Engine Fire Joining LOC on Approach

[LearLove]

Cleared for approach and you get an engine fire while joining the LOC. WWYD?

turn the volume on your ipod up so you can't hear the fire bell and stick your head in your backpack to block your vision of the warning lights - this should fix the problem.

 

[Flyerdan]

Cleared for approach and you get an engine fire while joining the LOC. WWYD?

Turn away from a perfectly good airport/runway and land in a river. Then when people ask you why you made the decision you can tell them you saw it done on TV and thought it would make you famous, get you a book deal, speaking engagements, and perhaps a movie deal as well.

 

[flyboyike]

I don't see what all the excitement is about. An engine fire is (as fires go) a relatively "nice" fire. Why? Because it's outside the fuselage. Worst case scenario it will burn through the titanium bolts that attach the nacelle to the pylon, and the engine will depart the aircraft and take out uncle Joe's chicken coop. This is why God invented insurance.

And I don't know what airline does an "immediate 180 for an immediate landing" after a fire at V1. Ask for a box pattern, do your checklists and shoot the approach when ready.

Now, a fire inside the fuselage (wiring and such) is another matter entirely.

 

[BoilerUP]

I'd be a G-D PIC and not pose such a stupid question to the interwebs.

As noted, an engine fire (which is exceedingly rare in modern turbofans) isn't a "OMFG land RFN" situation like a cabin or cargo fire is. You don't want to lollygag, but you don't need to panic either.

Fast is slow and slow is fast; run the memory items, perform the IAC as best you can, but you're at the marker so put the airplane on the ground.

No need to scream FIRE and panic and rush about the cockpit and forget something important OR do something really stupid like shut down the wrong engine.

Shoot the hostage.

I see what you did there.

"Say goodbye Harry!"

 

[Mercyful Fate]

Better get Ted Stryker up there to help

 

[mesaba13]

Do the emergency card which typiclly involves shutting fuel etc, if the fire goes out you circle back and complete checklists and land. If the fire does not go out you land at the SE flap setting.

 

[CA1900]

I see what you did there.

"Say goodbye Harry!"

I'm glad somebody caught it! :laugh:

 

[Stifler's Mom]

If landing on 27L or 28 in ATL, don't hit The Pink Pony.

 

[BigPappa]

So you wouldn't land immediately if the fire happened outside the FAF or are you just saying you would run the QRH and land immediately outside the FAF?

As stupid as you all think the OP's question is, I've had to commandeer the airplane during two separate lofts now with smoke/fire (or possible fire) on board after the CA wanted to hold or execute a missed approach. Maybe that was with a couple of you on here.

You did not! Now stop pretending like you're Chuck Yeager.

 

[Max Q]

Yes hahhhhhhhhhhhh!!!! I did too! You weren't there!!!!

Is that what you wanted?

Dork.

 

[BoilerUP]

I wonder how those debriefs went...

 

[flyin4jsus]

Run the Immediate Action Checklist and land......deal with it on the ground!

 

[asayankee]

In any emergency your goal is to minimize risk to the aircraft, crew, and occupants. Your goal is NOT to complete the emergency checklist. Being so close to relative safety (which is the ground in this example) it would be irresponsible to go around just to complete the expanded checklist. Do the emergency action items, stay in control of the aircraft and put it on the ground.

The risks are greatly diminished once the airplane is no longer flying

 

[Stifler's Mom]

I can only imagine what would be on the CVR during an unanticipated single engine go around while on fire. Personally, I'm happy if the stick shaker doesn't go off on a two engine go around.

 

[comrcap]

Quietly taxi to gate and leave aircraft. ALA Delta after landing on taxiway. If quierried by atc about smoke, say It's a mirage. Nothing to see here folks

 

[IBNAV8R]

So you wouldn't land immediately if the fire happened outside the FAF or are you just saying you would run the QRH and land immediately outside the FAF?

As stupid as you all think the OP's question is, I've had to commandeer the airplane during two separate lofts now with smoke/fire (or possible fire) on board after the CA wanted to hold or execute a missed approach. Maybe that was with a couple of you on here.

The OP scenario was an engine fire - you know that thing that actually has a system to put out a fire and a procedure to do so? Or, are we talking something else? Using your head is good. Stepping on your d**k can be disastrous.

You "commandeered"?? Was capt. incapacitation part of the scenario??? If not - you still have a job???? What company was this? Is there something I'm not understanding here?

Speak up? Absolutely!!
Be assertive? That's also part of your job!!
But, unless the the PIC is incapacitated, he/she is ALWAYS the PIC.

 

[Max Q]

The OP scenario was an engine fire - you know that thing that actually has a system to put out a fire and a procedure to do so? Or, are we talking something else? Using your head is good. Stepping on your d**k can be disastrous.

You "commandeered"?? Was capt. incapacitation part of the scenario??? If not - you still have a job???? What company was this? Is there something I'm not understanding here?

Speak up? Absolutely!!
Be assertive? That's also part of your job!!
But, unless the the PIC is incapacitated, he/she is ALWAYS the PIC.

I've made my point. There are CA's out there that appear to have no qualms with holding in a pattern with the airplane burning like a match stick even after being KINDLY ASKED by their FO to GTFONG.

What company was this? What are you, nuts? This is flightf(beep)ckinginfo.com. I'm making it all up.

 

[777forever]

The OP scenario was an engine fire - you know that thing that actually has a system to put out a fire and a procedure to do so? Or, are we talking something else? Using your head is good. Stepping on your d**k can be disastrous.

You "commandeered"?? Was capt. incapacitation part of the scenario??? If not - you still have a job???? What company was this? Is there something I'm not understanding here?

Speak up? Absolutely!!
Be assertive? That's also part of your job!!
But, unless the the PIC is incapacitated, he/she is ALWAYS the PIC.

Exactly, well said!

 

[BigPappa]

I've made my point. There are CA's out there that appear to have no qualms with holding in a pattern with the airplane burning like a match stick even after being KINDLY ASKED by their FO to GTFONG.

What company was this? What are you, nuts? This is flightf(beep)ckinginfo.com. I'm making it all up.

Just say it was on fire, you don't have to use metaphorical analogies like "burning like a match stick". We get the idea.... Oh, and you can't say that you asked kindly if you use the term "GTFONG". Just say what you have to say and quit acting like some hero. Your assertiveness would have gone long way by just saying: "This thing is on fire, holding does not sound like a good idea, we should land quick, WHAT DO YOU THINK??" This way you make the Captain think along your lines, instead of having him/her guess and wonder why you are acting like you're in charge which in itself is very distractive. You actually contributed to making the situation worse by using bad CRM. The only way your position would've been justified is if the CAPT. was incapacitated. Know your position as an FO, and use CRM and not Hill Billy talk to resolve the situation.

 

[Max Q]

Me: There are guys out there that want to hold with the plane on fire. (Completely relevant to the OP)

Flightinfo: You moron! Engine's have fire bottles and procedures to use them!

IBNAV8R: Do you think I would've bothered to share if it weren't a case where the IAI/QRH didn't extinguish the fire? What is that too unbelievable for you that a CA would actually continue to a holding fix with a fire warning message and empty bottles?