Delta cancels upcoming interviews

[ACL65PILOT]

What is this thread about again?

 

[jonjuan]

What is this thread about again?

It's been highjacked almost worse than the "Latest and Greatest about Delta" thread on the other forum.

 

[Kalifornia]

Flight attendants - Work the same schedules we do and start at about 18K a year, at most regionals top out in the mid 20K's a year. If they are trying to support a family thats poverty line.

You lost me right there. In the top 10 problems in US aviation, career flight attendants. A position that was never meant to be a career or a job to raise a family.

 

[cale42]

Well.. we have established Delta isn't interviewing any more this fall, effectively crushing my hopes and dreams.

So why not use the thread to start my new career, internet muse. Come Oct 1 I will officially be furloughed so I should have LOT's of time for posting on FI..

cale

 

[rigger]

Well.. we have established Delta isn't interviewing any more this fall, effectively crushing my hopes and dreams.

So why not use the thread to start my new career, internet muse. Come Oct 1 I will officially be furloughed so I should have LOT's of time for posting on FI..

cale

It gets old cale......Take it from me! Sorry your getting the furlough.....sucks for us all right now!

 

[cale42]

Thanks.. it is what it is. It's my first one, so I guess that is good, but I'm a little more freaked out about it I guess as well.

cale

 

[jonjuan]

Thanks.. it is what it is. It's my first one, so I guess that is good, but I'm a little more freaked out about it I guess as well.

cale

Sorry to hear, brother. Trust me, 2 years from now, you look back at this post and think, "That was a long time ago and I'm in a MUCH better place now." Hope DAL works for you early next year.

 

[Smarta$$]

I agree with your second point, that bringing the debt under control has to be the first and foremost issue for the federal government, in order to achieve long term stability, they must live within their means so to speak.

As to bigger government, if you go back to my first post you'll see that I do in fact support it. I'll attempt to lay out my arguement of why that is in fact the fiscally conservative approach. As pilots we often lose sight of the fact that we fall in the upper echelons in society. Even RJ captains end to be in the top 20% of wage earners and lots of guys make more than that, we also generally are in the top tier in terms of education and social status. So it is often hard to grasp even as our industry reams us how much we really do have.

With that in mind we have to understand that while if our tax rates go down you and I will spend more, save more, boost our retirement savings and so on. For 80% of the population though these things simply won't happen. Much of our society has no retirement savings other than social security, they will never have health insurance outside of their employers or Medicare/Medicaid. They need the government to provide basic services. You cut these things and they just fall to the next level of government service, welfare and walking into a hospital when they have any problems and just ignoring the bill.

There is only two solutions to this. First cut them off altogether. No hospital visits without insurance, repeal the hippocratic oath for all US doctors. Get rid of welfare. So when this happens people basically get too old and die because they have no money for basic services and can't work any longer. If your really ballsy enough to say let every individual who can't work and has no savings die on the streets, then you can really cut government spending. But for those of us who aren't the next cheapest option is a European style system that keeps people out of those situations. With single payer health care you always can see a doctor and don't tie up the ER. Many EU countries basically have government pensions for all of their workers, knowing that neither the employer or the employee will have the funds. Do these things result in more government spending. Sure they do. However I contend that it is still less government spending that the cobbled together approach we have. Go all or nothing, flat out support the bottom half of your population or let them die. Anything in between is inefficient and wasteful, yet it is exactly what we have.

So to Tweakers point as well, there is my arguement for more spending. It will actually lead to smaller, cheaper government down the road, we will have a few massive all encompassing programs rather than this half baked approach we currently have that is a drain on society.

cale

Cale, I agree. It is reality, like it or not.

 

[Smarta$$]

Michael, how can you look around you every day and really say that. I'm not talking about the folks that never go out and do anything, I'm talking about the fact that private industry has destroyed workers rights and compensation to a point where the government is forced to subsidize. These aren't "moochers" as you put it, they are people busting their humps doing the best they can.

Lets take the example of aviation alone.

Flight attendants - Work the same schedules we do and start at about 18K a year, at most regionals top out in the mid 20K's a year. If they are trying to support a family thats poverty line.

Gate Agents - Most make in the range of 10/hr and work 50 hr weeks. $500/wk, thats about $26,500 a year. Right on the poverty line.

Ramp - Probably makes 8/hr average. Figure a 50 hr week thats $20,800/yr. Definitely below the poverty line.

Catering - Probaby about 8/hr so $20,800 again, well below the poverty line.

Fueler- Little more responsibility, probably closer to 10/hr, back up to $26,500 year.

TSA - Probably the best job in aviation outside of pilot or ATC, they probably average $35K/yr. Above the poverty line, but not exactly a comfortable living.

So.. that is 85% of the people that make the aviation industry go round. They all work hard. But in your example they are just moochers, because I guarantee you at those kinds of wages they aren't saving for retirement, they aren't able to purchase health insurance if they lose their job. They have zero savings because it takes every dime to put food on the table so when they are out of a job they can't buy food.

Even if we take them all to be moochers and figure they all could "get off their asses" as you put it and get a college degree and get a good job, how do you propose we run an airline with no flight attendants, gate agents, rampers, caterers, or fuelers? Because I want to work for that company, they'll make money hand over fist.

The simple reality is your golden private sector has destroyed the average American worker and they are now forced to rely on government aid.

Exactly right. This country will ALWAYS need these jobs that business now pays near poverty wages. Those people work hard, but are not rewarded for their work. They could all get advanced education, but their would not be good jobs for them. Not to mention they would only be replaced with other workers for 8 dollars an hour.

Our middle class is disappearing, and trickle down economics and right wing political support of business (anti labor, outsourced jobs...) is the primary culprit.

 

[Smarta$$]

You lost me right there. In the top 10 problems in US aviation, career flight attendants. A position that was never meant to be a career or a job to raise a family.

There is no reason that Flight Attendant can't or shouldn't be a career position. 50% of the jobs people do would likely be deemed by YOU to be not "career" jobs. Well this country will ALWAYS need those jobs to be done, by someone. People that work full time should be able to support themselves and/or their families. Get rich? No. Put food on the table and provide an apartment for their family in exchange for 40 hours a week, Yep.

Those that so quickly dismiss other peoples hard work and time because they believe their work to be of a lower class or to require less intelligence or to be less than impressive, show themselves to be of low morale character and reek of arrogance.

Low wage EARNERS are not lazy moochers. Those that do not work are moochers. There is a massive difference that is totally ignored by to many so called "conservatives".

 

[Data]

Same old tired a$$ voodoo economics that people have been spouting since the 80's and hasn't worked yet. You tax more revenue goes up, it's really just that simple. The only people that actually benefit from trickle down economics are the ultra rich and the businesses that can increase their profit, turn around and bend over their employees farther.

Why do we never learn.

Uh oh, perhaps it isn't that easy...

http://www.cnbc.com/id/38467149

 

[jonjuan]

Completely agree. Getting rid of the Bush tax cuts would decimate any possibility of a recovery. Just say NO!

 

[Helos2Galaxy]

.........the completion of all interviews for the 2010 hiring push........we have chosen over 170 of the best candidates from over 5000 applicants.....our first class of returning furlough/bypass pilots will begin INDOC training on Monday, August 2nd and the first new hire class will begin training on August 16th. We anticipate holding two new hire classes each month for a three month period and all 305 pilots will be flying the line by the first quarter of 2011 in preparation for a heavy summer schedule.....

 

[andyd]

Just read that as well, hiring is done for this year...congrats to the 170 and welcome back to the other 135! For the other 4830, don't give up hope...as long as the economy keep plugging away we'll most likely have some more seats next year as well. Update your app monthly!

 

[jonjuan]

So, 135 BRs? No mention of the flows (or was it implied that they were part of the 170 "Best Candidates?")

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Good question. I assumed that was new hires and you add flows to it. So 60 CPS and 27 Mesaba plus the 170 and then BR's.

 

[andyd]

It wasn't broken down as far as how many BR's or flows., it did specifically mention 170 new hires. Guessing the 135 is a combination of flows and BR's.

 

[avrodriver]

Good question. I assumed that was new hires and you add flows to it. So 60 CPS and 27 Mesaba plus the 170 and then BR's.

The Code A Phone letter implies that classes will be held 2 a month over a 3 month period and that the 305 would be on-line by 1st quarter of 2011. Are they really planning 50 a class?

I know the Compass guys were told that after being held back to expect classes in Nov/Dec (???). If that's the case and the classes are only 30 a piece like we've heard then maybe there will be more classes for flows.

The letter doesn't seem to read that way though.

 

[cale42]

Man, I wanted to respond to data's post, but I don't think it would be nice to derail the thread a second time.. especially after witnessing the miracle of an FI thread being brought back on track. Someone should document this.

Thanks for the update on who got hired, I'm happy to hear that 305 actually will be going online, that there was no change in hiring projections.

And I think I'll take heart from the fact that there was only 5000 applications, I would have guessed more like 12 or 13K. So if 170 got hired out of 5000 thats 3.4%. Not exactly overwhelming odds, but at least they start with a whole number.

cale

 

[michael707767]

And I think I'll take heart from the fact that there was only 5000 applications, I would have guessed more like 12 or 13K.

I was 5000 about a month ago, with more coming in all the time. I would guess by the time Delta is doing more hiring, there will many, many more.