Delta to Drop CHQ?

[bvt1151]

Our on-time Performance is low on the E170 because we have ACARS. If we could call in our times we would always be out 5 early. (execpt Freedom, no Block or better) If we get the paper work at Departure we would love to call it OT, be we can't. All doors closed (including cargo doors) and break release starts the time.

That's like saying "It's not fair that we can't lie like we used to!" For as long as Chautauqua has been in DCI, Comair has had automatic time reporting for every flight into and out of CVG. This is covers well over 75% of all of Comairs flights that have been subject to the same restrictions you are complaining about on your E170's. I for one am glad to see you're finally having to compete on a level playing field on at least a handful of your aircraft.

 

[nimtz]

"And let it ago about the 1 payrate. Its not as bad as you make it out to be. I have thought about the 1 payrate issue and here is my question, doesnt the majors do it? at NW, I am pretty sure they get paid the same on the A319 and the A320, yet there is a 24 seat difference. On the 757-200 and the 757-300, pay is the same but there is about a 40 seats more on the -300."

How many mainline jobs are lost when a 757-300 is placed in service instead of a 200? How many mainline jobs have been lost by 70 seaters? Lots of guppies have been sent to the desert, because of those things. All the while management still giggles at a pilot group who were sold on flat pay rates for '18 months'. At least the upgrade was quick...

 

[sleddriver77]

No paycuts coming here. I would only hope our pilot group sticks together as we should. BB is making way to much do come to us and ask us for pay cuts. He will get no love from the Pilot group.

This seems to be the general concensus...

 

[General Lee]

Why dont you give skywest a break. Everyone but you realize skywest is a great company. Employees like working for them, their investors are happy, and they deliver a quality product (i.e. on-time performance/completion factor). Everyone gets on them about not having a union. yet their work rules are better than most ALPA regional carriers. The no union argument should come into play if and when 90 seaters show up and the payrates are the same. or when the company starts taking away QOL issues and pay. But unitl then we should just sit back and watch. you can say your i told you so's then. Alpa or any other union isnt a magic pill. Look at pinnacle, mesa, and TSA. And Comair didnt take paycuts because of skyw. its because they are tied to delta and their BK. ASA hasnt ahd to take paycuts. their pay was almost as high.

And let it ago about the 1 payrate. Its not as bad as you make it out to be. I have thought about the 1 payrate issue and here is my question, doesnt the majors do it? at NW, I am pretty sure they get paid the same on the A319 and the A320, yet there is a 24 seat difference. On the 757-200 and the 757-300, pay is the same but there is about a 40 seats more on the -300.

GLee, on delta is the pay the same on the 737-200 and the 300? 300 has 28 seats more. the 767-200 seats 204 and the -300 seats 252.

I agree that regionals are underpaid and because of it, mainline wants to outsource it. I definitely think we should get paid more. But isnt it hypocritical to dang skywest for flying 70 seat and 50 seat planes for the same rate. PSA flies the same -200 and -700 CRJ and they have blended rate. and its much less than skywest. yet PSA doesnt catch crap because they are union? give me a break

Thanks for responding. First off, again, I don't dislike anyone at SkyWest except a few malcontents on this board, and they probably don't like me either. Oh well. I am sure your company is fun to fly for, and you get to fly nice shiny jets to beautiful places out West.(and a little East from ORD) That "fun" will only last so long, until you get kids or buy a large home. Then you will realize that you are getting paid less than you are actually worth. You and others like to bring up that we are paid the same for certain aircraft. What you don't bring up is that the smaller aircraft were brought UP to the wages of the larger aircraft. We used to get paid differently for the 757 and 767--by a lot. Then, during the 777 pay rate negotiations, we brought the 757 UP to equal the 767. The 737-200 was the same, and it was a lot lower at Delta Express in MCO, until we raised the rates and brought them back into mainline. Now a days, yes, we are having problems, and our rates have been lowered, once permanently and the second is temporary. That is what happens when your company tanks after 9-11 and your management (who are all gone almost) provides poor strategies. Your company, on the otherhand, has had great profits (thanks to us with the fuel) and besides a profit sharing check (that is not guaranteed), will not show you respect and will whipsaw you with newly aquired ASA. Your inhouse "union" is a joke, with people appointed by management. That doesn't sound good. I hope someday you get a raise on the larger aircraft and get a real union (Teamsters or ALPA) that will fight for you without being appointed by management.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Tim47SIP]

Just a thought!

Although I don't condone a single rate for multiple aircraft, I can understand where Skywest is going with their one rate. The 50 seat guys are one of the highest paid in the industry. If they took a cut, say 5% and transferred those funds to the 70's, then they would have the two rates. Since there are way less 70's, the pay increase should be 10-15% or so. No additional cost to Skywest. They can either pay the 50 seat guys less and increase the 70 seat pay, or pay all of them the same and the majority would get a slight increase.

At ASA, our current negotiations are indicating a reduction in 70 seat pay but possibly no reduction in 50 seat pay. My guess is that if we are forced to go to a blended rate, we will more than likely see a slight increase in the current 50 seat rate. Same amount of money, just spread out differently.

Someone earlier suggested that if this happened, the IP's would all quit being IP's. I seriously doubt that as they are still guaranteed a min number of hours (95?) and some are even in the 105 range. I don't think they will be going anywhere other than SW, JB, AT, etc.

 

[General Lee]

I've been trying not to respond to you but just couldn't "hold back" any longer. By your own logic, this means that the Senior guys are all bidding the 50 seater, and since we're senior we are at the top of the payscale so Jerry is paying top dollar on the smaller airplane!??

You know what you said doesn't make sense, right? Your 50 seat rate has a set amount for each year, up to 12 years? Right? Maybe 18 years like Comair's? Whatever. The larger the plane, the larger the pay, usually. If a 5th year Captain was supposed to make $55 an hour on the 50 seater, and still makes that on the larger 70 seater when he should have made $65 or more, wouldn't that be the same for that senior Captain who now avoids the 70? Yes, he is still flying the 50 dor the same rate he has always had, but he should be making MORE on the 70 if the pay rates were different. And, most airlines are paying 12 or more year Captains to fly their 70 seaters, vs SkyWest paying their new Cpatains who just upgraded and did the transition training. Is Jerry paying top dollar on the 50 seater? He hasn't even given you that 1.2% pay raise yet.

Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Although I don't condone a single rate for multiple aircraft, I can understand where Skywest is going with their one rate. The 50 seat guys are one of the highest paid in the industry. If they took a cut, say 5% and transferred those funds to the 70's, then they would have the two rates. Since there are way less 70's, the pay increase should be 10-15% or so. No additional cost to Skywest. They can either pay the 50 seat guys less and increase the 70 seat pay, or pay all of them the same and the majority would get a slight increase.

At ASA, our current negotiations are indicating a reduction in 70 seat pay but possibly no reduction in 50 seat pay. My guess is that if we are forced to go to a blended rate, we will more than likely see a slight increase in the current 50 seat rate. Same amount of money, just spread out differently.

Someone earlier suggested that if this happened, the IP's would all quit being IP's. I seriously doubt that as they are still guaranteed a min number of hours (95?) and some are even in the 105 range. I don't think they will be going anywhere other than SW, JB, AT, etc.

How does their 50 seat rate (their only rate for jets) compare to your 70 seat rate? How about compare it against other 70 seat rates.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Inconceivable]

For those who "pad" their out times over the radio, consider this:

If your pay is based upon that, you are committing fraud.

Your information is being reported to the DOT as an aggreagate as part of information the certificate holder is required to provide. Submitting false information is fraud.

If the winds of change should ever blow and you get caught "trying to help the company" do you think they will back your play? Anyone?

Show up on time, be ready to close the door. That's all you can do. If your ramp or gate is slow to perform, too bad. Inform you Chief Pilot the reason for the delay. That's the only way it will get better. If "Brand X" provides ground support and they are making you look bad, inform your Chief Pilot. Let him take it up the food chain to the CEO who can talk to Brand X or your Major about the problem. Then it can get fixed.

As it stands this is what you have:
1. Ground support does what they want, when they want.
2. The company looks good because you fudge the numbers.
3. You are exposing yourself to federal and state fraud charges relating to your payroll.
4. You are exposing yourself to FAA enforcement for (potential) duty time conflicts.
5. You are exposing yourself to additional federal prosecution for your part in manipulating DOT data.
6. No one is doing anything to correct the ground support problem. The minimum wage worker is the tail wagging the multi-million dollar dog.

 

[HoserASA]

At ASA, our current negotiations are indicating a reduction in 70 seat pay but possibly no reduction in 50 seat pay. My guess is that if we are forced to go to a blended rate, we will more than likely see a slight increase in the current 50 seat rate. Same amount of money, just spread out differently.

Not true Tim. Negotiations haven't even touched compensation yet. However, mismanagement has expressed a desire for what you state, thanks to CMR and others. Jerry has even joined in and stated we would get no more 70s because our 70 rates are the highest (not). So, we'll at least keep what we have, and the other division of Skywest Inc can have the 70s!

ASA and Skywest both are making money, hence no need for a pay reduction. lol We'll see......

Hoser

 

[sweptback]

There was an ASA pilot long, long ago who was always thought to be padding the times. One day he called the on and in times on short final... then had to go around.

Not only did he lose his job, but the FAA came after him and took all of his certificates. Because he fudged the off and on times, the FAA's position was that he was screwing with the maintenance records.