Delta needs to pay pilots more

[General Lee]

Quit stinking up the place.

Wow, great response you jealous bass-tard! Ahahaha! Nice Fonzi Jacket.... Ehhhhh-aaayyheee!


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[robair73]

Hey just a quick question in the middle of all this. Who's got the biggest weenie? I was just wondering and all :nuts:

 

[dbrownie]

Are you junior in category? You should bid something that makes you senior in a smaller plane. Btw, the DL pilots are in the middle of a 3 year contract that did give an almost 20% raise, and with these profits, there is a great chance for MORE and better work rules to boot. It's going to continue to improve, and Consolidation has helped make everyone stronger and more profitable. Throw in 5,000 retirements in the next 10 years, and yeah, it's getting better.



Bye Bye---General Lee

The fact that you call and accept the pay increase as a "raise" is the problem.
We deserve a "raise" not partial restoration under a bankruptcy contract. So the company will toss us crumbs as we voluntarily reduce our profit sharing?
We don't even go to half of the international destinations out of NYC that we used to (or do it seasonal for a couple of months).

Yes I am glad Delta is making record profits, it's too bad that the pilots who made some of the greatest sacrifices are not respected or rewarded for that effort.

I am not "junior" in my category by the way, our pilot group keeps shrinking, not growing and has done so since the NWA merger.

The 5000 retirements fantasy is the carrot mgt dangles in front of pilots and has for years.

Db

 

[General Lee]

The fact that you call and accept the pay increase as a "raise" is the problem.
We deserve a "raise" not partial restoration under a bankruptcy contract. So the company will toss us crumbs as we voluntarily reduce our profit sharing?
We don't even go to half of the international destinations out of NYC that we used to (or do it seasonal for a couple of months).

Yes I am glad Delta is making record profits, it's too bad that the pilots who made some of the greatest sacrifices are not respected or rewarded for that effort.

I am not "junior" in my category by the way, our pilot group keeps shrinking, not growing and has done so since the NWA merger.

The 5000 retirements fantasy is the carrot mgt dangles in front of pilots and has for years.

Db

Sorry, you have to wait to negotiate, unless they NEED something from you right now (like FAR 117 changes). Otherwise, you wait, and this is a 3 year contract. The airline has gone through a retraction in the past couple years, mainly due to mods on many of the fleets, but now there seems to be a need for extra pilots due to the 717 backlog, new 739ERs coming, and FAR 117. Those 5000 pilots retiring are out there, it's just plain math. They will all go, and the company doesn't know exactly when. Eventually, all of this will occur at the same time, and it will be a bonanza for the pilots. Higher pay, short on pilots, retirements.



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

General,

Brownie is right. We squandered away the biggest leverage of my career and we got a plus-minus pos contract. Inexcusable for a company that was projected to print money.

We are no different than the French with a white flag for surrender.

 

[dbrownie]

Sorry, you have to wait to negotiate, unless they NEED something from you right now (like FAR 117 changes). Otherwise, you wait, and this is a 3 year contract. The airline has gone through a retraction in the past couple years, mainly due to mods on many of the fleets, but now there seems to be a need for extra pilots due to the 717 backlog, new 739ERs coming, and FAR 117. Those 5000 pilots retiring are out there, it's just plain math. They will all go, and the company doesn't know exactly when. Eventually, all of this will occur at the same time, and it will be a bonanza for the pilots. Higher pay, short on pilots, retirements.



Bye Bye---General Lee

Dalpa's track record is that what ever the company asks for the company gets...

Who would ever give up a installed pilot's rest bunk for a seat in the noisy cabin? With out a fight! in the middle of massive profits?

I have a bad feeling that Dalpa will sell us out, again, on 117.
Look at our paperwork it already assumes you WILL give them a 2 hour
extension...

Because the company knows Dalpa won't blink.

We are replacing 757s for long range 737s will they pay the same?

No of course not.

We are adding 321s which will hold almost as much as a 757 will it pay more than the 319?

No of course not.

This "We'll get them next time" attitude is why we are weak.
It's why 5000 plus guys are ready to dump ALPA.

Again, it's great the company is making money.
Beats the alternative.

Db

 

[dbrownie]

General,

Brownie is right. We squandered away the biggest leverage of my career and we got a plus-minus pos contract. Inexcusable for a company that was projected to print money.

We are no different than the French with a white flag for surrender.

Bill our "union" is so weak that they won't even utter the word "restoration" in that it might upset mgt.

We were in a great position to return this job back into a profession but squandered that opportunity by snapping at the first crumb offered by the
company....

Even sold by the phrase "we wont get the new planes if...."

So now we wait till 2015 so we can maybe get paid the rates we had in
2000?

WTF?

Db

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

DB....

And you think the "Alternative" train wreck in the waiting union would be effective at anything? You are dreaming.....

Pull the trigger...let's vote and see how it turns out. I'm not ready to gamble away my future with a bunch of amateurs whose only business plan is "We can do better!"

 

[jonjuan]

and with these profits, there is a great chance for MORE and better work rules to boot.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Zero chance of that, lee. That's not your profit, that's theirs (as you so willingly voted).

 

[dbrownie]

DB....

And you think the "Alternative" train wreck in the waiting union would be effective at anything? You are dreaming.....

Pull the trigger...let's vote and see how it turns out. I'm not ready to gamble away my future with a bunch of amateurs whose only business plan is "We can do better!"

Bill;
Perhaps you are correct, all I know is the way things are done now has to change.

Our union is broken, they are to in bed with mgt, to many deals for some.

Maybe DPA voting blocks could sway things?

There should not even be a need for a "DPA" the fact that over 5000 pilots want to throw out DALPA doesn't even get their attention.

Db

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

DB,

Voting blocks are a failure.....NWA proved it.

Broken yes....enough to throw out? Not yet.

 

[bladeusa]

i like two legs.. a week.
but to each their own.

 

[dbrownie]

DB,

Voting blocks are a failure.....NWA proved it.

Broken yes....enough to throw out? Not yet.

Bill;

It was just a thought, there must be a way to fix it.

You would think 5000 guys would get their attention?

Db

 

[Ky.BrownBourbn]

i like two legs.. a week.
but to each their own.

Yeah but I don't have a 10 hour a$$!!! I know, you get to get up, go to rest, eat sundaes, etc.

KBB

 

[General Lee]

Yeah but I don't have a 10 hour a$$!!! I know, you get to get up, go to rest, eat sundaes, etc.

KBB

1/3 of the time you can sleep in a lie flat seat or a bunk. If there are 4 pilots (over 12 hours enroute), you get half the time in the bunk (have to have a bunk over 12 hours). That is really nice. Eat a meal and a Sundae, watch movie, take a nap. It sure beats 5 legs to St. Louis!


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[redflyer65]

1/3 of the time you can sleep in a lie flat seat or a bunk. If there are 4 pilots (over 12 hours enroute), you get half the time in the bunk (have to have a bunk over 12 hours). That is really nice. Eat a meal and a Sundae, watch movie, take a nap. It sure beats 5 legs to St. Louis!


Bye Bye---General Lee

I'm sorry, but being on a plane for 12-14 hrs sounds like a complete pain in the ass. I don't care where you sit.

Add with a nasty redeye at the beginning, and that sounds like a Major pain in the ass. No thanks.

And Jenny, it's already been proven that most of our days fall in the 2-3 leg range. You do know we fly more long hauls (3-5hrs) than we used to right? Of course you did. You just like to ignore the facts.

While your struggling with your redeye and breaking 5 time zones, I'm done by 1pm and planning the dinner and drinking schedule. Home by one on the last day with NO redeye. It's priceless. Meanwhile, you guys are the walking dead guys I see coming back into the ATL. Maybe a 5 hour energy will help. I've heard you can get them cheaper at Costco. Haha.

 

[General Lee]

I'm sorry, but being on a plane for 12-14 hrs sounds like a complete pain in the ass. I don't care where you sit.

Add with a nasty redeye at the beginning, and that sounds like a Major pain in the ass. No thanks.

And Jenny, it's already been proven that most of our days fall in the 2-3 leg range. You do know we fly more long hauls (3-5hrs) than we used to right? Of course you did. You just like to ignore the facts.

While your struggling with your redeye and breaking 5 time zones, I'm done by 1pm and planning the dinner and drinking schedule. Home by one on the last day with NO redeye. It's priceless. Meanwhile, you guys are the walking dead guys I see coming back into the ATL. Maybe a 5 hour energy will help. I've heard you can get them cheaper at Costco. Haha.

Ever wonder why MOST INTL pilots are older? (Even the FOs). There must be a reason, and I believe it is they have tried domestic flying, hated it, and enjoyed long haul better. You obviously haven't done it, and won't ever get the chance. Luckily, legacy pilots can switch back and forth if they want to. That fact, unlike your unverifiable "most of our days 2-3 legs...." (Riiiight), is that most of the bottom 1/3 of your list will be thinking about bailing out to get the variety choices at a hiring legacy. You don't have allnighters yet, but AT still does I believe, and just like them doing all INTL flying for you now, you will probably inherit them as well, just like you did with the new cities Flint and Akron. Fantastic! Have you filled out any apps yet? Sure you have.



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[redflyer65]

Ever wonder why MOST INTL pilots are older? (Even the FOs).


Bye Bye---General Lee

Haha. You completely fail with your first sentence.

Because they NEED the money of the widebody. Get a clue Jenny. Your argument fails flat. Again and again.

Walking dead my friend. You'll be better off in the domestic 737 as CA, and you know it.

 

[HowardBorden]

Ever wonder why MOST INTL pilots are older? (Even the FOs). There must be a reason, and I believe it is they have tried domestic flying, hated it, and enjoyed long haul better.

Did it ever occur to you that as a general rule older people usually have more seniority and want to fly the aircraft that pays the most money? Try asking a UPS pilot which aircraft and type of flying goes the most senior and you will find that it is NOT long haul international but domestic flying.

 

[whymeworry?]

To GL, what's wrong with multi-leg days if you get paid for it?

I flew WBs. I loved it, for sure. But to say my skills suffered would be an understatement. When I upgraded on the 737 I was humbled. Now, I don't see myself going back to the WB for at least 10 years. I'm having too much fun actually flying again.

Isn't that why we all started in this business in the first place?

Most days I do 8 hr turns. But I do enjoy the challenges of multi-leg days... even if I bitch about it.

My buddies on the 777 and 787 complain they never fly anymore.