Frontier files chapter 11

[StaySeated]

The company says they do not WANT to ask for concessions, but when they DO demand concessions they will act as if they have no choice.

It is all part of the effort to soften the resistance of labor. Befriend, then make someone else the enemy (evil bk counsel), say something along the lines of "we don't have a choice" and then they will just smirk to themselves knowing the inevitable.

If you think that this process will not end without an 1113c than you need to do a search of the last dozen or so BK's and try and find one that didn't result in the total dismantling of the CBA.

This is just another playbook that management relies upon. What disturbs me is that the entire playbook has less than one page and half dozen moves but we as a labor group (all professional pilots) always seem surprised.

 

[sshrae]

Nearly all bankruptcies are "forced by the credit processor". Attempts to characterize this one as any different is just an attempt at "spin".

Your not listening, what he is trying to say is that f9 went bankrupt because fd tried to hold back all the money from credit processing. the majority of bks are because of lack of money coming in and poor business models not because of credit companies holding mone back. this was not like aloha or ata or eos for that matter.

 

[CitationUltra]

Your not listening, what he is trying to say is that f9 went bankrupt because fd tried to hold back all the money from credit processing. the majority of bks are because of lack of money coming in and poor business models not because of credit companies holding mone back. this was not like aloha or ata or eos for that matter.

It's no different. They run short of money or their creditors start pressuring them. Or both.

Obviously you don't know much about the history of corporate bankruptcy proceedings.

 

[sshrae]

It's no different. They run short of money or their creditors start pressuring them. Or both.

Obviously you don't know much about the history of corporate bankruptcy proceedings.

actually i do. you need to do your homework i think before you write.

 

[sshrae]

to add to that, it is very different from these other airlines because f9 is still operating and the others unfortunately are not. i think you take joy in seeing this for some sick reason. thats sad.

 

[CitationUltra]

to add to that, it is very different from these other airlines because f9 is still operating and the others unfortunately are not. i think you take joy in seeing this for some sick reason. thats sad.

You seem to confuse facts and reality with "seeing joy in this." I did not express "joy" in anything that is happening, but you and some others on here seem to think that you can just wish the reality away--that Frontier is somehow "different" than any other airline or any other business.

 

[jetalc]

You seem to confuse facts and reality with "seeing joy in this." I did not express "joy" in anything that is happening, but you and some others on here seem to think that you can just wish the reality away--that Frontier is somehow "different" than any other airline or any other business.

I have had the same impression, based on the recklessness of your posts, for whatever reason. And, to clarify, the credit card PROCESSOR is NOT a creditor. They PROCESS, just like the name implies. It wasn't a creditor that was pressuring F9, it was a company that performs a service for Frontier who didn't want to be stuck holding the bill for tickets in case Frontier folded. Frontier is not gone (yet), and I, too, believe this is quite different from other bankruptcies. Your arrogance regarding this topic (and many other topics, I might add) forces people to respond to your posts as they have. Nobody likes someone who pretends to know it all, and you definitely come across as one of those people.

Frontier is still operating - we'll see what happens in the future. Even the almighty CitationUltra doesn't know.

 

[CitationUltra]

I have had the same impression, based on the recklessness of your posts, for whatever reason. And, to clarify, the credit card PROCESSOR is NOT a creditor. They PROCESS, just like the name implies. It wasn't a creditor that was pressuring F9, it was a company that performs a service for Frontier who didn't want to be stuck holding the bill for tickets in case Frontier folded. Frontier is not gone (yet), and I, too, believe this is quite different from other bankruptcies. Your arrogance regarding this topic (and many other topics, I might add) forces people to respond to your posts as they have. Nobody likes someone who pretends to know it all, and you definitely come across as one of those people.

Frontier is still operating - we'll see what happens in the future. Even the almighty CitationUltra doesn't know.

But a credit card PROCESSOR would be a CREDITOR if left holding the bag in a BANKRUPTCY.

Therefore, the pressure put on Frontier by this PROCESSOR is what ostensibly drove Frontier into BANKRUPTCY.

Consequently, and in regard to their status as a company operating in BANKRUPTCY, they are no different than any other company in the same position.

 

[AnimalTale]

Even the almighty CitationUltra doesn't know.

jetalc,

"almighty" don't give her that much credit. She likes to play the role of the "know it all". Hopefully, she is just playing because she would not have many friends if she really was like this. (No Fly List Candidate).

Dont let these Fools get to you. Go enjoy your life and avoid these "arrogant, stubborn & toxic" so called professional peers.

CCCCCCCCCCCCYYYYYYYYYYYAAAAAAAAA

 

[Shrek]

F9 keep your chin up - it aint over for a long shot

 

[Daytonaflyer]

You guys gotta pull through this. You're still my favorite airline to fly.

 

[StaySeated]

Considering the fact F9 pays my salary, they are definitely my favorite airline to fly. However, without third party financing, we are done.

 

[SpauldingSmails]

Hey guys, at least your passengers like you. I've heard of folks offering to pay cash out of DEN to keep the CC companies out of the loop.

 

[On Your Six]

What's the latest with F9 beyond Chap 11? Anything new?

 

[Fubijaakr]

However, without third party financing, we are done.

Sad, but true. And no one's rushing to give you any money. Too bad. F9 was a good outfit.

 

[hockeypilot44]

If Frontier does end up going out of business, any idea how long it has left?

 

[spinproof]

With Oil @ $125 and going up it doesn't look good for anyone. I really hate to say this but congress needs to step in and approve a fuel surcharge(transportation emergency). Make everyone participate. Short term it will hold things together for awhile.
Long term....... Pray,often and long!!!!

 

[spitfire1500]

Right now anyone on the bottom half of any seniority list (and at some airlines the whole list) needs to be looking on a fallback career. If you have a degree in something outside flying I'd be printing up resumes geared to that career change now...if not I would start taking classes online and grab some student loans. I just took some online classes to get a Funeral Director/Embalmer license I had gotten 15 years ago active again. Right now a lot of families flying over the summer bought their tickets before the economy started really taking a dump and gas started going through the roof!! On my block (about 7 houses in a middle class neighborhood.. homes about 190K in SC) when we got together a few nights ago only 1 family was traveling this summer and they bought their tickets last Nov as a Christmas gift. 3 families on my street are at companies greatly downsizing and worried about even having a job. The last thing they or their companies are going to do is buy airline tickets. Come Sept at the end of summer season there will be massive furloughs everywhere.
Oil prices are not going to drop, sure the US has now cut down by about 2% what we are using...in the past there would be a drop in price, but unlike before there is now a demand in India and China that was never there before, production can't keep up with demand. The worst of it is if oil goes up the cost of everything goes up...except what you are paid. Anyone at an airline that says we have the money to ride out the storm and are in better shape than the other guys has their head stuck in the sand.
Right now my company is doing a lot of flying cargo for the military and for Boeing. But come Christmas if consumers arent buying, companies wont be shipping and we'll start getting hit with big furloughs. Sorry for the doom and gloom guys, but I feel it is best to prepare for the worst instead of sitting around expecting the best.

 

[AA717driver]

When it comes to the airline business, you can never be TOO cynical... Good luck to all! TC

 

[FBN0223]

My bet? Frontier survives. UAL stumbles system wide and out of DEN with the merger and Tilton. WN expands but doesn't shut out the home town airline being that there will be enough gaps in the WN service for F9 to do a decent business.