declaring an emergency

[rumpletumbler]

Then again, I've worked around enough people that feel a spot on their white shirt is an emergency

haha......lol.....I missed this the first time around.

 

[-9Capt]

There are certain companies who strongly discourage--to the point of termination--declaring an emergency. AirTran is one of them. They discourage this because they're worried about the "bad press" an emergency could generate. I'm sorry that this attitude about emergencies is being perpetuated.

I've quietly sat back and read some pretty stupid posts on this site many times, but this one takes the cake!

It's clear you've never worked for AirTran.

 

[Pez D. Spencer]

I enjoyed the reading avbug.

best of luck

 

[bigD]

Holy crap - this thread's been dead for 2 years and someone revived it.

 

[JediNein]

Just a general series of random thoughts:



1. Declare the emergency just to be relieved from the FARs requiring airworthy airplanes. An alternator failure is a minor annoyance to me; number 9 in IMC was last week. This time the battery lasted until landing. Sometimes it doesn't. Fine, Approach clear me to land and tell tower I'm coming in, and no, I'm not canceling IFR and remaining clear of your airspace.



2. Just because I've told ATC "Mayday" or "Emergency" doesn't mean that I'm anything other than confident I can handle the situation. It may mean I'm not putting up with anymore of their BS and need to get the now POS airplane on the ground, NOW. And yes, Southwest is going to have to do a hold and pass out some more peanuts. Now I'll do my best to make sure I'm not unduly delaying other air traffic, but if I need the Class "B" airport shut down while I'm getting no-gyro vectors across the approach paths to do a PAR at an Air Force Base, I am. To all of the crews of the 25+ airliners that sat an extra 20 minutes at a certain Class "B" airport during push, thanks.



3. You won't believe the amount of **** you can pull and be completely cleared of all charges because you got on the ground safely. Open up part 91 and use it as your checklist of rules to break. If you live and the FAA has questions, you did what it took to meet the emergency using all of the information you had available. "You declared an emergency, what can we do?" Worst case, after a year, you're still alive to take some checkrides and get your certificates back. 'Tis better to be tried by twelve than carried by six.



4. Roll the equipment. Those guys live for jumping into their vehicles and racing to the edge of the runway. When you're on short final with a single-engine twin when you discover the gear won't extend, your thoughts will touch on the fact that ARFF is still upstairs playing cards in their firehouse.



5. Who am I setting an example for? I usually have a far less experienced pilot in the seat next to me that considers me to be the ultimate authority on anything aviation. If I don't declare in front of them, when they are out with their family on board, they may also not declare for something far more serious and accept ATC delays. They may not get on the ground safely. Even airline crews get killed by not declaring.



6. You may not really know how serious the problem really is. What I thought was a vacuum failure was an intake manifold departing the engine. The main separation was right next to an exhaust leak. . . hot exhaust right from the cylinder blowing directly on the ready-to-combust fuel/air mixture. At best, loss of power, at worst, ka-boom!



7. If the controller asks if you are declaring an emergency, my response is always "yes". There is a reason the controller asked. Sometimes they see a route that they can give you to get you on the ground fast but they can't give it to you unless you either ask for it or declare an emergency. Controllers get to bend rules in an emergency, too. It helps them in the tape talk to have the rules broken for an aircraft in distress.



8. The life you save may not be just your own. I declared an emergency after encountering severe turbulence in a light single engine in IMC. I was fine. I had regained control of the aircraft, but my passenger had hit the ceiling three times while still buckled in. He had a minor concussion. Five minutes after landing a twin with gyro failure (he'd declared) was headed to our area and the controller refused the handoff from the other sector, "We just had a Cessna and a regional jet encounter severe turbulence. This is no place for a light aircraft with gyro failure." The twin pilot, fully in control of his twin partial panel, thought this was really, excellent, useful information, turned around, and landed safely.



9. Abnormal smoke (not from the outside forest fire) in the cockpit at 500' in the mountains. Who am I going to declare with? My observer? His nose works. The scanner on his first flight in the back seat? If killing the master had not made the smoke stop, we would have been landing shortly. On the way back to base we carefully returned one radio to service and let base know what we were doing.



10. Checklists and ops rule the 135 aircraft. If X, we run the checklist and if time available we declare. If a spot on the white shirt requires declaring an emergency, then so be it. If the left wing falls off and the company does not want an emergency declared even though we will be descending rapidly, I'm not working there.



11. ATC is trying to run me into the side of a mountain. I'll verify the controller still wants me on the heading and altitude. Usually they respond with a climb and a turn sounding like Mickey Mouse. If they don't, they've got one mile and them I'm climbing and turning, and declaring an emergency because I'm deviating from my clearance. If the pilot screws up, he dies. If the controller screws up, the pilot still dies.



12. I've got fuel to Oakland, my alternate, and 60 minutes. ATC reroutes me to Oakland through Portland 10 minutes after takeoff. "Minimum Fuel." If they come back with "Cancel IFR," I come back with "Emergency, 4 hours 20 minutes of fuel remaining."



13. Deviating around build-ups. There's no emergency or question. I'm turning right/left 10/30 degrees around a build-up. SO is everyone behind and in front of me.



Fly SAFE!

Jedi Nein

 

[flyifrvfr]

I've had engine fires and muiltiple failures, irate passengers and medically challenged passengers, structural failures, and once had someone in the right seat experience a heart attack. However, I have never "declared" an emergency. I rolled the rescue trucks once, and that wasn't my decision (but I didn't fight it, either).

Most of the time the situations have been handleable without outside intervention. Situations which have warranted declaration in most cases precluded taking the time to make such a declaration...usually too busy for such formalities.

Bear in mind that declaration of an emergency isn't necessary to get priority handling, and also bear in mind that ATC can make the decision for you. Also bear in mind that declaration of an emergency isn't the E-ticket to freedom from violation; don't declare an emergency to save your self from a violation. The FAA isn't stupid, and attempting to cover up a problem by declaring an emergency doesn't bode well.

If you do have an emergency, notify somebody about it if it will help. There is no harm in it, and there can be some terrific advantages.

Don't automatically assume an instrument failure, or engine failure, or even a fire is an emergency. Look at the specific circumstances of the moment and weigh it against your options and needs. Don't hesitate to ask for help, but don't make a mountain out of molehill, either. I have yet to have experienced an engine failure in which making any such declaration would have made one iota of difference, but that's not to say it isn't possible. In the few cases when sweat was caused to form, talking on the radio was the farthest from my mind, and certainly my lowest priority.

Sometimes the declaration of an emergency is perceived to be a mystical act that changes the nature of everything, and that a formal declaration must be made. It's viewed as though ATC cannot help and assistance cannot be brought to play without this magic act. Not so. State your problem and your intentions, and treat it just like you would any other phase of flight. It needn't be formal, or melodramatic; tell ATC what you have got, and then fly it. Certainly don't minimize your statement (typified by the historical significance of "minimum fuel" vs. a true emergency, for example), but tell it like it is. State what you intend to do, and then do it.

One thing I have seen in declarations is the unwillingness to fully take charge of the moment. Rather than state that Flight 683 would like to return for landing, state that you have an engine fire and are proceeding direct for the numbers, request the trucks, etc. Tell ATC or whomever you're talking to exactly what you have, what you intend to do about it, and what help you need. Then have a ball.

I'am confused. You say that you have had engine fires, multiple failures, a passenger who has had a heart attack, and structural failures but you don't think that any of the highlighted areas are emergencies. If I was the passenger having a life threatning situatiion such as a heart attack, I would want the pilot declare an emergency and get me help right away.

In the last paragraph you say that if you have a fire, request the trucks and go right for the numbers. My question to you is that if you tell ATC you have a fire, or structural failure, why wouldn't you just tell them that and that you are declaring an emergency? By doing so, you are telling ATC that your aircraft and passengers are in grave danger. You also get the chance to tell them what is going on which could assist the NTSB and the FAA in determining what happened and how to prevent it, because it will be on tape.

You also say don't make a mountain out of a molehill. Is a passenger having a heart attack a mountain, or a molehill? I also can't count the ways that telling ATC you have an emergency helps. You lose an engine in the mountains and you can't maintain obstacle clearence, wouldn't you want to ask ATC where the lowest terrain is located relative to your position. This is just one example how ATC can help.If I read the post correctly, I should use my best airline captain voice and tell ATC I have a little problem, I have another airplane stuck in the cockpit and can't maintain altitude, but It is not an emergency at this time.

 

[A Squared]

3. You won't believe the amount of **** you can pull and be completely cleared of all charges because you got on the ground safely. Open up part 91 and use it as your checklist of rules to break.

There seems to be a popular idea that declaring an emergency is carte blanche to toss the rule book out the window, it ain't so. You are allowed to deviate form the regulations to the extent required to meet the needs of emergency, nothing more. If you think that the FAA will not review your decisions and second guess whenther your deviations were necessary, you got another think coming. Perhaps they will not, but here have been plenty of cases where the FAA has disagreed with a pilot's judgement in dealing with an emergency and has handed out violations accordingly. Furthermore, the emergency authority only works if the emergency is no fault of your own. If you contributed to your being in htat emergency, the provisions of 91.3 do not apply. It is well established in NTSB case law that the FAA may violate you for deviating from the regulations if your emergency was a result of your judgement.

. I've got fuel to Oakland, my alternate, and 60 minutes. ATC reroutes me to Oakland through Portland 10 minutes after takeoff. "Minimum Fuel." If they come back with "Cancel IFR," I come back with "Emergency, 4 hours 20 minutes of fuel remaining."

Yeah, you're going to come roaring out of Bakersfield with your mighty warrior and a wheelbarrow full of clanking balls. If ATC gives you anything less than a perfect routing your gonna whip out the "e" word and slap them around, whip them into shape and get exactly what you need from them. Yeah, all you gotta do is declare an emergency when you have over 4 hours fuel on board and plenty of options.

Bad idea, really, really bad idea. Here's a link to an NTSB decision in the case of a pilot who did exactly that, used minimum fuel and the e word to bluff ATC into direct routing wheh he had plenty of fuel. http://www.ntsb.gov/O_n_O/docs/AVIATION/3932.PDF Notice that he got his pilot certificate revoked. Kinda stupid advice when you compare it with how the world really works.

1) if you are 10 minutes out of bakersfield with 4 1/3 hours fuel on board, you don't have an emergency. You have plenty of options

2) If you realy did have a fuel emergency, continuing to Oakland is not a necessary elemnt of meeting the emergency, gettig on the ground is, and you have many much petter options than Oakland.

3) If you have a fuel emergency because you continued on to Oakland after ATC delays, the emergency is of your own making, so the protections of 91.3 do not apply to you.

Still think it's a really cool idea to use the e word to beat ATC into submission and get the routing you want?

 

[avbug]

Wow. Lots of conversation on a post I made two years ago. Good grief.

It is just important to evaluate WHY you decide not to declare. If your decision is based on pride, looking stupid to your peers, fear of paperwork, over confidence, or in general worrying about some consequence OTHER than the problem at hand then your decision not to declare is tainted.

Absolutely, 100% CORRECT!

If you have a problem outside of your personal experience level, declare the emergency. Everybody will get out of your way and be happy you made it down safely.

I have no issues with that. I have always espoused the same thing.

However, it also seems that what we have here is a passle of folks who either can't read, or failed to comprehend...so for those who have nothing better to do than reply to two year old threads, what the heck...

I'am confused.

Don't be. You'll only get a headache.

I wouldn't be suprised. Two brothers. One an airline pilot, the other a 747 Capt and F-16 pilot in the ANG we're flying their family owned 421 back home after a family vacation. Both families were in the back, lost an engine, never declared an emergency. They flew it 25 minutes to their home base.

Being that the point of these replies has been to worship the almighty holy act of declaring an emergency and to abhor and castigate anyone who would fail to utter the magic mantra, you're talking apples and oranges. I never said a word about not dealing with a problem...I did say that there is absolutely NOTHING magic about "declaring" an emergency.

Don't ever be lulled into thinking there is. The successful outcome of your emergency evoloution is in your hands, not in your microphone; you are responsible for making it happen.

You're describing in the quoted paragraph above, two individuals who are apparently well technically qualified, who elected to pursue a particular course of inaction. That may have been the best course, it may not; you provided no particulars. However, I never advocated that, did I? (for the slow...I did not).

What I did stipulate is that "declaring an emergency" has taken on some sort of mystical aura; an epithet that calls out to the help-gods and sends them scurrying to your aid. The skies change color, your skin tingles, and your dandruff is immediately cleared. Your skin is clearer, and runways around the world open their doors to you, angels sing, and mayors polish the key to the city.

As opposed to simply stating your situation, your intended actions, and then doing your job...flying the airplane and dealing with that situation.

If you're given priority, you're given priority, period. State your situation, and your intentions. You can use the magic "e" word in there if it makes you feel better. When I worked fire on the ground, I knew folks that just loved to run lights and sirens. Some sort of schoolboy fantasy. Sometimes it's warranted, and sometimes not. I liked to slow down, turn the **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED** thing off, and arrive on scene without a headache, one minute slower, and in one piece.

If you state your situation and you don't get the help you desire, you restate it...or not. You've already identified your intentions. You're not asking for straight in to XX runway, you're telling ATC your intentions. And so you should.

Flying for 25 or 50 or 100 miles when it's unnecessary (assuming it were so in your scenario...for all we can do, with the lack of information, is assume), is another matter. That is lack of action. Not merely "not" declaring an emergency, but seemingly ignoring the situation completely. Something I have never advocated. Respond slowly and deliberately, fast hands kill. But respond.

If I was the passenger having a life threatning situatiion such as a heart attack, I would want the pilot declare an emergency and get me help right away.

I imagine you might, but if I were the passenger, I'd want the pilot to get me to help safely, and to do the job to the best of his abilities. Do you suppose that "declaring" an emergency, that magic phrase that makes the angels rush to your side, will make a bit of difference? Or will simply stating your situation and your intentions cover it, instead. Are you going to carry 250 knots to the runway threshold, scream down to the end on smoking brakes, throw out the slides and evacuate the airplane into the waiting arms of salvation with bright, red, flashing lights (all for the want of cuticle removal, or perhaps the ever popular screaming heegeebees)? Fly abnormally and meet the ambulance on the runway, just like an episode of Emergency, or Chips? Or just state your intentions, get priority handling, and go?

Me? I'm just going to go.

I've had critical patients on board when flying ambulance, many times. Knowing that use of the term "lifegaurd" will already grant priority, using the magic "e" word seems superfluous. Priority is priority, and you don't get more simply because you use the "e" word.

Folks get excited when they see a fire. They run, they panic. They flip out. The drool, they get short of breath, their thinking and their vision narrows. They even run back into the flame. A professional doesn't do that. A professional walks calmly to the fire, sizes it up, and works it. We are professionals. Not deer frightened with panic.

In the last paragraph you say that if you have a fire, request the trucks and go right for the numbers. My question to you is that if you tell ATC you have a fire, or structural failure, why wouldn't you just tell them that and that you are declaring an emergency? By doing so, you are telling ATC that your aircraft and passengers are in grave danger. You also get the chance to tell them what is going on which could assist the NTSB and the FAA in determining what happened and how to prevent it, because it will be on tape.

Ah, ten-four there, good buddy. I can see where using the "e" word makes it all crystal clear for ATC, the FAA in general, and the NTSB. Good thinking. After all, I merely have suggested identifying clearly your problem, stating your intentions, and then handling it like a professional. Throwing that pesky "e" word in there makes it all different. Generations will learn volumes from the use of that "e" word. Good idea. Now it's all clear as a bell.

I can see where "XXX approach, XXX is making straight in for three four left with an engine fire, request trucks and an ambulance," would not convey the problem at all. ATC would never guess that anybody needs assistance...after all, they might think it's a weenie roast, or a sightseeing tour. Throwing the "e" word in there changes everything. Good thinking!

You also say don't make a mountain out of a molehill.

I do, indeed.

Is a passenger having a heart attack a mountain, or a molehill?

Now, that really depends. There are times, most times, when even the most pressing matter doesn't call for a run, but a walk. After all, rushing is when folks get hurt.

Someone has a fire, and presses the panic button. Let's exercise that emergency descent we were taught as student pilots...lets' get into that little forest clearing right beneath us, because, by golly, we have a gen-u-whine eee-mer-jun-see! Don't take no notice, will ya, that there's no way to get help down there, that you'll set the forest on fire around you, and that there's nothing to put out the fire...just get it down there. Get it done, as they say. Durn goot thinking, there.

Same with that heart attack. Big emergency folks. Everybody look at me. I'm having an emergency. I'm going to rush to the ground right here, put down in this field...after all, a person dying from a heart attack is a whole lot safer over here, behind this hay stack, than in the air...on the way to a runway where help might be waiting. But declaring that "e" word might just bring them back...the smile on their face, the warmth radiating out when that grateful patient hears the "e" word might just restore a shockable rhythm to that person's heart.

Or you could simply contact the local unicom, contact center, contact an approach or tower or other ATC facility, state your situation and intentions, while you act on them. Panic, the traditioned perception that some how the magical calling of a situation an emergency changes the situation miraculously, lies steeped in the wives tale fostered in errol flynn movies of silk scarves and oversexed virile actors.

We're not talking rocket science. You want to use the magic "e" word? If it makes you feel better, you do that. Don't expect great miracles, but use it. Go on.

The point I have made, now and always before, is to handle the situation by whatever means is necessary. If that means using the magic "e" word, then go for it. You know you want to.

Don't forget the lights and sirens. Not only are they pretty at night, they look cool. Right?

 

[dash8driver]

if something happens in the aircraft that's got you so busy that you dont have time to talk on the radios on your way back to the airport... its probably an emergency... either that or you're flying an airplane thats too much for you to handle and you're probably an emergency in that case as well.

 

[Vector4fun]

A couple of comments;

As someone else noted, a Controller or Supervisor can decide to declare an emergency and roll the ARFF trucks whether you asked or not. When in doubt, that's just what we'll do.

The ARFF guys really don't mind the practice, and let's all hope that's really what it is.

Whether you use the "E" word or not, LOTS of pilots are LOUSY at telling ATC what we can do to help. Being a pilot, I know that loosing a vacuum pump can be critical in IMC, and a real ho-hum in good VMC. Most controllers are not pilots. Some won't know how serious the situation is. If you ASK, or TELL the controller what you need, they'll normally do their best to accomodate. Don't let the controller pick the runway you get, tell them which one you NEED. On the other hand, controllers can often suggest options you hadn't considered. Perhaps a private runway nearby, an airport with better WX, whatever.

DO NOT worry about a bunch of paperwork. The FAA is normally only going to need paperwork if substantial damage was involved, a runway was shut down for some time, or a loss of separation or some such occurred. If everything works out OK, we seldom ask for any. We may need to ask for some details to forward to the Command Center, and to answer media inquiries, but it will be very general and limited.

 

[avbug]

I was kind of hoping you'd respond...thanks.

 

[Diesel]

I've held off on posting partly because reading avbug's life story is so interesting. I look back and remembered I used to be that guy. I used to be that guy kicking arse and taking names. If it was flying float planes or king air's into 1500 ft dirt strips. I was avbug. Then my world changed. The golden bullet finally got me.

In the middle of a cold winter night my boss was killed and that's when I realized I was on the ragged edge. I needed to close that chapter in my life.

I don't think you can seperate flying like avbug and then putting on a different hat and flying 121, 135, or 91. You either are that risk taker hanging it all out or your not. When the shizle hits the fan your going back to your old way of doing things. It's a life changing decision!

I went to where I work today and I had the biggest shock of my life. Checklists and discipline where now the rule not the exception. Training, CRM, and SOP's they were now my life. I was no longer thinking how is this going to affect tomorrow's flight. How can I limp this plane back home? Not anymore. It's broke it's broke.

And then one day it happened. Climbing out I hit a goose solid IFR at 200kts right through the engine. First words out of my mouth was we're declaring an emergency. Because now anything where I have to pull an emergency checklist or might affect my completing this flight safely is an emergency.

It is better to err on the side of safety and declaring an emergency than to be put number 2 behind a 150 on final just so you don't have to say those few words.

Besides I think they like driving the fire trucks around the airports.

 

[avbug]

They do like driving the trucks at the airports.

However, whatever image you might have of who you think I might be, you are mistaken; nothing I do is less than professional. I don't take chances; I don't act rashly; I don't go play cowboy, and I don't divide my flying one from the other. I approach every action deliberately and with care.

The golden whatever...the list of co-workers, friends, and associates I've known over the years who have been injured and killed is long. I have loaded a friend in an airplane and watched it burn a few minutes later. I've watched one with whom I closely worked fly through multiple powerlines ahead of me. I've dreampt of a friend and awakened to learn of his death that very night, in an airplane. No golden whatevers. That's reality. Airplanes and helicopters and flying machines are just that...machines.

In a potential "emergency," I don't grab the microphone first. I fly the airplane. That's not preference, nor technique; it's the only professional course of action. Fly first, talk later.

I calculate performance. I check weather. I check notams. I file. I strive for precision. No rolling through life with my hair on fire. I didn't do that when I was eighteen, and I don't do it now, either. I don't "kick arse." I don't "take names." I don't fly King Air's off 1,500' dirt strips. I fly plain jane every day airplanes and am fortunate to be paid to do it.

I hit a goose too...or an owl, or who knows what. Last year, late at night, above 10,000, while slowing to 250 outside Las Vegas. It smashed the radome, and made quite a racket. It went up and over the forward copilot windscreen. No golden whatever there, either. And no, I didn't declare an emergency. Didn't even know what had happened (only that something had) until I looked at it on the ground, and didn't realize the real damage until I returned the next day. There was no emergency to "declare."

I've never submitted that requesting priority is out of line; if you need it, don't ask for it, take it. You have that right. Advise ATC of your intentions.

What I have stipulated is that many pilots feel that a formal "declaration" is the holy frisbee, the great ushering of power and grace that some how changes something. It doesn't. And it isn't necessary to get help. Fly the airplane, and when able, state the problem and intentions. If calling it an emergency is the bees knees, then have at it.

 

[wiggsfly]

I've done it twice. Last April I lost an engine in a skyhawk when the crankshaft seal blew out. That was fun between the smoke, the windshield covered in oil, and a sudden brake in the clouds I had really thought I was on fire. There ain't nothin like a deadstick landing with no windshield.

The first time I was on my instrument checkride. We had takes off and I was puutting on the foggles when we blew a mag (literally came right off the engine). In that case the examiner handled everything and we made it back to the airport without much problem.

 

[Diesel]

No golden whatever there, either. And no, I didn't declare an emergency. Didn't even know what had happened (only that something had) until I looked at it on the ground, and didn't realize the real damage until I returned the next day. There was no emergency to "declare."

First of all that's a great postflight.

I'm not comparing a some thump in the night. I'm comparing a goose through the engine which shut it down.

 

[Clyde]

I was just wondering from some more experienced pilots--what are some real-life situations where you would declare an emergency. Loss of engine when in a twin. How about vacuum system failure in IMC? Thanks for the imput.

In a nutshell, anytime you feel the safety of the flight is in question and your flight needs priority.

A few years ago I declared an emergency after losing (not flaming out) an engine on a Falcon 20 during a climb during the day. Declared an emergency for two reasons: 1: I had no idea what caused it and knew I had to divert, and 2: I would be unable to comply with ATC instructions and thus risk an FAR violation.

Remember, declaring an emergency allows you to deviate to the extent required to meet the emergency, and thus may help prevent some type of certificate action by the FAA.

 

[dash8driver]

true.. declaring doesnt give you carte blanche.. but let me break it down.

declaring: lets you deviate to the extent required to land safely

not-declaring: does not let you deviate from the FARs

end result.. while you can still be violated for something after you declare.. that not a valid argument for not declaring because what ever got you violated after you declared, would also get you violated if you didnt declare.

declare if you feel the safety of flight is compromised or if you think the monday morning qb's will think it was. delcare if you need special assistance or priority handling. declare if its one of the items your ops manual says you must declare for.

bottom line... be safe.

 

[avbug]

First of all that's a great postflight.

Yes, it was a great postflight. The radome was intact, but smashed. Delaminated throughout, it was ruined. At night, it was very difficult to detect. During a thorough daylight inspection, which I helped conduct in the morning, the damage was evident. I grounded the airplane that night, pending further inspection, and the inspection was conducted in daylight. The postflight inspection was VERY thorough.

As one who has made a living for many years working on and inspecting airframes, appliances, engines, propellers, etc, I can assure you, it was very thorough. But thanks for your concern.

declaring: lets you deviate to the extent required to land safely

not-declaring: does not let you deviate from the FARs

You sure about that, Dash8Driver? Sure?

Wrongo!

But then that's been a large part of my point, all along. You have full authority to deviate from any regulation necessary to the extent necessary to meet the needs of an inflight emergency and to attend to the safety of the flight, period.

There is no requirement to declare anything to exercise that authority. There never has been. Ever. I very much doubt there ever will be. A wives tale of sorts exists to the contrary, as you have just demonstrated.

You can, and should, and are expected to do whatever is required to meet the nature of your emergency, period. End of story.

As always, and again, you're free to use the "e" word if it makes you feel better.

I'm not comparing a some thump in the night. I'm comparing a goose through the engine which shut it down.

Loud bang, shattered radome, shut down engine, whatever. Who cares? You did what you felt was appropriate given the circumstances, as did I. In other words, nothing more than our jobs. You do what you must. In 2000, I had five engine failures in four months...not one of which resulted in a condition that warranted declaring an emergency. The individual situations could have warranted it had the circumstances been different, but they didn't. No golden bullets or bb's, or frisbees, or whatever that melodramatic golden doohickey is that has apparently helped you see the light (whatever).

Had circumstances warranted making a formal declaration of some kind on the radio, and in several of those circumstances had there been someone around to hear it or who would have cared, certainly I would have considered it. As it was, there wasn't, and I didn't. More aptly, I made the right decision given the circumstances that prevailed at that moment in time.

What you might have done under those circumstances may be entirely different...but is also entirely irrelevant, as you were not there. I was.

Each person makes the appropriate decision in real time.

Back to the original point, however, again...a formal declaration of an emergency by a pilot is not necessary to receive priority, and never has been. Further, ATC may require a report where priority is given...even though you never "declared" anything. The controller may give you priority without your asking. You may declare an emergency. You may identify your condition and state your actions. A number of scenarios, almost infinite to be sure, may occur wherein priority is given. No matter how you slice it; priority is priority. You don't get any more priority when you "declare." You don't get any more anything...it's still just priority.

Further, you aren't insulated from enforcement action if you "declare." If you cause the "emergency," you're still liable, and a formal pronouncement that it's an "emergency" doesn't alleviate you of the responsibility, nor insulate you from the consequences of your action.

Conversely, simply because you fail to "declare" an emergency, you have a full legal right, and responsibility, to exercise your authority as Pilot in Command, to deal with that emergency. You aren't protected, and you aren't liable, based on the grounds of any formal pronouncement of the "e" word. It just 'taint so.

 

[dash8driver]

You sure about that, Dash8Driver? Sure?

hahahah.. ok there stud..

yea, declaring is not technically necessary. but if you dont understand the benefits of declaring then not even your studliness will help you.

as for that being a part of your point previously, i dont see it. i see your point being that you dont feel that pax, fires or engines are worth of the e-word. that you dont declare because you dont have to, not because its a good idea or not.

 

[JAFI]

There are two parts of this issue I would like to comment on.


1. You use the word "emergency" when you determine it is an emergency and to ask for assistance from ATC and any one on the same radio freq. ( you may be asked to write a letter to the ATC facility)

2. You do what you have to do to meet the emergency (FAR 91.3 and 125/135/121 equilivants). As other actions in life, you may be called to explain your actions to the proper authority.

Always err to the safety side.

My 2 cents.

JAFI