FO/Flex how would you vote to integrate??

[slowtation capt]

You Goobers

You sure do love the word goobers!

 

[warlord19]

Real sorry that get's under your skin, Slow....lol. Also sorry you don't have any reasonable response to the topics just mentioned.
WL

 

[slowtation capt]

Real sorry that get's under your skin, Slow....lol. Also sorry you don't have any reasonable response to the topics just mentioned.
WL

I'm glad you're proud of yourself, actually thinking it gets under my skin.
Couldn't care
Was just pointing out, that you like the word Goober.
Maybe try expanding your vocabulary, or are you stuck on that word on your word of the day calendar.

 

[doh]

993 Pilot et al
I agree that TWA 2 should stop his continual sword fighting with FO?there really is nothing left to discuss.
The Flex ?anti-union pilots? you mention are not, I believe, anti-union so much as they are pilot?s who don?t feel a need for a union?.if circumstances change for the worst, I believe most of us would come together and vote in a union(hopefully not the 1108). I, and many others I?ve talked with here, don?t see a need for a union now with it?s immediate pay reduction i.e. dues, it?s inevitable decline in work attitudes, service quality, and efficiencies that will follow. You Goobers who post all the lies, half truths, exaggerations, and other BS don?t help your cause. The auto workers in the South, the teachers unions in Wisconson, and many other places are abandoning union membership because they realize what unions are?just another special interest group trying to get your money and then spending that money on themselves and their political cronies.
You say, given time, we will see policy changes here at Flex?..well, DUHHH..if you just put $200M into acquiring a company, would you not put your imprimatur on it. Your fear-mongerring about change is getting a bit long in the tooth and sounds like a bunch of kids in a dark closet afraid to peek out the door. If DAC were to start doing stuff that affects our livelihood and ability to make a descent living I would definitely consider a union. Until then, we are doing just fine without the 1108.
WL

Aside from the name calling (Goobers), Warlord nails it.

 

[V1 Rotate]

Aside from the name calling (Goobers), Warlord nails it.

Agreed. I would be very content to never engage these guys again. It's pointless for either side to continue the debate. However, I highly doubt that it ends here.

 

[warlord19]

doh, the ONLY reason I use that term Goobers is because they(some FO pilots on this board) EARNED it when they so viciously attacked DW and other Flex managers with their foul-mouthed name-calling and despicable gutter-language...if they don't like the Goober moniker, all they have to do is apologize on this board for their foolishness and admit it was stupid....and, I don't expect that anytime soon.
Cheers

 

[V1 Rotate]

doh, the ONLY reason I use that term Goobers is because they(some FO pilots on this board) EARNED it when they so viciously attacked DW and other Flex managers with their foul-mouthed name-calling and despicable gutter-language...if they don't like the Goober moniker, all they have to do is apologize on this board for their foolishness and admit it was stupid....and, I don't expect that anytime soon.
Cheers

I never read anything as ridiculous in the Regionals forum about Mesa and Ornstein as I've read here about Flexjet and it's management. Now, that's saying something!

 

[slowtation capt]

all they have to do is apologize on this board for their foolishness and admit it was stupid....and, I don't expect that anytime soon.
Cheers

Apologize, maybe DW should send out an apology also. Maybe something along the lines of, "So sorry that I have been your CEO for months now, and I am just getting around to sending out an email to tell you that, so sorry I have made zero efforts to communicate with a whole new pilot group that I am now in charge of "

 

[jetwash]

993 Pilot et al
I agree that TWA 2 should stop his continual sword fighting with FO?there really is nothing left to discuss.
The Flex ?anti-union pilots? you mention are not, I believe, anti-union so much as they are pilot?s who don?t feel a need for a union?.if circumstances change for the worst, I believe most of us would come together and vote in a union(hopefully not the 1108). I, and many others I?ve talked with here, don?t see a need for a union now with it?s immediate pay reduction i.e. dues, it?s inevitable decline in work attitudes, service quality, and efficiencies that will follow. You Goobers who post all the lies, half truths, exaggerations, and other BS don?t help your cause. The auto workers in the South, the teachers unions in Wisconson, and many other places are abandoning union membership because they realize what unions are?just another special interest group trying to get your money and then spending that money on themselves and their political cronies.
You say, given time, we will see policy changes here at Flex?..well, DUHHH..if you just put $200M into acquiring a company, would you not put your imprimatur on it. Your fear-mongerring about change is getting a bit long in the tooth and sounds like a bunch of kids in a dark closet afraid to peek out the door. If DAC were to start doing stuff that affects our livelihood and ability to make a descent living I would definitely consider a union. Until then, we are doing just fine without the 1108.
WL

You appear to be conflicted, you start off by saying you don't need a union since they are cause of many problems and everything is good the way it is and you don't want to be associated with those "goobers"

Then you say that if things change for the worse you will then support a union.
( and become a "goober" by your logic)


It will eventually come down to a question of trust.

Are you ready to trust Kenn Ricci 100% and vote no for the union. Thereby putting all of your trust in him that he has your best interest at heart.

OR

Are you a little suspicious of him and worried what he might do to your pay, schedule, benefits etc...
If you are worried then maybe joining with other pilots in negotiating a CBA might be the better option.

I think deep down that is what each pilot will have to decide for himself.

 

[993_Pilot]

Exaggerations? You mean like:

993 Pilot et al
... don?t see a need for a union now with it?s immediate pay reduction i.e. dues, it?s inevitable decline in work attitudes, service quality, and efficiencies that will follow.... WL

Dues at 1.53% is a redution in pay? I happily pay that for the protections it affords me. For instance, KR could potentially cut the Flex pilots pay, or take away any benefit, at any time, without a contract, but that isn't true at Options, precisely because we have a CBA. We both know he won't do that until the threat of a union is gone, but do you really trust and believe that would be true afterwards? Did KR give the Options pilots a pay raise after the Netjets pilots got a new contract like Flexjet and Citationair did?... NO! Taking a wait & see attitude about union representation would cost you a minimum of 4 years at the mercy of KR before you had the benefit of a new CBA. Can you and your family afford that? You & TWA have already made it clear that you would be willing to risk it, but I bet a lot of your co-workers are thinking seriously about the best course to take, and I don't blame them... History teaches a powerful lesson, and DW is merely a puppet now.

BTW, there is no decline in work attitude or service quality either, at least not as a result of the union. That may or may not happen, but it is a direct result of how management treats the pilots. Personally, my attitude and service quality would decline by having to work forced overtime... but then again the FO pilots don't have to, as a direct result of having a union. Can you say that?

 

[doh]

doh, the ONLY reason I use that term Goobers is because they(some FO pilots on this board) EARNED it when they so viciously attacked DW and other Flex managers with their foul-mouthed name-calling and despicable gutter-language...if they don't like the Goober moniker, all they have to do is apologize on this board for their foolishness and admit it was stupid....and, I don't expect that anytime soon.
Cheers

True, point to you.

 

[warlord19]

jet wash…your high school psychological profiling is, uh, sophomoric at best. Conflicted? I expect changes here, just not those that damage our pay and benefits. If there were attacks on these, there are many ways to affect the efficiency of our operation. One way is to consider forming a union. I love how you folks think KR is going to turn into the devil if/when the 1108 disappears, as if he doesn’t have a boss either. His boss is the marketplace, and if he makes the DAC holdings a stinky place to work, no self-respecting pilot would want to work there…I think this concept is foreign to most of you, however.
Goobers…to be eligible for Gooberhood, you(some FO pilots) have seen fit to come on this site and mouth-off scurrilous and childish lies about Flex management. I don’t, and never will, qualify for Gooberhood. Joining a union doesn’t automatically qualify you, but acting like a “goober” does.
And little ole 992…doin your union job of sowing seeds of what may happen and hoping to change a few fence-sitters for your cause. Well, good luck. Another thing history teaches us is the cycle of unions in America. USUALLY brought on by CORRUPT management practices, the union bosses grow rich and just as corrupted as management over time until the whole business collapses or is restarted by new owners. Many unions today are corrupted beyond repair, and their future is shaky at best. I'm happy with my written contract...you'll be among the first to know if that changes.
WL

 

[warlord19]

Oh, and doh, you funny guy, dude.
Cheers

 

[GlorifiedCabbie]

993
I figured these guys are going to complain all the way to the "end of the game" about all the things that are wrong and unfair. But in the end, they will show up to accept their participation trophy.

 

[slowtation capt]

I expect changes here, just not those that damage our pay and benefits. If there were attacks on these, there are many ways to affect the efficiency of our operation.

I do not care for what you have to say in your posts, and I do not know you from anyone else out there.
Having said that, I am going to give you a warning about posting something of the words that you just said above.
If someone does happen to know who you are, and if a post like this got turned into management.
A Flops pilot a few years ago, during negotiations made a comment similar in nature.
A rat had given his login and passcode to management, they saw his post, promptly brought him in, and he was subsequently fired for his suggestive post about a possible work action.

 

[el raton]

I do not care for what you have to say in your posts, and I do not know you from anyone else out there.
Having said that, I am going to give you a warning about posting something of the words that you just said above.
If someone does happen to know who you are, and if a post like this got turned into management.
A Flops pilot a few years ago, during negotiations made a comment similar in nature.
A rat had given his login and passcode to management, they saw his post, promptly brought him in, and he was subsequently fired for his suggestive post about a possible work action.

How does a "rat" acquire a passcode? Sounds like some pilots at fo (similar to flex) are just dumb enough to get themselves fired.

 

[slowtation capt]

How does a "rat" acquire a passcode? Sounds like some pilots at fo (similar to flex) are just dumb enough to get themselves fired.

Guess I mis-spoke and made it hard for some to understand.
It wasn't a passcode, it was his login information and it's easy, just as you signed up for this website. You have a login and a password.
Said person signed up for a message board, the message board was similar in nature to this and to the IBT message board.
It was not the same message board as the 1108 is now.
So, simple enough, he signed up, and gave his username and password to management.

Just as your DO is spending time reading these boards and putting pieces together of who is who. It's easy for him to do, just mention where you overnighted, who you ran into, that you need to go fly right now and can't post, etc.....

He puts all the pieces together and his creating a list of who is who, who is saying what, etc....

Don't believe me, don't care, heard the words from his mouth. Said it himself, said he had be tasked with finding out who is for and against, who is saying positive, who is saying negative on these boards. Everynight he said he monitors the boards.

So they knew who this poster was, brought him on a CGF1 arrival, presented his post, and fired him.
Took some time, but he did get his job back, as he made no more a specific threat to the company than Warlord just did.

 

[jetwash]

jet wash?your high school psychological profiling is, uh, sophomoric at best. Conflicted? I expect changes here, just not those that damage our pay and benefits. ............... I'm happy with my written contract...you'll be among the first to know if that changes.
WL

Wow, it's worst then I thought, the Id and the Super-ego are in a deep struggle.

Freud, help us !!!

 

[Club ORD FO]

Exaggerations? You mean like:

Personally, my attitude and service quality would decline by having to work forced overtime... but then again the FO pilots don't have to, as a direct result of having a union. Can you say that?

Flex doesn't have forced overtime.

Bottom line for me personally is I need a better reason to vote yes than just a threat of things getting bad. When you guys voted in a union things for you sucked, or so I hear. So that would have been a much easier choice and I'm glad you guys got better and pay and work rules. But we are in a totally different situation. We are not rocking net jets pay and benies but we're doing pretty good. So you say that KR might start screwing with us, but so far he hasn't. When is that going to start? I'll admit I was disappointed that we didn't get a raise this year, but we have not for the past 4 years under bombardier either so...

I understand that certain benefits comes with having a union, but there is also something to be said for the threat of a union. It's been working for us for a long time. Every time we have a union drive there are suddenly all sorts of positive changes made. And yes I fully thank net jets for what we have.

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

I do not care for what you have to say in your posts, and I do not know you from anyone else out there.
Having said that, I am going to give you a warning about posting something of the words that you just said above.
If someone does happen to know who you are, and if a post like this got turned into management.
A Flops pilot a few years ago, during negotiations made a comment similar in nature.
A rat had given his login and passcode to management, they saw his post, promptly brought him in, and he was subsequently fired for his suggestive post about a possible work action.

You can only have an illegal work action if you are part of a union.

Before any work action can be legal you must be in contract negotiations and released by a mediator to "self help".

It is actually illegal for a union member to promote any type of job action unless the above criteria is met.