EJA/Hawker Midair w/ Glider....Everyone OK - Merged!

[Guitar rocker]

I am not sure but I think the left engine may have been failed as well as a result of the collision.

I cant help but say it again after seeing these pictures....Annette and to your co-pilot....you guys did one hell of a job.

 

[Guitar rocker]

Glider transponders, in case anyone is curious:

http://www.wingsandwheels.com/page4.htm

I think that if you can afford a glider you sure as hell can at least afford a transponder.

Initial reports indicate that the glider pilot had a transponder but he didnt have it selected on. Guess we will wait and see what the official word from the NTSB is though.

 

[Smellycat]

Ntsb

Guess we will wait and see what the official word from the NTSB is though.

Let me ask you Rocker and others how well you think the NTSB does their job determining probable cause in general. I think they do an exceptional job.

Wonder if they can re-create what the crew and the glider pilot actually saw. What will they say was the probable cause in this case?

 

[Dr Pokenhiemer]

How many times have you been in a jet and ATC advises an RJ 10 o'clock and 6 miles crossing left to right and you never even saw it?

 

[FLYLOW22]

How many times have you been in a jet and ATC advises an RJ 10 o'clock and 6 miles crossing left to right and you never even saw it?

With my eyes, hardly ever. With my TCAS 98% of the time.

 

[Dr Pokenhiemer]

Wish I had TCAS!!

 

[skiandsurf]

Wish I had TCAS!!

While watching the news today in Los Angeles, they mentioned that 20 years ago today was the midair between the piper and Aeromexico over Cerritos. I remember it like it was yesterday. I was flight instructing at Meadowlark Airport (Huntington Beach) and saw the smoke out in the distance.

This was the onset of TCAS.

 

[Smellycat]

I'll never forget the video from the ground of that 727 spinning on fire...or maybe that was a different accident. Aero mex was a DC-9..??

http://www.aopa.org/asf/asfarticles/2001/sp0101.html

 

[FLYLOW22]

I'll never forget the video from the ground of that 727 spinning on fire...or maybe that was a different accident. Aero mex was a DC-9..??

http://www.aopa.org/asf/asfarticles/2001/sp0101.html

I think you might be thinking of the PSA 727 accident on 25 Sept. 1978.

This is waht happens when you mix a 727 and a C-172.

http://www.airdisaster.com/photos/psa182/photo.shtml

 

[Jetz]

What could have happened

I think you might be thinking of the PSA 727 accident on 25 Sept. 1978.

This is waht happens when you mix a 727 and a C-172.

http://www.airdisaster.com/photos/psa182/photo.shtml

I too remember the PSA accident.

I'm still shaking my head in amazement at how LUCKY this NJ crew was! What a life changing event to have this happen and to walk away, get stitches and live to praise Almighty God another day!

Professionalism and bravery shown by this crew of EJA879 was extraordinary!

 

[Guitar rocker]

How many times have you been in a jet and ATC advises an RJ 10 o'clock and 6 miles crossing left to right and you never even saw it?

Very good point.

 

[JEEPPLR]

A few thoughts here:

Gliders are small, especially at the speed an 800XP travels.
They are generally painted white.
The 800XP was descending so glider would be seen with the ground as the backdrop.
There are fires burning in the area causing a haze the cover the ground helping the glider to be even harder to see.

Just my experiences from flying out there during fire season but it can be hard to see an airplane in those conditions.

 

[RNObased]

I'll answer this question. I have a ton of time flying gliders where this happened. The glider pilot was flying in a normal area for glider ops. There is a ton of glider flying in that area of the carrson valley. It is the soaring capital of the world. That is where the glider world altitude record was set. Most times of the year there is standing box that allows us to go up to FL600. I've been up to FL380 in a glider there. The glider I fly has a transponder and a radio. I talk to ATC, but as long as they stay in the box the are not required to talk to anyone. 16000ft in that area is low for a glider. Most pilots can get up there on a day with weak thermals.

And I have a ton of time flying jets where this happened. There is so much room in that area the gliders and jets could be seperated. This could have been a 737 full of pax just as easy as 800xp with 3 pax, now if that would have happened it would have been ugly.

If the reports on this web site are true and the glider had a transponder, but didn't have it on, well I have huge issues with that. If you have the equipment run it. I'm not saying this is fact, just heresay on this site.

Also below 18,000 is a very time in a jet. Checklist to be run, freq changes, etc.

You watch, changes are coming and I bet the glider guys won't like it.

 

[Peanut gallery]

One thing is for sure....

The plane looks like it will fly again....but I bet it will need two new pilot seat covers. Nice job by the crew.

 

[ultrarunner]

PSA flight 182 in 1978(ish).

A PSA 727 hit a C-172 and killed everyone in mboth airplanes plus a few on the ground.

That one is the reason we have TCAS today.

When a mid-air between a glider and an airliner kills a few hundred, THEN there will be action. But not before, IMO.