without a four year degree. This is rapidly being turned into a trade, much like plumber or electrician rather than a skilled professional.

Andy----Union plumbers and electricians are highly skilled tradesman
that have better benefits and pensions than pilots have. What we need in this
job are fewer silver spoon management suck up college boys and more skilled
pilots.

 

[Brody1]

With the lengths certain governments AND the media will go through to paint radical muslims in a favorable light, I would not be surprised if the 'note' was planted - and is used as a decoy to steer this investigation away from Islam altogether. Since it has been determined (preliminary, but likely) a murder/suicide, it wouldn't be too difficult to steer the 'official story' in the direction that best suits the needs of those overseeing the investigation. Yes, I know it sounds a bit far-fetched. That is, until you take the time to look up the media's track record in covering stories that don't paint their favorite politicians and/or subjects in a favorable light. I realize it might just be a simple (yet tragic) case of an unqualified, depressed pilot committing the ultimate act of selfishness. With that said, I'm not buying it. This is too big, and reeks of jihadism. If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck . . .

 

[GogglesPisano]

With the lengths certain governments AND the media will go through to paint radical muslims in a favorable light, I would not be surprised if the 'note' was planted - and is used as a decoy to steer this investigation away from Islam altogether. Since it has been determined (preliminary, but likely) a murder/suicide, it wouldn't be too difficult to steer the 'official story' in the direction that best suits the needs of those overseeing the investigation. Yes, I know it sounds a bit far-fetched. That is, until you take the time to look up the media's track record in covering stories that don't paint their favorite politicians and/or subjects in a favorable light. I realize it might just be a simple (yet tragic) case of an unqualified, depressed pilot committing the ultimate act of selfishness. With that said, I'm not buying it. This is too big, and reeks of jihadism. If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck . . .

So Islamic terrorists take down a plane, and rather than take credit for it , they keep it a secret? To what end?

 

[Tripower455]

Kinda makes the security check point for pilots meaningless now.

No more now than ever.

 

[Tripower455]

This kid's college degree didn't prevent this tragedy from happening....but paying his dues over the years, like we did, might have. If he had been an instructor, cargo, regional or charter pilot for a number of years, someone might have picked up on his instability. At 600 hours, he wouldn't even have qualified to fly canceled checks in a Cessna 210.

Amen.

He might've still killed himself in an airplane at 600 hours, but it is far less likely that he'd have taken 150 people with him.

 

[Tripower455]

But you're not flying for a 121 carrier, nor are you transporting passengers, correct?

GMAFB.

I am a second generation airline pilot.

My old man had a 2 year degree and flew for Pan Am and then Delta for over 30 years.

I've got a 2 year degree as well, and while I was working on my (appropriately named) BS degree, was offered a ME 135 flying job, with, ironically, considering the subject of this thread, around 600 hours.

I was working as a mechanic at the time, and was incrementally doing more flying for the company (ferries, test flights etc), so at that point, they offered me a full time flying job.

I figured I could always go back to college down the road, but that flying opportunity was unlikely to be there 18 months down the road.

Looking back, that was one of the best decisions I've made in my career.

As much as I regret missing the "enlightenment" of that extra semester and a half, and not having a piece of parchment on my wall, that decision, in part, landed me a captain seat at a major 121 carrier for 29 of my 44 year airline (and one 121 cargo op) career.

 

[Av8rPHX]

Im so tired of the college degree argument that everyone gets a hard on over. A college degree does not make one a professional, all it says is that someone can read some material and pass a few exams...oh and rack up loads in student debt. I know plenty of "professions" that pay more than piloting and dont require a degree for that level of prestige. I have an AAS in Paramedicine and make more now than I would if i stayed in the airline game. Give me the pilot that has real "life" experience than the guy who partied his way through a 4 year institution any day. Now that Ive got that rant over, lets address the elephant in the room - mental health. Piloting, as with many other "macho" careers have always viewed any sort of weakness as taboo and something that is just not discussed out of fear of being punished (ie, having your medical pulled). Ive seen it far too often in EMS where someone was afraid of discussing their issues so they overdosed on lead instead. I know as a first responder we have options available to us to confidentiality discuss issues that may be affecting us without involving our agency. Maybe its time to initiate something like that in other sectors such as aviation....and no I dont mean company sponsored EAP programs. Those are garbage.

 

[Roomwithaview]

Andy----Union plumbers and electricians are highly skilled tradesman
that have better benefits and pensions than pilots have. What we need in this
job are fewer silver spoon management suck up college boys and more skilled
pilots.

Hear-Hear

 

[Dornier 335]

Im so tired of the college degree argument that everyone gets a hard on over. A college degree does not make one a professional, all it says is that someone can read some material and pass a few exams...oh and rack up loads in student debt. I know plenty of "professions" that pay more than piloting and dont require a degree for that level of prestige. I have an AAS in Paramedicine and make more now than I would if i stayed in the airline game. Give me the pilot that has real "life" experience than the guy who partied his way through a 4 year institution any day. Now that Ive got that rant over, lets address the elephant in the room - mental health. Piloting, as with many other "macho" careers have always viewed any sort of weakness as taboo and something that is just not discussed out of fear of being punished (ie, having your medical pulled). Ive seen it far too often in EMS where someone was afraid of discussing their issues so they overdosed on lead instead. I know as a first responder we have options available to us to confidentiality discuss issues that may be affecting us without involving our agency. Maybe its time to initiate something like that in other sectors such as aviation....and no I dont mean company sponsored EAP programs. Those are garbage.

After you successfully pass various tests and you receive the green light to start pilot training at the LH pilot school, you end up with over ?100,000+ in the hole. The pilot school is not recognized as a college equivalent, even in Germany. LH will not accept anybody older than ~29 and with a pilot rating higher than private. Their belief is that thorough training can replace flight experience. It's the old ab initio vs flight experience argument AND that they have the best policy in the world (seriously!). To all those of you that read this, you are nothing more than garbage.

 

[JD2003]

You guys should smoke some really good marijuana, take a couple weeks off, and fukk the airlines.

 

[Dornier 335]

And you should keep your comments to yourself and some enough weed to see your b@lls turn black from testicular cancer!

 

[two(2)%]

Im so tired of the college degree argument that everyone gets a hard on over. A college degree does not make one a professional, all it says is that someone can read some material and pass a few exams...oh and rack up loads in student debt. I know plenty of "professions" that pay more than piloting and dont require a degree for that level of prestige. I have an AAS in Paramedicine and make more now than I would if i stayed in the airline game. Give me the pilot that has real "life" experience than the guy who partied his way through a 4 year institution any day. Now that Ive got that rant over, lets address the elephant in the room - mental health. Piloting, as with many other "macho" careers have always viewed any sort of weakness as taboo and something that is just not discussed out of fear of being punished (ie, having your medical pulled). Ive seen it far too often in EMS where someone was afraid of discussing their issues so they overdosed on lead instead. I know as a first responder we have options available to us to confidentiality discuss issues that may be affecting us without involving our agency. Maybe its time to initiate something like that in other sectors such as aviation....and no I dont mean company sponsored EAP programs. Those are garbage.

Much of that is true homes, but you are a quitter. Shoulda stayed bro, its all gettn good now!

Two

 

[Bringupthebird]

So where do you think the super-man pilots of the future will come from? When will they have to do more than program a box and push the AP button? Flying boxes? Instructing? Crop Dusting? Who is going to invest $100K in ratings either through college programs or ATP and then make the conscious decision to take the long tough slog through all the crummy jobs just to hone their skill while their classmates unpack the Van Husen Aviator and run off to fly a shiny RJ where they can hone their skills by loading the box and pushing the AP button?

I was told recently that 50 flight slots at the AF Academy went unfilled because those attending would prefer to go into a more rewarding profession post-service.

Perhaps the drones are showing up right on time!

 

[Av8rPHX]

Google has already made a self driving car.....its not too far fetched.

 

[Nindiri]

Are people out there actually paying 100K for their ratings?

If pilots are that gullible, I suppose it would help explain our current SWAPA contract negotiations.

 

[Ty Webb]

I was told recently that 50 flight slots at the AF Academy went unfilled because those attending would prefer to go into a more rewarding profession post-service.

Perhaps the drones are showing up right on time!

Hey, maybe it's not too late for me to redo my misspent Ute.... and go to the AF Academy, afterall. I might as well, been paying for everybody else to go. :bomb:

 

[tico]

Damn good idea Ty.....I will go with ya....they owe it to us

 

[Ty Webb]

"Back to School" . . . AFA style. :beer:

Anyone seen my hacky-sack? :erm:

:laugh:

 

[Flyer1015]

But he would never have been flying 121 in the US with 800 hours.

I don't know how you or anyone else thinks that we're going to be viewed as more than bus drivers without requiring a college degree. "Sure, it's a hard job, but you don't have to be educated to do it". Great. All I need to know is how to apply for foodstamps.
Low barriers to entry = low wages.

These days, yes. But remember we were hiring 250 hr pilots into RJs back in 2006-2007. And way back in the day certain mainline carriers were hiring low time pilots directly into the SO/FE position.

 

[Flyer1015]

Hmmmmm. Now some internet chatter that he MAY HAVE BEEN a jihadi? Still waiting for the German investigators to confirm garden-variety nutbaggery or more of the same from the "religion of peace."

Are you serious? 149 innocent people are dead and you are bickering if it was dirka dirka dirka or just a garden-variety nutbaggery? Let me guess, Muslims can't be mentally ill or unstable and so it must have been terrorism?