FlexJet / Flight Options / SkyJet

[slowtation capt]

Actually there is. It is called Yammer and Flexjet has been training everyone else in your company how to be a part. It is a way that crews and departments in the office can communicate with each other, which from what I understand is not allowed by the IBT.

Where do you guys get this, the IBT won't allow it.

By the way, we have a messaging system where I can talk to anyone that I want to at anytime.

It's called email.

 

[ProFracPilot]

Actually there is. It is called Yammer and Flexjet has been training everyone else in your company how to be a part. It is a way that crews and departments in the office can communicate with each other, which from what I understand is not allowed by the IBT.

Every employee group EXCEPT the pilots (but including flight attendants) received an "invite" from KCR himself to sign up for Yammer. It makes more sense that it is Kenn who doesn't want the pilots on Yammer just yet, not the union.

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

Seniority lists only matter if there is a union, without one all decision of who crews what aircraft, vacations, pay will be managements to make without any input from the pilots if they desire. Sure you might have the opportunity to bid on an aircraft if there is a slot available but, if for example the company is over staffed in the Citation X but is getting some 350's wouldn't it be most cost effective to just transfer the excess CX pilots to the 350 without all the the extra training event cost of pilots bidding for the position and everyone moving up the food chain. In a non union company that is possible, under the current union contract it is not.

At FJ it is done by seniority if there us a difference of pay. If the pay is the same the company will usually still ask girl volunteers. If one fleet is being downsized they go where there seniority can hold unless the pay is the same.

You don't heed a union to have a seniority list.

 

[ProFracPilot]

At FJ it is done by seniority if there us a difference of pay. If the pay is the same the company will usually still ask girl volunteers. If one fleet is being downsized they go where there seniority can hold unless the pay is the same.

You don't heed a union to have a seniority list.

Can you state, unequivocally, that pilot movement at Flex has been exclusively based on seniority? If a move wasn't based on seniority, then what was the criteria for allowing a certain pilot or pilots to bid on, say, a new and larger aircraft?

 

[wingsnthings]

No need for sarcasm. Just answering your question. I wish you guys were on it so we could have conversations and prove/or stop rumors with people in positions that have the real answers. It's not messaging or email. It is a real time communication tool that we can communicate with multiple departments to provide feedback, ask questions, get others opinions, etc.

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

Where do you guys get this, the IBT won't allow it.

By the way, we have a messaging system where I can talk to anyone that I want to at anytime.

It's called email.

Ask the IBT why you aren't on Yammer. It is like enterprise social media. Everyone on the FJ side has been enrolled. It allows like pilots all the way up yo the president herself to discuss important items in an open forum.

The IBT refused to all management to have a direct avenue of communication with the pilots that they could not control. It might also have something to do with the fact that it uses your real name. You hig union bullies wouldn't like that.

Oh, and thus thread is a hit topic today. So far you have ZERO support.

 

[ProFracPilot]

The IBT refused to all management to have a direct avenue of communication with the pilots that they could not control. It might also have something to do with the fact that it uses your real name. You hig union bullies wouldn't like that.

You're mistaken, my friend. There is nothing in our contract that would prevent Kenn from opening up Yammer to the pilots. If it isn't in the contract, the union can't stop it.

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

Can you state, unequivocally, that pilot movement at Flex has been exclusively based on seniority? If a move wasn't based on seniority, then what was the criteria for allowing a certain pilot or pilots to bid on, say, a new and larger aircraft?

Let's say we start to draw down the Lear 45 fleet. FOs pay is not based on equipment. As the fleet draws down they would offer positions to another aurcraft type in seniority order. Even if you you go to class a month after someone junior to you if doesn't affect your pay.

Challenger captain slots must come from Lear captains. When a slot opens it is offered in seniority order.

You don't bid here, they call you when a slot cones open to see if you want it.

The seniority list is published quarterly so if something happens out of seniority it would be readily apparent. It doesn't happen.

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

You're mistaken, my friend. There is nothing in our contract that would prevent Kenn from opening up Yammer to the pilots. If it isn't in the contract, the union can't stop it.

Ok, go on your union message board or call your MEC and ask them about Yammer.

 

[jetwash]

No need for sarcasm. Just answering your question. I wish you guys were on it so we could have conversations and prove/or stop rumors with people in positions that have the real answers. It's not messaging or email. It is a real time communication tool that we can communicate with multiple departments to provide feedback, ask questions, get others opinions, etc.

We had that sort of chat a few years back during the contract negotiations where pilots could ask manages questions in an open forum and all could read the responses.
It was discontinued when some uncomfortable questions were asked and management did not want to respond.

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

We had that sort of chat a few years back during the contract negotiations where pilots could ask manages questions in an open forum and all could read the responses.
It was discontinued when some uncomfortable questions were asked and management did not want to respond.

So far management answers anything that they can. They do have NDI about certain things and those don't get broken.

 

[jetwash]

So far management answers anything that they can. They do have NDI about certain things and those don't get broken.

The problem before was that a lot of dirty laundry was being aired out and certain managers did not want their bosses to know what was really going on.

Its called Plausible deniability.

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

We actually have a bunch of good managers here at FJ. They aren't perfect and make mistakes, but as long as you are honest and don't try to cover things up the worse you get is a "don't do that again" speech.

It takes quite a bit to get fired at FJ. We have crews here that have made lots of silly mistakes. As long as you go in and accept responsibility nothing comes of it.

 

[Club ORD FO]

You're mistaken, my friend. There is nothing in our contract that would prevent Kenn from opening up Yammer to the pilots. If it isn't in the contract, the union can't stop it.

Our CEO specifically said that the union will not allow the options pilots to join the message board. Said they do not want direct communication between management and pilots.

but seriously, look into on your side. If you can get on yammer with us that would be cool

 

[V1 Rotate]

I was skeptical of Yammer last year or so when it came out but it's existence has been a major reason why Flexjet pilots are mostly united and the communication with the President, VP, DO and Chief Pilots is so great. The messages we receive may not always be great, but it's an awesome avenue to have discussions. I believe the FLOPs guys would be very receptive to it, given the opportunity. You guys really should submit to the 1108 a request to be involved. It would take about two seconds to create a group dedicated to just us.

 

[Ludicrous Speed]

Just to be clear and for my own sense of understanding, y'all are wrapped around the axle because we're not having these discussions on Yammer, is that it? And that we should be having these discussions on Yammer, but the 1108 won't allow it, right? And if I just get on Yammer, I'll see how trustworthy the VP's and CEO's are right? Did I understand it right?

Um, wow. Well, if you really wanna know what those trustworthy VP's & CEO's are doing, go visit your office coworkers in Dallas and Cleveland and ask them. Ask them where the new headquarters is gonna be located. Ask them how many have already lost their jobs. Ask them how many are sweating their cojones off wondering if they're gonna have a job next month.

We can not tolerate this divisiveness. Already, we're one pilot group. We just need to start acting like one.

 

[993_Pilot]

Why are you so worried about McCaskill-Bond and how the two pilot groups are going to be combined and about fences? Thats only for companies with unions...

Absolutely WRONG. Although, I would agree that a union is much more likely to have it applied/enforced.

Just to be clear and for my own sense of understanding, y'all are wrapped around the axle because we're not having these discussions on Yammer, is that it? And that we should be having these discussions on Yammer, but the 1108 won't allow it, right? And if I just get on Yammer, I'll see how trustworthy the VP's and CEO's are right? Did I understand it right?

Yammer is simpy a place where management can listen to, and essentially control the dialog. The fact that they can see everyone's name, only leads to guarded posts and downright A$$ kissing, not honest, candid replies. To be fair, FI has it's share of problems, and unfortunately there are a few very vocal posters who garner the lion's share of the attention. Although they don't necessarily represent the majority, at least they can make a post without fear of reprisal.

We can not tolerate this divisiveness. Already, we're one pilot group. We just need to start acting like one.

Amen. Management has divided the two pilot groups and is now loving how both sides continue to drive the wedge in further. I don't care if you are pro-union, or anti-union, we all need to wake up and realize that we need to find some common ground and find a way to stand united ... or divided, we will fall.

 

[el raton]

Amen. Management has divided the two pilot groups and is now loving how both sides continue to drive the wedge in further. I don't care if you are pro-union, or anti-union, we all need to wake up and realize that we need to find some common ground and find a way to stand united ... or divided, we will fall.[/QUOTE]

What's dividing us is the fear of unfair integration.

 

[slowtation capt]

Amen. Management has divided the two pilot groups and is now loving how both sides continue to drive the wedge in further. I don't care if you are pro-union, or anti-union, we all need to wake up and realize that we need to find some common ground and find a way to stand united ... or divided, we will fall.

What's dividing us is the fear of unfair integration.[/QUOTE]


This was my point when I first put my post up with the Union's message from their meetings. I was trying to show how the Union is working for both sides, since we are going to be 1 pilot group. We need to come together and make this work for everyone. My hope is that this will become the best place to work, once we combine the groups and companies. I DO feel that the only way this place will be the best place to work is with having the 1108 on our property.

I know that I have gotten a little heated and emotional over some posts, it has nothing to do with anybody that feels differently about the 1108. Everyone has their choice to make, they have their belief's and that is fine. You do what is correct for you and your career. I however have decided that after 15 yrs, 4 CEO's, 3 owners, and countless managers that I am sticking with the 1108.

Now I have gotten excited and emotional over some things, and mainly those things are coming from the mouth of the completely wrong, trying to start lies TWA 2 ASA FO. So far everything that this guy has said is completely way off base, a complete lie, or is trying to start something.

His lies start with: Telling me that FlightOps has no mx at 10pm at night, A union VP is telling a FlexJet FO that the list is done, it's DOH and he is going to be furloughed, and that the Union is stopping the company from letting the pilots onto a Facebook Messenger for the corporate world called Yammer.

So I apologize to anyone that thought I was trying to push the 1108 on them. I have made up my mind, you are to do the same, however I do implore you to not listen to the crap the spews from TWA 2 ASA FO's mouth.

 

[shanes123]

I am not sure where you got that from. I guess this is once again union 101, discredit anyone that has a differing view. You don't know me from Adam. These are just wild a baseless accusations. I would be offended if I worried about your impression of me. I don't.

If you guys don't graduate above union 101 you guys are screwed.

It us really funny watching the 3-5 of you grasping at straws to a battle you have already lost. IBT national won't devote the kind of $$$$ you need girl this fight. I saw this with ALPA at the regionals. You pay dues and are promised equal representation, but once you start costing the mother IBT $$$ you will see just much of a red-headed step child you will become.

I know you very well..And I know your a smoking hole waiting to happen..