Flight Attendant KCM thread.

[charlie2]

I don't know. How much in union dues have the SWAPA, IPA, APA, and IBT pilots ponied up for KCM to date?

You guys are sad. I'm happy for the FAs. They shouldn't have to put up with the indignity of the TSA security lines anymore than we should.

Hi PCL! Do we really agree on this?

 

[sbnflyer]

I think the main reason people are annoyed is that now the line at the KCM checkpoint will be so long it will be faster to just cut to the front of the regular security line like we always have.

 

[PCL_128]

Hi PCL! Do we really agree on this?

Apparently so! I did forget to include USAPA in the list of free-loaders, though. I apologize for the oversight.

 

[PCL_128]

I think the main reason people are annoyed is that now the line at the KCM checkpoint will be so long it will be faster to just cut to the front of the regular security line like we always have.

To me, KCM isn't just about getting through quickly. It's about avoiding the indignity of dealing with the TSA. I'll gladly wait another minute or two for that.

 

[densoo]

I think the main reason people are annoyed is that now the line at the KCM checkpoint will be so long it will be faster to just cut to the front of the regular security line like we always have.

Except now the TSA can prohibit us from going through anything but the KCM entrance if there is one.

 

[Dirk]

No, we don't need to let chair pushers, et al through on KCM/CASS--they're not crew on an a/c. Sheese...you lose your credibility when you make comments like that. I think "Dirk" is just pissy b/c he's lost some of his "status" and can't believe someone thinks FA's are actually professionals, too. Dirk--take your 4 posts and sit back, listen and learn something.

I don't think most people consider FAs as professionals. The job requirements are a GED. No college or vocational/occupational training is required. One can go from the unemployment line to a major airline in 3.5 weeks.

 

[Rekks Inbound]

I don't think most people consider FAs as professionals. The job requirements are a GED. No college or vocational/occupational training is required. One can go from the unemployment line to a major airline in 3.5 weeks.

Show us in the FAR's where a college degree is required to hold any airman certificate? Last I checked, a high school diploma or GED is the only thing required.

Peace.

Rekks

 

[PCL_128]

I don't think most people consider FAs as professionals.

Then those people are arrogant pr!cks.

 

[Snapshot]

Show us in the FAR's where a college degree is required to hold any airman certificate? Last I checked, a high school diploma or GED is the only thing required.

Could you show us where in the FAR's a high school diploma or GED is required to hold any airman certificate? You know, from the last time you checked.

 

[Dirk]

Show us in the FAR's where a college degree is required to hold any airman certificate? Last I checked, a high school diploma or GED is the only thing required.

Peace.

Rekks

Your comprehension skills are amazing. Where in my post did I mentioned an FAR requirement for a college degree?

 

[Dirk]

Then those people are arrogant pr!cks.

I don't see why that makes someone an arrogant prick. I don't consider the job of a gate agent, ramper, or fueler to be in the professional category either. Is that mean? So why are flight attendants different? Because they travel?

 

[PCL_128]

I don't see why that makes someone an arrogant prick. I don't consider the job of a gate agent, ramper, or fueler to be in the professional category either. Is that mean? So why are flight attendants different? Because they travel?

Yes, that is "mean." Show some respect for your fellow workers.

 

[Dirk]

Yes, that is "mean." Show some respect for your fellow workers.

I always show respect, I simply don't consider a FA job to be one of prowess.

 

[B727FA]

I think the main reason people are annoyed is that now the line at the KCM checkpoint will be so long it will be faster to just cut to the front of the regular security line like we always have.

Go right ahead!

 

[B727FA]

Thx gang for having the FA's back. The vast majority of professional crew members recognize the role both of us play in the safe, timely and comfortable operation of our flight regardless of on which side of the door we sit.

There will always be "aisle donkeys" and "yoke yankers." The fact is, as most reasoned minds will honestly acknowledge, a degree of any kind above GED/HS isn't required to hold the qualifications of our jobs. That doesn't make a person competitive in the job market; but it's not REQUIRED.

FA's can come on line quickly, true (though DL is currently running 2 months 7days/wk). But think of the pilot mills like ATP, American Flyyers, et al who crank out ab initio to all ratings in <6 months.

I've never understood the abject anger (fear?) that so many pilots have when recognizing that there are other professional people who work in "their" industry and even (egads!) on the aircraft. Professionalism shared is not diluted but enhanced.

For those who say, "It was never meant to be a career," speak for yourself.

To quote a favorite movie of mine, "Whatever Happened to Baby Jane" wherein Blanche (pilots) says "You'd never be able to do these things to be if I weren't in this chair!" (You never were meant to stay in this uneducated JOB for more than a few years; it's not a career.) And Jane responds, "But you *are* Blanche, you *are*!" (FA's "But we HAVE, pilots, we HAVE!")

 

[Dirk]

Thx gang for having the FA's back. The vast majority of professional crew members recognize the role both of us play in the safe, timely and comfortable operation of our flight regardless of on which side of the door we sit.

There will always be "aisle donkeys" and "yoke yankers." The fact is, as most reasoned minds will honestly acknowledge, a degree of any kind above GED/HS isn't required to hold the qualifications of our jobs. That doesn't make a person competitive in the job market; but it's not REQUIRED.

FA's can come on line quickly, true (though DL is currently running 2 months 7days/wk). But think of the pilot mills like ATP, American Flyyers, et al who crank out ab initio to all ratings in <6 months.

I've never understood the abject anger (fear?) that so many pilots have when recognizing that there are other professional people who work in "their" industry and even (egads!) on the aircraft. Professionalism shared is not diluted but enhanced.

For those who say, "It was never meant to be a career," speak for yourself.

To quote a favorite movie of mine, "Whatever Happened to Baby Jane" wherein Blanche (pilots) says "You'd never be able to do these things to be if I weren't in this chair!" (You never were meant to stay in this uneducated JOB for more than a few years; it's not a career.) And Jane responds, "But you *are* Blanche, you *are*!" (FA's "But we HAVE, pilots, we HAVE!")

Most pilots don't have a disdain for FAs. Great FAs can actually make a trip much more enjoyable, but you seem to be searching for some sort of parity between the two jobs. There isn't a whole lot. The point about the college degree is not in the context of obtaining qualifications, but in the requirement to obtain a job. Delta requires a bachelors degree. Fedex requires a bachelors degree. Alaska requires a bachelors degree. Other major airlines may not require it, but competitive minimums may essentially necessitate it.

It's true that a person can obtain a commercial pilot certificate rather quickly from one of the places that you mentioned, but that still involves tens of thousands of dollars of investment in training, and even then it only opens the door to entry level time-building jobs. Eventually, an entry-level job in the airline industry can be had. Years later, with some luck, a person can get hired at a place like Delta. So that new-hire FO at Delta generally has over 10 years of civilian or military flight experience, thousands of flight hours, and a bachelors degree. Compare that to some of the FAs hired at Delta. For many of them, Delta is their first full time job. Not much of a comparison.

You seem to have somewhat of a "me too, show me some respect, I'm important too" attitude.

 

[PCL_128]

You seem to have somewhat of a "me too, show me some respect, I'm important too" attitude.

And what's wrong with someone thinking that they deserve a little respect?

 

[B727FA]

Great FAs can actually make a trip much more enjoyable, but you seem to be searching for some sort of parity between the two jobs.

Good pilots can make a trip much more enjoyable, too. I'm not asking for "parity" with a commercial pilot's job...it's not my job. But I'm not out of line for expecting a "parity" of respect. The longer you seek to belittle FA's for wanting/expecting respect for the job THEY do, the more you distance yourself as one of those "good pilots."

Frankly, sir, you're on the wrong side of this issue.

 

[SplitBar]

Good pilots can make a trip much more enjoyable, too. I'm not asking for "parity" with a commercial pilot's job...it's not my job. But I'm not out of line for expecting a "parity" of respect. The longer you seek to belittle FA's for wanting/expecting respect for the job THEY do, the more you distance yourself as one of those "good pilots."

Frankly, sir, you're on the wrong side of this issue.

I wouldn't let this tool ruffle your feathers too much. Let him come back when he has some 121 experience grows up a bit and hopefully his views will change.

 

[Dirk]

I wouldn't let this tool ruffle your feathers too much. Let him come back when he has some 121 experience grows up a bit and hopefully his views will change.

Ooooooh, the knight in shining armour, gallantly coming to the rescue!!