Future Hiring.........

[General Lee]

We can only hope oil skyrockets to $100 pbl until December then plunge downward. It'll weed out the weak and allow SWA to flourish.

Cocky. Hey Chase, what do you think of this guy? Man alive. That's like me saying "I hope every SW plane crashes into every Jetblue and Airtran plane so all of the LCCs can stop charging crap for ticket prices....." Well looky there, now I resemble DH2WN.....Dumba$$.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[AnimalTale]

We can only hope oil skyrockets to $100 pbl until December then plunge downward. It'll weed out the weak and allow SWA to flourish.

Enjoy. I am glad some pilots are enjoying their careers to the fullest. SWA has a great management team and have thus far been making the best choices.

In the 70S, I thought that of Pan AM, TWA
In the 80s, I thought that of USAir
In the 90s, I thought that of UNITED.

Enjoy your life at SWA, dont wish bad upon others!

Cya

 

[DH2WN]

Enjoy. I am glad some pilots are enjoying their careers to the fullest. SWA has a great management team and have thus far been making the best choices.

In the 70S, I thought that of Pan AM, TWA
In the 80s, I thought that of USAir
In the 90s, I thought that of UNITED.

Enjoy your life at SWA, dont wish bad upon others!

Cya

I would never wish bad upon others but it's a fact the industry is saturated with to many seats. Why do you think airtran is going into CLT and SWA into PHL and PIT? They want the number of seats to decline and allow their own airlines to flourish. If oil were to hit $100 pbl before 2006 SWA would still be hedged at $26 and the execs., who are the most brilliant in the industry, would have other plans up their sleeves for hedging. The legacies would fall off and SWA would expand rapidly. There would be plenty of jobs for pilots who would unfortunate to be working at UA or US and lose their jobs. I don't want anyone to lose their jobs but SWA is priority and whatever makes it greater than it already is, all the better. I'm sure all pilots are welcome to apply.

 

[DH2WN]

That's like me saying "I hope every SW plane crashes into every Jetblue and Airtran plane so all of the LCCs can stop charging crap for ticket prices....." Bye Bye--General Lee

Wow, you are taking that out of context. I would never wish death to anyone. Geez, that's really sick. If you happen to be working at US or UA and they go under you know you can apply to SWA. Eventually, one of the legacies are going to liquidate. It's been predicted by CEOs and industry experts alike. When that happens SWA will grow and grow and there will be plenty of pilot jobs at SWA for everyone.

 

[FR8mastr]

DH2, If something should ever happen to SW, I just want you to know, even though your life would be in shambles and you might have trouble paying your bills, not to worry I'm sure you will be welcome to apply for a job at my airline too.

 

[DH2WN]

DH2, If something should ever happen to SW, I just want you to know, even though your life would be in shambles and you might have trouble paying your bills, not to worry I'm sure you will be welcome to apply for a job at my airline too.

The airline I'm at is in shambles and I am being furloughed. Luckily, I got hired at the greatest airline ever. I hope everyone will be as lucky as I if they get furloughed.

 

[General Lee]

The airline I'm at is in shambles and I am being furloughed. Luckily, I got hired at the greatest airline ever. I hope everyone will be as lucky as I if they get furloughed.

"The Greatest airline ever......" I thought that was Pan Am? Or Maybe TWA? Braniff......


My bet, you won't make it past probation. You will be listening to your Ipod during IOE and get canned. You will probably be listening to "Danger Zone" by Kenny Loggins.


And, I am not the one who is twisted. You wish for thousands of people to lose their jobs and pensions.(not only pilots out there you know) You're awesome.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[DH2WN]

"The Greatest airline ever......" I thought that was Pan Am? Or Maybe TWA? Braniff......


My bet, you won't make it past probation. You will be listening to your Ipod during IOE and get canned. You will probably be listening to "Danger Zone" by Kenny Loggins.


And, I am not the one who is twisted. You wish for thousands of people to lose their jobs and pensions.(not only pilots out there you know) You're awesome.


Bye Bye--General Lee

You don't get it. Read the book "Nuts" and maybe you will understand better.

 

[General Lee]

You don't get it. Read the book "Nuts" and maybe you will understand better.

No, you don't get it. Not everyone wants to be at Southwest. If you are happy, good for you, but not everyone wants what you want. Get over yourself.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[LearLove]

Some people would be happy on a Dash 8 the rest of their lives.

yes I would of, but then some jerkoff in an office in Crystal City had to F that up.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Deleted due to lack of interest.

 

[DH2WN]

No, you don't get it. Not everyone wants to be at Southwest. If you are happy, good for you, but not everyone wants what you want. Get over yourself.


Bye Bye--General Lee

You're just an angry bitter person, aren't you? In the attempt to have an intelligent debate with you I realized two things:

1. When someone responds to your comments you don't read them. You just continue on with your minutia assumptions.

2. You are definitely a glass half full person.

Good luck to you...

 

[captboy2001]

Southwest is a good airline if u want to be in a 73 all your life and fly strictly in the us..i would rather take my chances with a real major carrier.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

I hate to beat a dead horse, but I must ask. For the major airlines that survive(AA, UAL, DAL, etc), and with retirements, do you think that there will be any hiring in the next 10+ years.

I still have aspirations of working for a major passenger carrier.

G

Not a dead horse, but beaten by us into something beyond recognition for sure...

Big hiring is starting right now. Will likely be here for 2-4 years. Beyond that there are too many what ifs to make a prediction. Someone will be hiring past 2010, the question is who. I'm hoping its the likes of AA, DAL, SWA, UAL. I would not welcome some new super international airline 49% owned by Europeans.

I used to focus on retirement stats but that is only part of the equation. Retirements have hurt DAL much in the last 2 years.

Pilot contracts, and pensions, are getting squeezed and there is a move toward non-unionized pilot groups. Don't know if that is good or bad. Unions have proven themselves very inflexible when the times have demanded flexibility.

We have seen some visionary folks leave the likes of UAL in 2000 to start again at JetBlue. I talked to a few who were furloughed by AA in the 90's and started at SWA. They chose to stay at SWA when called back. They are doing very well.

Right now it looks like SWA is the best place to be. I agree it is very good and those crazy about SWA look brilliant. Those who interviewed 3 times and finally got on look brilliant too. I hope we continue to look so smart.

In the 1990's those crazy about DAL looked brilliant when they left/turned down FedEX, AA or UAL. In the 80's-'90s the UAL wannabes looked brilliant.

We have seen some leave SWA and FedEx after 1-5 years of seniority to start carreers at AA, DAL and UAL '95-'00. Some DAL folks were accepting call back when they left FedEx. Most of these are furloughed or wishing they made a different decision. Some hated the night schedule and were going to leave anyway.

Whatever the reason, it doesn't matter since the reasons change every cycle, PanAm, TWA, Braniff, Eastern and others aren't here anymore. They all looked really secure at one time. SWA looked shaky for awhile before it stabilized. That is why SWA history is so interesting. I still get asked if I think JetBlue will make it. My answer is it depends on people. Management, employees and competitors. Who knows if any airline will make it?


Something I've seen is folks moving rapidly out of the regionals into the majors with too little PIC time. Don't do that! I was in 737 type school with newly furloughed USAir guys. They were getting the type paid for by Pennsylvania. When we talked about SWA it came out only 1 of the 6 had enough PIC time to apply. It will help you get a corporate job if those turn out to be the best ones in years to come.

 

[jbDC9]

You're just an angry bitter person, aren't you? In the attempt to have an intelligent debate with you I realized two things:

1. When someone responds to your comments you don't read them. You just continue on with your minutia assumptions.

2. You are definitely a glass half full person.

Nope, he's not angry or bitter, just thumping his head against the wall in trying to maybe shed a bit of light into the dark recesses of your tiny, Kool Ade filled brain. Yeaaa, you got hired at SW. Good for you, we're all happy and proud; fruit baskets are on the way. So knock it off with the cheerleading already... SWA isn't the place to be for everyone, some people are actually happy at airlines other than SWA. Amazing huh?

 

[chase]

Dear DH2WN,

While I appreciate your enthusiasm for SWA the reality in the airline business is having one's family and income disrupted is slightly more traumatic than the play you are giving it when you imply that moving from a bankrupt/failed/furloughed position to Southwest is rather simple. I'm sure you realize it is far more complex than that & that while I agree SWA will be growing over the years it has no capacity or capability to take in every pilot who applies, many of whom are those that you described + many others. Therefore the tone of your message appears to some that it is much easier to make the transition & therefore "join the winning team".

SWA isn't for everyone from a passenger standpoint & employment standpoint. I'm sure you realize that but dangling the prospect of an easily acquired job here isn't realistic, I'm sure you would agree....maybe not your intent but postings on public forums come off slightly different than one's intent many times.

As for our future, I've said it before, it is bright but by no means is it guaranteed. While our growth maybe partially dependent on what other carriers do, Southwest has never relied on decisions by other carriers to be the overriding factor in its direction overall....it has certainly responded to weaknesses in the market but some of your comments may come across that SWA's only business model is based upon failures (this equates to personal stories that are replayed on boards like this....there's a human side to it that others are asking you to consider ) of other carriers....we'll respond to that if it occurs but I agree with you, none of us SWA wish financial discomfort on our fellow airline employees.......we've just been fortunate at SWA to never to have had to suffer through those times & I'm sure you're grateful for that fact as much as I & the other 32,000 employees.

General Lee,

To move on to the topic of the thread....do you know if ASA & Comair are still hiring? How many DAL folks are still furloughed & has the recall that was court ordered made any difference...an update on that might be useful for everyone to see...thanks...thanks for your patience!!!!

 

[cactuspilot]

Southwest is a good airline if u want to be in a 73 all your life and fly strictly in the us..i would rather take my chances with a real major carrier.

73,75,A318-21,J3Cub...View is the same out the front. Only diff is how high you flare. If you want to waste 15 years to figure that out...go for it.

 

[DH2WN]

Nope, he's not angry or bitter, just thumping his head against the wall in trying to maybe shed a bit of light into the dark recesses of your tiny, Kool Ade filled brain. Yeaaa, you got hired at SW. Good for you, we're all happy and proud; fruit baskets are on the way. So knock it off with the cheerleading already... SWA isn't the place to be for everyone, some people are actually happy at airlines other than SWA. Amazing huh?

Well, lets get back to the original question. Will legacy airlines be hiring in the next 10 years? Obviously, a student pilot trying to get the beat before making a life determining decision to plow alot of money into training.

My answer was legacy carriers will be and they will furlough again. Again, the sine wave of the economy leads the legacy carriers and if you don't get on at the right time you will get furloughed. Thousands upon thousands of pilots will attest to that fact. If you want to get on with a legacy it's a risk.

Now SWA. Never furloughed. EVER!! Executives who care about employees. See 9/11 when they decided to take losses instead of laying off people. No legacy carrier would even think about that. They immediately sent out the furlough axe. Something to think about as a student pilot thinking of making a career as a pilot when only one airline has the history of job security. What will happen in the future? Legacies will hire and fire. SWA will hire and hopefully not fire. At least we know they won't to make their stock go up a fraction of a point like legacies. It's a last resort for SWA and that is an undesputable fact.

Food for thought as a student pilot. For everyone else, if you don't understand then you don't understand.

As for the cheerleading, I love SWA and will cheerlead until my dying days. Maybe if more companies had employees who loved them there wouldn't be so many problems out there.

 

[labbats]

Now SWA. Never furloughed. EVER!! Executives who care about employees. See 9/11 when they decided to take losses instead of laying off people. No legacy carrier would even think about that. They immediately sent out the furlough axe.

That's so easy to say when you're leading the pack. If they would have continued to bleed money, what would have happened then? What if you didn't have fuel hedged and people wanted the first class cabins you didn't have? The ball bounced your way and things worked out. I applaud that. But let's not go on and on that the same results would have continued if the ball bounced another way.

 

[HalinTexas]

It's amazing how many smart people don't know anything about the true effects of hedging. There are many cascade effects of hedging that effect profits, stock price, and credit.

$30 hedges are not a constant, but neither is $57, $60, $80 crude prices. I've been told that the true measure of Jet A prices on airline operations closely parallel home heating oil prices. SWA is gambling on WTI crude futures, not refined jet fuel prices, or home heating oil. I don't think that those at SWA working futures have done a poor job. Can anyone tell us when and how bad they've done?

CASM and RASM have been the traditional measures of productivity, although that leaves quite a bit to be desired. All revenue and all costs are not always reflected in these measures. Market cap is often overlooked in airline finances since so few have any, but SWA has quite a bit compared to other carriers, I believe. Particularly if you account for relative size.

SWA is the only mature carrier making any money. Mature meaning that many (or most) employees have reached the tops of the pay scales, and leases (if SWA has any) have reached a level past the 5-year bubble that most enjoy. B6 has only been around 5 years. No where close. FL has only been around 10 years, maybe? Most of them were hired in the last 5-6 years. Any airline could be profitable with so junior a workforce and with so new airplanes. Ex: 40% of ATA's seniority list has been around 10 years or more. (That's out of 1000 on the list, approx.) Except for the L10's we have one of the youngest fleets around, but if we still had only our old B727's we'd have been toast a lot sooner. Throw in the cash B6 had when they opened the doors and boom........success.

It is intellectually dishonest to say that hedges are the only reason SWA is profitable. Similarly, it is also dishonest to say that B6 and FL are remaking the industry. However, I'd be watching FL closer, as an investor, because they are closer to making or breaking it big, depending DAL's condition as well as their leadership. I'll wait 5 more years for B6 after they've matured some leases and got their "jungle-bus jets" up and running. I'm also watching all the management moves at bankrupt carriers that are trying to abrogate contracts via 1113 filings, e.g. HAL, and UAL. ATA is coming on yet another crunch time come July 1, when all concessionary agreements expire. Can you say snapback?