FlyBoeingJets
YES, that's NICE
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DL MEC Rumor???
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billSquared
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When DAL bought Western did everyone at Western have degrees, and did DAL not hire them? Those are decisions that are made at paygrades other than ours. Even IF there was a staple, and even IF the degree was required to bid up, there are lots of options to complete school in the time that it would take for upward movement to begin anyway. The expense of the degree would pay for itself in a year. I don't have a degree but would gladly get it if that was the situation. The good thing is there are a lot of guys who wouldn't, which would make movement faster for others.
As for the "I'm better than you" childishness, there are lots of tough training programs at lots of airlines, and lots of good pilots from all back grounds that get through them. So we all can get over ourselves, thank you. I've never been through military flight training, or DAL. But I've flown with guys who have been through those as well as ASA E120 training, and they say they all have ups and downs.
peter185
Is this low?
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- 187
Out of curiosity what were the backgrounds of the 2 ASA pilots that went to Delta to fly the 737. It seems to me that if they were coming to ASA after having flown mostly light aircraft their training at ASA would probably be harder than what you would get at Delta, simply because you are teaching so many systems that they are not familiar with (jet engines, pressurization, complex fuel systems, etc). At Delta on the other hand they are accustomed to having people that already have a good amount of experience with jet aircraft (military or civilian), so that part of the training is more review, and training is more specific to the aircraft. Correct me if I am wrong, I have very little experience when it comes to airline or military training.
spanky2
For God, Family, Country
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- Feb 7, 2003
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- 271
Bigotry? Cost me my job because I took a job with Delta vs applying to ASA? Bold talk, my friend.
OBTW...I am over qualified for your job.
Oh yeah...something for nothing. Don't wanna work for at CONAIR...but did pay assesments during their strike...did take them some cokes when they were walking at MCO.
OBTW...I am over qualified for your job.
Oh yeah...something for nothing. Don't wanna work for at CONAIR...but did pay assesments during their strike...did take them some cokes when they were walking at MCO.
~~~^~~~
Well-known member
- Joined
- Dec 21, 2001
- Posts
- 6,137
Spanky :
You obviously had a difficult time with the reading comprehension test. You are furloughed because of the bigotry of your MEC, which you happen to represent well for everyone else to read on this board.
I'm curious what it takes to develop the skills & qualifications that you possess. So tell us:
TT:
Part 121 PIC:
Type Ratings:
Highest Education Certification / Degree achieved:
Community Involvement:
~~~^~~~
You obviously had a difficult time with the reading comprehension test. You are furloughed because of the bigotry of your MEC, which you happen to represent well for everyone else to read on this board.
I'm curious what it takes to develop the skills & qualifications that you possess. So tell us:
TT:
Part 121 PIC:
Type Ratings:
Highest Education Certification / Degree achieved:
Community Involvement:
~~~^~~~
Last edited:
General Lee
Well-known member
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- 20,442
Fins,
Come on now, quit slamming our furloughs. Leave them alone please.
And, the thing that was hard about the FE position was that you weren't flying anymore--you were a "systems expert" incharge of old systems that made you feel like Radar O'Reily on MASH----before you had to click on the Generator Breakers after starting the engine--you had to move these dials to get the lights to "blink together" in sequence--and then click the gen on. I would often say out loud, "Sparky? Sparky (Radar's friend on MASH) are you there? Colonel Potter wants some Ice Cream...."
Jumpseaters must have thought I was nuts.
Peter185,
Starting in '96 (when I got hired...) we started hiring more civilian pilots, and it has provided a good mix--rather than all military. A lot of the current furloughed pilots are actually ex-ASA and ex-Comair pilots---and only ASA will give them a chance again to fly at the bottom of their list and not give up their Delta seniority numbers. That is nice of them.
Spanky2,
The Comair guys will never see the fact that we actually did support them ( along with others at ALPA), and wanted them to win. They won't see it. They won't see that they have gained a lot more flying since 9-11, and that they now are targets because compared to their peers--they are the highest paid---just like us.
BUt, they think that they are making money (without paying for plenty of things that mainline foots the bill for--advertising etc..) and don't have to answer to anyone. Ok then.
Bye Bye--General Lee
Come on now, quit slamming our furloughs. Leave them alone please.
And, the thing that was hard about the FE position was that you weren't flying anymore--you were a "systems expert" incharge of old systems that made you feel like Radar O'Reily on MASH----before you had to click on the Generator Breakers after starting the engine--you had to move these dials to get the lights to "blink together" in sequence--and then click the gen on. I would often say out loud, "Sparky? Sparky (Radar's friend on MASH) are you there? Colonel Potter wants some Ice Cream...."
Jumpseaters must have thought I was nuts.
Peter185,
Starting in '96 (when I got hired...) we started hiring more civilian pilots, and it has provided a good mix--rather than all military. A lot of the current furloughed pilots are actually ex-ASA and ex-Comair pilots---and only ASA will give them a chance again to fly at the bottom of their list and not give up their Delta seniority numbers. That is nice of them.
Spanky2,
The Comair guys will never see the fact that we actually did support them ( along with others at ALPA), and wanted them to win. They won't see it. They won't see that they have gained a lot more flying since 9-11, and that they now are targets because compared to their peers--they are the highest paid---just like us.
BUt, they think that they are making money (without paying for plenty of things that mainline foots the bill for--advertising etc..) and don't have to answer to anyone. Ok then.
Bye Bye--General Lee
Tim47SIP
Serving for the USofA
- Joined
- Dec 5, 2001
- Posts
- 1,157
Ed
Are you sure about your facts with the 2 ASA pilots that went through Delta's 737-800 program? I seem to know that a certain ASA fleet manager did pass the program. A certain hiring department Capt. at ASA did not. Not even close. First time anyway. Sounds like 50% of the ASA pilots can pass.
Well, I guess not. Evidently you know something that I don't concernig this Cpt. She did not indicate at all that there was a problem. I asked her how she liked it, and that was about it. I heard from others in the training department that she did great, so I cant confirm nor deny the report. She is in mngmt and is a part time Cpt on the ATR and does not fly that much. Who knows.
Are you sure about your facts with the 2 ASA pilots that went through Delta's 737-800 program? I seem to know that a certain ASA fleet manager did pass the program. A certain hiring department Capt. at ASA did not. Not even close. First time anyway. Sounds like 50% of the ASA pilots can pass.
Well, I guess not. Evidently you know something that I don't concernig this Cpt. She did not indicate at all that there was a problem. I asked her how she liked it, and that was about it. I heard from others in the training department that she did great, so I cant confirm nor deny the report. She is in mngmt and is a part time Cpt on the ATR and does not fly that much. Who knows.
spanky2
For God, Family, Country
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2003
- Posts
- 271
~~~~~~,
So it has become personal. OK, fine. If I promise to answer your question will please stop picking on me? I am a poor furloughed pilot.
TT - more than you
Part 121 PIC - 0 / zero / zip (guess you got me here big guy)
Total PIC - more than you
Years flown - 22+
Types - more than you
Education - BS in Eng, MAS, plus military schools that you can only dream about
Community - swim coach / judge, math tutor / volunteer, fitness instructor, martial arts black belt, local Hooters hiring dept
Your new best friend...Spank Me.
I'll be happy to write a LOR for you to Plato.
So it has become personal. OK, fine. If I promise to answer your question will please stop picking on me? I am a poor furloughed pilot.
TT - more than you
Part 121 PIC - 0 / zero / zip (guess you got me here big guy)
Total PIC - more than you
Years flown - 22+
Types - more than you
Education - BS in Eng, MAS, plus military schools that you can only dream about
Community - swim coach / judge, math tutor / volunteer, fitness instructor, martial arts black belt, local Hooters hiring dept
Your new best friend...Spank Me.
I'll be happy to write a LOR for you to Plato.
XRMEFLYER
Semi-Turgid Member
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
- Posts
- 453
Nobodies picking on on you spanker. You sound like the kid from Jr. High who runs his mouth until he gets slapped around, then cries about being picked on.
"I am over qualified for your job" That is exactly the kind of self righteous drivel that fins is talking about. It may make you feel better about yourself, but it is counterproductive and flat wrong as well. In fact, unless you have been dropping steel on camel molesters for god and country since your unfortunate demise over there at DAL, every day that goes by without your flying makes you less and less qualified to work anywhere.
As for your not wanting to lower yourself to work at Comair, good, great, happy to hear it, that does not in any way mitigate the fact that your amigos over there think that they have been wronged somehow by not being given "something for nothing." So you can just hop right off of your high horse on that one hero!
So you paid strike assessment dues during the strike and bought someone a coke. The strike assessment was not done out of the goodness of your heart, it was mandatory for all ALPA members and you probably pinched the coke from the galley.
Orange Charger,
BFD! You sound like one of those guys who likes to sit around and tell all of the newbies how hard it used to be and how you used to have to walk to school bare foot in the snow uphill...
2011 posts....Get over yourself and get a hobby. Come up with some new material that doesn't include telling us all how much you care about your furloughs and how Comair pilots are all doomed and how everyone needs to take a pay cut if you are.
Self righteous, sanctimonious PRIK!
AMF
"I am over qualified for your job" That is exactly the kind of self righteous drivel that fins is talking about. It may make you feel better about yourself, but it is counterproductive and flat wrong as well. In fact, unless you have been dropping steel on camel molesters for god and country since your unfortunate demise over there at DAL, every day that goes by without your flying makes you less and less qualified to work anywhere.
As for your not wanting to lower yourself to work at Comair, good, great, happy to hear it, that does not in any way mitigate the fact that your amigos over there think that they have been wronged somehow by not being given "something for nothing." So you can just hop right off of your high horse on that one hero!
So you paid strike assessment dues during the strike and bought someone a coke. The strike assessment was not done out of the goodness of your heart, it was mandatory for all ALPA members and you probably pinched the coke from the galley.
Orange Charger,
BFD! You sound like one of those guys who likes to sit around and tell all of the newbies how hard it used to be and how you used to have to walk to school bare foot in the snow uphill...
2011 posts....Get over yourself and get a hobby. Come up with some new material that doesn't include telling us all how much you care about your furloughs and how Comair pilots are all doomed and how everyone needs to take a pay cut if you are.
Self righteous, sanctimonious PRIK!
AMF
Huck
Well-known member
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- Dec 6, 2001
- Posts
- 1,076
Allah be praised!
And I have been through both EMB-120 school and 72 panel school. They were about the same intensity and difficulty, but the 120 type ride involved a 3 a.m. single engine no-flap circle to land at Albany - in a real airplane! And if you couldn't make a landing out of it, automatic bust....
General Lee
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Huck, Did that FE ride include failures of all systems including cranking the gear down while dumping fuel? The two guys upfront were line check guys (management pilots) and they were laughing the whole time too---due to everything failing. They kept looking at me asking, "What's wrong??? Do something!!!"
I think I lost 10 pounds worth of sweat on that ride. I flew the E120 too and remember the V1 cuts being interesting with the large amount of rudder required to keep it straight....
Bye Bye---General Lee 
I think I lost 10 pounds worth of sweat on that ride. I flew the E120 too and remember the V1 cuts being interesting with the large amount of rudder required to keep it straight....
Bye Bye---General Lee
Huck
Well-known member
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- 1,076
My front enders were non-seniority professional instructors... mostly retired guys. We say at FDX that, in our 727 professional instructor ranks, the Eastern guys are waiting for the Braniff guys to die off so they can take over.
The last professional instructor I had up front had suspenders on and a big Good Sam button on his cowboy hat - he must have left mamma behind in the rig.
And ALWAYS terminate the dump before you get up to swing the gear. Ask me how I know this....
(By the way, I was turned down at the Kremlin in 1999 after phase three - Plato told me I could never reapply at DAL in this lifetime - If I ever see that dude I'm gonna kiss him on the mouth....)
The last professional instructor I had up front had suspenders on and a big Good Sam button on his cowboy hat - he must have left mamma behind in the rig.
And ALWAYS terminate the dump before you get up to swing the gear. Ask me how I know this....
(By the way, I was turned down at the Kremlin in 1999 after phase three - Plato told me I could never reapply at DAL in this lifetime - If I ever see that dude I'm gonna kiss him on the mouth....)
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spanky2
For God, Family, Country
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- Feb 7, 2003
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- 271
FlyBoeingJets
YES, that's NICE
- Joined
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- Posts
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Huck said:
Huck,
Thought you might like this story....
I know someone at FedEx turned down at Delta 97-99 (can't remember exactly when). Hired at FedEx and was later (12 months or more)called by Delta. They asked him to update his info then shortly thereafter offered him a job. OVER THE PHONE. I think it had something to do with that wacko psychological examiner.
XRMEFLYER
Semi-Turgid Member
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
- Posts
- 453
Guilty as charged!
Feeling a little defensive about that one fellow? What was said was not directed at you or at any one other than the guy/gal who opened his/her pie hole on the matter, so relax. If you take the time to put the statement into context you will see that the target of my ire had suggested that he/she had done so for altruistic reasons when the tone and language of his/her posts clearly show that to not be the case.
If it is taking a cheap shot to point out when someone is being a patronizing horse's ass, then again, guilty as charged!
AMF
General Lee
Well-known member
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- Aug 24, 2002
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When somebody sends in a check each month for something--the person is usually "for" that cause. We at Delta accepted paying those dues to ensure Comair would win and get better wages etc. To think otherwise is foolish. We helped them (along with others) during their time of NEED. Too bad they couldn't help our furloughs when it was their time of NEED......The truth hurts...
Bye Bye--General Lee
Bye Bye--General Lee
BlackCoffee
Well-known member
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- Mar 27, 2003
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XRMEFLYER
Semi-Turgid Member
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- 453
You are correct Mr. Coffee. That is not to say as GL pointed out that the vast majority of those who wrote those checks did not in fact write them with best wishes for success.
The point is that because it was mandatory, you do not get to say with any credibility anyway that because you wrote that check you should get "something for nothing"(hiring practice at Comair with respect to furloughees and seniority numbers) or that you aren't a pompous hypocrite who likes to tell everyone how imminently qualifed you are for someone else's job.
GL,
I agree with most of what you have to say most of the time, but it just seems that you can't help yourself. Clearly you have forgotten where you came from, because while you like to point out that your background included slaving away in the salt mines with us peasants, your actions(or words in this case) consistantly show disdain for the very people you claim to be behind.
What would you have the rank and file pilots at Comair done about that? Out of their hands really and I'm not convinced that their MEC had any influence on the matter either. The decision rested with the management at Comair and DCI and ultimately DAL. PERIOD, END OF STORY.
Yet you never miss an opportunity to hang it over the heads of those who had nothing to do with it. Right, wrong or otherwise it is not those guys/gals fault that it played out that way and you really ought to leave it alone. Do you not think that the vast majority of those folks at Comair would have welcomed your furloughs on the list behind them "line" number at delta or otherwise? If so then it is you sir who are being foolish.
BTW, I agree that they should have had the opportunity to work there without resigning their "line number" even though it does kind of sound a bit like getting "something for nothing." It really should have been a non issue. Then those who didn't feel that it was beneath them,(Spanker), could have stayed in the game and gotten to fly a pretty cool airplane while they waited for a recall. It really is a shame.
AMF
The point is that because it was mandatory, you do not get to say with any credibility anyway that because you wrote that check you should get "something for nothing"(hiring practice at Comair with respect to furloughees and seniority numbers) or that you aren't a pompous hypocrite who likes to tell everyone how imminently qualifed you are for someone else's job.
GL,
I agree with most of what you have to say most of the time, but it just seems that you can't help yourself. Clearly you have forgotten where you came from, because while you like to point out that your background included slaving away in the salt mines with us peasants, your actions(or words in this case) consistantly show disdain for the very people you claim to be behind.
What would you have the rank and file pilots at Comair done about that? Out of their hands really and I'm not convinced that their MEC had any influence on the matter either. The decision rested with the management at Comair and DCI and ultimately DAL. PERIOD, END OF STORY.
Yet you never miss an opportunity to hang it over the heads of those who had nothing to do with it. Right, wrong or otherwise it is not those guys/gals fault that it played out that way and you really ought to leave it alone. Do you not think that the vast majority of those folks at Comair would have welcomed your furloughs on the list behind them "line" number at delta or otherwise? If so then it is you sir who are being foolish.
BTW, I agree that they should have had the opportunity to work there without resigning their "line number" even though it does kind of sound a bit like getting "something for nothing." It really should have been a non issue. Then those who didn't feel that it was beneath them,(Spanker), could have stayed in the game and gotten to fly a pretty cool airplane while they waited for a recall. It really is a shame.
AMF
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spanky2
For God, Family, Country
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2003
- Posts
- 271
XRM,
Thanks for the sage advice...o' wise / experinced one. I sleep pretty well...unless it is a tent in a foreign land....then I hope you sleep well my friend. I stand by my statement...something for nothing...is the RJDC motto. ALPA = necessary evil...in a perfect world, services not needed. The world is not a level playing field. Nothing personal, just fact. Thanks for your service to our great nation.
Thanks for the sage advice...o' wise / experinced one. I sleep pretty well...unless it is a tent in a foreign land....then I hope you sleep well my friend. I stand by my statement...something for nothing...is the RJDC motto. ALPA = necessary evil...in a perfect world, services not needed. The world is not a level playing field. Nothing personal, just fact. Thanks for your service to our great nation.
General Lee
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 24, 2002
- Posts
- 20,442
XRMEFLYER,
It is true that we all HAD to write the checks for the assessment, and again I say that we all wanted Comair to win---why wouldn't we? We had just received a huge contract increase and at the time Delta was doing just fine financially. We did what we could legally, and we were amazed at what eventually happened. All of that is true. Now, to say that the resulting response after we started furlouoghing big time was UNDERWHELMING from the Comair camp (pilots, management, etc) is an understatement. The Comair MEC chair--lawson---did meet with our MEC Chair at the time and in the conversation somewhere (I wasn't there) was a request for more growth inexchange for some possible help. That right there is using our furloughs---in their time of need---as PAWNS. The ASA people (management---pilots---whoever) didn't seem to mind bringing them over, and Delta obviously didn't mind---since they are really paying for everything. (They would pay for the Comair training too---something that Randy says is their responsibility--WRONG) It is all just a big scam.
As far as my participation---I feel VERY LUCKY not to be in that situation, and I do know quite a few people who are still furloughed, unable to get a job without giving up their Delta rights. A lot of my friends are not at the bottom of the list---most are in the middle. What would you do? If you were 700 or so from the bottom out of 1060--would you give up your rights? It makes me mad to see Comair hiring and our guys not be given a chance--when we all helped (not all by ourselves) them out. As far as the "golden rules" at Comair---they should be broken--without using our people as pawns. They would go to the bottom anyway--not affecting anyone.
Bye Bye--General Lee 
It is true that we all HAD to write the checks for the assessment, and again I say that we all wanted Comair to win---why wouldn't we? We had just received a huge contract increase and at the time Delta was doing just fine financially. We did what we could legally, and we were amazed at what eventually happened. All of that is true. Now, to say that the resulting response after we started furlouoghing big time was UNDERWHELMING from the Comair camp (pilots, management, etc) is an understatement. The Comair MEC chair--lawson---did meet with our MEC Chair at the time and in the conversation somewhere (I wasn't there) was a request for more growth inexchange for some possible help. That right there is using our furloughs---in their time of need---as PAWNS. The ASA people (management---pilots---whoever) didn't seem to mind bringing them over, and Delta obviously didn't mind---since they are really paying for everything. (They would pay for the Comair training too---something that Randy says is their responsibility--WRONG) It is all just a big scam.
As far as my participation---I feel VERY LUCKY not to be in that situation, and I do know quite a few people who are still furloughed, unable to get a job without giving up their Delta rights. A lot of my friends are not at the bottom of the list---most are in the middle. What would you do? If you were 700 or so from the bottom out of 1060--would you give up your rights? It makes me mad to see Comair hiring and our guys not be given a chance--when we all helped (not all by ourselves) them out. As far as the "golden rules" at Comair---they should be broken--without using our people as pawns. They would go to the bottom anyway--not affecting anyone.
Bye Bye--General Lee
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