ERJ XJT PBS Questions

[Clutch]

We "perfer" it.

 

[www.]

Imagine your the ASA MEC sched committee and you have stated the perf bid ASA has is the best of the best.
Now some small timer from XJT runs analysis and determines that another perf bid is far superior to that of ASA.

Of Course the ASA Neg committee will dig in and tell everyone it's their perf bid or nothing, just to save face and not be thrown out by the ASA pilots.

Let's say your an old fart retired from major airline and has no life so he sits on web boards looking to stick his nose into some thing he has no idea what the hell he's talking about much less knows the players and the game.

 

[Freebrd]

getting rid of vacation low. But my opinion is for sale. If the company compensates me well enough in other parts of the contract I'd consider the trade off. Better be some damn good compensation though or they can pound sand.

Anyways, have fun with smartpref bid ERJ peeps and let us, know how it goes!

hearing the Co or union offered another week of vacation, yeah like thats equal to the additional weeks off one can get with vacation low

 

[Tarzan]

No and they won't either. They prefer back room tactics and no communication. After all.....they know whats REALLY best for the pilot group.

Oh, and be assured they'll get a little bonus to sell it to us. Maybe 8 hours per day for "union business"


XJT MEC can't take over fast enough as far as I'm concerned.

You'll be whining then too. Little girl.


http://asamec.alpa.org/portals/32/p...e_paper_smartpref_and_flightline_analysis.pdf

Read your comms every now and then.

 

[Nevets]

Smartpref was looked at. They had no customers, no track record, and no sound financial backing according to one of the 3 pilots on that committee. According to him, the Company refused to continue any further investigation because it did not want to take the risk. That has not changed, but they will let your Sched Committee play in the sand box all you want as long as it does not cost them a penny. Good luck with your test. We will all be watching with great interest.

See below, it wasn't really looked at. And now they have a paying customer in our company, a track record, and the company is working with crewing solutions and our scheduling committee to bring it online. The first parallel bid went so well that they ended up using the smartpref solution.

You'll be whining then too. Little girl.


http://asamec.alpa.org/portals/32/p...e_paper_smartpref_and_flightline_analysis.pdf

Read your comms every now and then.

My understanding is that they have not run any solutions using real trips or anything other than the generic version I the software. Basically, that it wasn't an honest unbiased attempt to research it thoroughly.

 

[Tarzan]

Whatever makes you feel better. What was researched was how the logic worked in the software. You can't write rules to usurp software logic unless the entire base code is rewritten. I don't think the the guy who wrote it (retired in France) is going to do that.

But you're right. Our MEC didn't research anything. By the way, the way you research software in an unbiased manner is researching the what the base code does, not what you HOPE it can do once you add "work rules" to it.

 

[Nevets]

Whatever makes you feel better. What was researched was how the logic worked in the software. You can't write rules to usurp software logic unless the entire base code is rewritten. I don't think the the guy who wrote it (retired in France) is going to do that.

But you're right. Our MEC didn't research anything. By the way, the way you research software in an unbiased manner is researching the what the base code does, not what you HOPE it can do once you add "work rules" to it.

All of you always say its about the work rules. Our guys used our current work rules to show that QOL can be at least the same as our current line bidding and work rules despite using PBS. That is how you compare the logic, through the scientific method. And you need a control subject for an unbiased scientific method of comparison. In this case the only control subject available is the existing work rules and bidding method currently used. That is how you test a PBS software!

Your research compared your current PBS AND work rules to a generic PBS software logic with no programmed work rules or even real pairings. And I'm talking about your work rules and your pairings, not ours. That is not a fair or scientific comparison. It seems like it was not an unbiased way of researching. They were probably looking for an answer that was already preconceived, kind of like the global warming crowd. And that doesn't make me feel better either.

 

[enuffalready]

All of you always say its about the work rules. Our guys used our current work rules to show that QOL can be at least the same as our current line bidding and work rules despite using PBS. That is how you compare the logic, through the scientific method. And you need a control subject for an unbiased scientific method of comparison. In this case the only control subject available is the existing work rules and bidding method currently used. That is how you test a PBS software!

Your research compared your current PBS AND work rules to a generic PBS software logic with no programmed work rules or even real pairings. And I'm talking about your work rules and your pairings, not ours. That is not a fair or scientific comparison. It seems like it was not an unbiased way of researching. They were probably looking for an answer that was already preconceived, kind of like the global warming crowd. And that doesn't make me feel better either.

We want our PBS. You can research yours all you want....I say keep your line bidding, or take whatever PBS you want....keep the groups separate.

 

[Nevets]

We want our PBS. You can research yours all you want....I say keep your line bidding, or take whatever PBS you want....keep the groups separate.

In other words you are doing the equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears and saying, "lalalalalala I can't hear you."

 

[ASADriver]

Nevets is the LXJT version of General Lee.

 

[dojetdriver]

Nevets is the LXJT version of General Lee.

What does that make JoeMerchant?

 

[www.]

What does that make JoeMerchant?

Your man crush!

 

[enuffalready]

In other words you are doing the equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears and saying, "lalalalalala I can't hear you."

I'm saying I'm happy with our pbs. Devil I know is better than devil I don't. Especially when I'll be stuck with her for 5+ years.

You are right. What was I thinking. It's makes sooo much more sense to scrap everything in favor of a completely new and non real world tested PBS, rather than just tweak one that has a history being used in our actual contract and work rules. Yeah....that makes complete sense.

 

[Nevets]

I'm saying I'm happy with our pbs. Devil I know is better than devil I don't. Especially when I'll be stuck with her for 5+ years.

You are right. What was I thinking. It's makes sooo much more sense to scrap everything in favor of a completely new and non real world tested PBS, rather than just tweak one that has a history being used in our actual contract and work rules. Yeah....that makes complete sense.

It's not completely new though. And it has been tested real world and continues to be. But my real point was that your side hasn't even done real scientific method non-bias research. Our guys did a scientific method comparison of your PBS and concluded that without significant work rule improvements (including keeping vacation low as is, which the company has said is not gonna happen so get on board), it would be a decrease in QOL. Obviously your guys will do what they want to do regardless. Just pointing things out, that's all. No need to take it personal.

 

[enuffalready]

It's not completely new though. And it has been tested real world and continues to be. But my real point was that your side hasn't even done real scientific method non-bias research. Our guys did a scientific method comparison of your PBS and concluded that without significant work rule improvements (including keeping vacation low as is, which the company has said is not gonna happen so get on board), it would be a decrease in QOL. Obviously your guys will do what they want to do regardless. Just pointing things out, that's all. No need to take it personal.

Personal would imply I care....I don't. As long as we are left separate. I have yet to talk to a single Asa pilot that wants your line bidding or PBS option.... You want it.... You keep it. Leave us out..

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