Flexjet Big Day...jan 15th

[Deftone45075]

Admitedly, bases still stink, and health insurance is very mediocre. What else do you have a problem with?

208 days a year...

 

[Wankel7]

208 days a year...

Yeah where does this 202 thing come from? The standard bid is 16.... 16X13 bid periods = 208

 

[doylehargraves]

A 4th year captain will make $102,128. That is definitely more than most. I'll say I'm happy with the wages. Let's move forward with QOL issues now........

 

[jackpilot]

Also, with regards to the 401k (dollar for dollar) match up to 6%...there will be an additional 2-4% put into your 401k by the company whether the employee puts anything in or not.

The variable will be (age + years of service) that dictates whether its 2,3, or 4%.

More food on the table when we retire.

THANKS FLEXJET.

 

[EdAtTheAirport]

Let's give them credit. They stepped up in a big way. They threw money at us. I'll take it.

The pay scale does not reflect the annual bonus, so add 5% to the pay scale. That 3 yr Capt pay is just a holiday away from six-figures!

Yeah, we have those other issues like floating rest. We'll just have to keep chipping away and making suggestions.

Ya know what guys? They want to operate like they want to operate - floating rest and gateways and all. They get those statistics that DG is so proud of, from operating like they do. They're willing to pay for it. There are those who are happy with what they pay, and those who aren't. So there ya go.

If anyone thinks that this group is willing to give this up to bring in a union, picket, go on strike if necessary, then I have some land 50 miles south of HTO to sell you.

 

[notapilot]

Don't mean to rain on the parade, but less than a 2% year over year raise at years 10-15 (Lear and Challenger). That doesn't even keep up with inflation. Could have been better at the top end for sure.

 

[Flex-ible]

Also, with regards to the 401k (dollar for dollar) match up to 6%...there will be an additional 2-4% put into your 401k by the company whether the employee puts anything in or not.

The variable will be (age + years of service) that dictates whether its 2,3, or 4%.

More food on the table when we retire.

THANKS FLEXJET.

As I understand it, in order to get the upgraded 401(k) you have to give up the defined benefit pension benefit. Definitely need to crunch numbers on this.

 

[Wankel7]

It is also amazing...this is a huge raise...where did this come from? If the raises never happened at NJ...where would have the money gone they gave up in this raise?

 

[CA1900]

Ski-Doos.

 

[jonjuan]

What about the pension. I talked with a 604 CA the other day who said that his pension will pay $40K a year. Is this true?

 

[LukinUp]

Great! Looks like CS is now the 3rd highest paying frac. ????

 

[gunfyter]

Great! Looks like CS is now the 3rd highest paying frac. ????

What about XOJet?

 

[Frac Cap]

And Flops isn't even in the ball game.

Congrats Flex Jet pilots. I'm happy to see your company step up.

 

[Buckeye]

It's nice to see that others are begining to be fairly compensated, hopefully things will continue to move forward. I am glad to see it, if PAY/QOL continues to rise at the Fracs it will be the place to be. Next time I over night with some Flex boys, they can buy the beers!:beer:

 

[Buckeye]

It's nice to see that others are begining to be fairly compensated, hopefully things will continue to move forward. I am glad to see it, if PAY/QOL continues to rise at the Fracs it will be the place to be. Next time I over night with some Flex boys, they can buy the beers!

This isn't a double post, I am just a big boy and need my room.

 

[Wankel7]

Its almost like an arms race

I wonder if this will ever happen at a regionals?

 

[LukinUp]

Great! Looks like CS is now the 3rd highest paying frac. ????

What about XOJet?

Okay...4th! Anyone else want to make me feel even more underpaid???

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

What about the pension. I talked with a 604 CA the other day who said that his pension will pay $40K a year. Is this true?

No way. The maximum years they count is 20 X the now highest $137k is only $27.4k year. Maybe the company the 604 pilots work for has a different retirement plan. Or maybe he was just telling you how it isn't.

 

[frac pilot]

Pension hasn't changed:
Highest five years salary x years of service x 1%

A challenger Capt averaging $130,000 x 30 years of service x 1% = $39,000/yr. No limit to the number of years used to calculate pension benefit. Obviously the number will changed with salary differences and years of service.

 

[notapilot]

I am happy the bottom and mid level scale improved. The problem is Lear and Challenger captains years 10-15 only increase 1.6% year over year. The owners contracts increase according to the CPI as should the pay scale. Less buying power from years 10 on is not what I would celebrate. If you are not already at this end of the scale you might find yourself there someday.

 

[SDCFI]

Pension

A question was posed by a NJA friend of mine: how stable is this pension plan? Who's to say Bombardier won't pull the rug out so to speak as soon as they get strapped for cash at some point? I'm thinking it would better long-term to take the extra company match 401(k) and just dump as much money as possible in there. The upside to the pension plan is there's no cost to the employee, so even if they do terminate the plan you're not really losing anything, except possibly the extra match you wouldn't be getting from the new 401(k). So do you gamble on the pension staying and keep it with the "old" 401(k) or dump the pension and take the extra match?

 

[notapilot]

The chart will not format correctly. link to historical inflation rates.

http://www.inflationdata.com/inflation/Inflation_Rate/HistoricalInflation.aspx

 

[notapilot]

We are not talking about $75G/yr pensions. At present the most a 30 yr employee would see is about $40G/yr. It would be nearly impossible for anyone to exceed the maximum benefit provided by the PBGC. I say diversity is the best medicine. An extra 3-7% 401k match ($450-$1000/yr) will take a long time or very high returns to equal $40G/yr until you die. This is unless you get run over by a bus a week after your last flight.

 

[jackpilot]

Can someone please post the new "official" pay scales?

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

I would apply if there was a reasonable commute for me (as in Home Basing, MKE, ORD). The basing situation is unworkable for me, and for many others, just like NJA's was.

cliff
YYZ

 

[CaveoFalco]

We are not talking about $75G/yr pensions. At present the most a 30 yr employee would see is about $40G/yr. It would be nearly impossible for anyone to exceed the maximum benefit provided by the PBGC. I say diversity is the best medicine. An extra 3-7% 401k match ($450-$1000/yr) will take a long time or very high returns to equal $40G/yr until you die. This is unless you get run over by a bus a week after your last flight.

Worse yet, what happens if you don't make it to retirement - pension, going, going, gone!

What happens if you have to leave for whatever reason (family crisis, better job, fired) - pension, going, going, gone!

What did UAL get for their pension? Heard it was 10 cents on the dollar.

It might work for you but I like to control my own destiny. For example retiring at 65, cypherin' on a bar napkin with a stubby pencil:

Company match - 7500 at 7% for 30 years = 708,000

Company match (age 50) - 2500 at 7% for 15 years = 62000

Total (Company Match Only) = 770,000
Invested at 5% for 20 years with annuity = 59,000 per year until age 85.

That is only the Company match for comparison.

Personal Contribution - 15000 at 7% for 30 years = 1.4 Million

Personal Contribution (Age 50) - 5000 at 7% for 15 years = 125,000

Total Personal = 1,525,000
Match = 770,000
Total 401K = 2,295,000

Invested at 5% for 20 years with annuity = 175,000 per year until age 85.

Don't make it that far? Whatever you had when you departed is yours including match once vested.

 

[EdAtTheAirport]

Caveo, I have no idea what you're talking about, but with fourteen posts, total, what's your interest in this thread?

 

[Flex-ible]

Pension or 401(k)?

An extra 3-7% 401k match ($450-$1000/yr) will take a long time or very high returns to equal $40G/yr until you die..

Better recheck your math. 7% of 1st year FO pay is $3,920. 7% of top pay is almost 10 grand. PER YEAR.

Without running the numbers, I would guess that for people already vested in the pension it is worth staying. For recent hires, take a real good look at the 401(k). Especially if company $$ continues to vest in 4 years.

 

[On Your Six]

Hi!

I would apply if there was a reasonable commute for me (as in Home Basing, MKE, ORD). The basing situation is unworkable for me, and for many others, just like NJA's was.

cliff
YYZ

That's the problem Cliff. While the pay boost is a good thing and the schedule change to 7/7 offering is now "baseline" for the industry, the domicile issue is the biggest red flag. I agree that Flex management is probably keeping that card for the eventual union negotiations - they don't want to give everything away now.

That's too bad because Flex can now be more competitive for the "best" pilots out there only if those pilots want to restrict themselves to four locations. Not everyone wants to live in those locations. Meanwhile, Netjets, CS and Avantair each offer 20+ domiciles - why can't Flexjet? I bet FLOPS offers more domiciles than Flexjet. Doesn't make a lot of sense unless this is a negotiating tactic...

 

[LaGarbage Man]

Congrats to the Flex crew's, Nice pay raise. Also a Big Shout out to my Ex-Indy Peeps over there. I still need some better base options for me to hit the submit button on the appplication though. I'll keep watching for that IAD base.