CR-700 Displacements at ASA?

[e120pilot]

The displacements off the CR7 were a direct result of the EMB guys coming over. A lot of junior people went to the CR7 last year while more senior EMB pilots were bypassed (and pay protected of course). As far as further displacements in October on the CR7.....I guess we'll just have to wait and see. The ATL CR7 base is overstaffed, but I've heard that the majority of the the new CR7's next year will be going there. Time will tell.

~~~^~~~, I couldn't agree more with your view on our operational performance. I think we all agree that ASA's performance in ATL (and to a lesser degree DFW) is pathetic. However, how are we suppose to improve? While the ASA fleet is shrinking, our company is still being forced to support the expansion of CMR, CHQ, SKW. If DAL really wants ASA to improve our operational performance, they should relieve us of our ground handling duties that we perform for all these airlines. On the down side that would mean lots of layoffs for our stations in ATL and DFW. However, that would allow us to clean house and concentrate on improving.

As far as the cat fighting that goes on here between ASA pilots and other groups....it's pretty stupid. We all know that it's not the CMR pilots (or CHQ, SKW, etc.) are not responsible for their growth into our markets. While I certainly don't hold a grudge against any other pilot group, I can see why people get upset. It's amazing listening to CMR pilots whine about having to fly through ATL. Yes, it's a $hitty operation, but be thankful that you're getting some growth. I actually heard a CMR pilot in ATL complaining about losing some routes out of DFW, and having to come to ATL. Well, ASA is losing routes out of both of our hubs, and our presence in other hubs is limited to a few token flights. We all need to keep an eye on the big picture...fighting amongst ourselves will do nothing to help our situation.

FYI, the last of the EMB flying will be 8/15 when the last two aircraft are sent to Hot Springs.

As far as all the conspiracy theories, we'll just have to wait and see.

 

[sleepy]

Ok rjcap,

I didn't really mean it. I wish we could all get along. I just though these Comair guys would like to reflect on the full implications of being a WO in the DCI portfolio. They might want to consider that it will be coming right back at them in a few years. So, they may not want to gloat too much or often over their new status as the favored step-child of the moment.

 

[RJFlyer]

I'm curious where the displacement idea is coming from. The Sept final awards show several 50 seat guys going to differences training for the 70, not the other way around: 6 50-seat CA and 5 50-seat FO to differences training, and 6 60-seat CA upgrades. Nothing about displacements from the 70...

 

[rjcap]

So, they may not want to gloat too much or often over their new status as the favored step-child of the moment.

I thought CHQ was the flavor of the month. Nevertheless, I think its time we all lay off the finger pointing. The comair guys have every right to complain about the pathetic and incompetent ramp service and gate service in ATL. Just because the ASA people have become apathetic doesn't mean Comair crews need to lower themselves to the ATL level of performance.

Bottom line is the ASA operation is a joke.

 

[rjcap]

I'm curious where the displacement idea is coming from.

Just another group of people who need something to worry about.

 

[e120pilot]

The displacements happened on the August Finals (when all the EMB guys got the boot). It's not on Flica anymore, but the August final awards should be in the crew room. FYI- The 6 DFW CR2 Captain awards were given to the guys that were displaced in August. Essentially, they were displaced to FO, then were given the award again for captain. So they will never even see the right seat. Good news for them!

 

[sleepy]

I thought CHQ was the flavor of the month. Nevertheless, I think its time we all lay off the finger pointing. The comair guys have every right to complain about the pathetic and incompetent ramp service and gate service in ATL. Just because the ASA people have become apathetic doesn't mean Comair crews need to lower themselves to the ATL level of performance.

Bottom line is the ASA operation is a joke.

Sure it's a joke, but Comair doesn't get it. The ATL ops freqs are for calling in times only. It is pointless to jam the freq with requests for fuel, lav, catering, maintenance, power carts, parking, etc... It's not going to happen until it happens. Just relax and enjoy the wait.

Skip says everything is just fine in ATL. Our management has set a low standard of performance, and we are meeting it. They still get their bonus. It's all good!

As for displacements on the CR7, are you all sure that people are not going back to the CR2 on their own?

 

[surplus1]

Sleepy,

ASA and Comair pilots have been on the same "frequency" for a long time. That unity of purpose is our biggest asset. Whatever you do, don't let trivia upset it. If you are sent to CVG we'll bend over backwards to welcome you.

ATL is a zoo, but we both know that neither ASA pilots or CMR pilots have anything to do with it. Granted we're not used to that and maybe you have grown accustomed, but let's not make it a difficulty between us. The stakes are too high.

You guys at ASA are our real brothers. I vote for doing eveything we can to keep it that way.

 

[DDpaysoff]

Originally posted by e120pilot It's amazing listening to CMR pilots whine about having to fly through ATL. Yes, it's a $hitty operation, but be thankful that you're getting some growth. I actually heard a CMR pilot in ATL complaining about losing some routes out of DFW, and having to come to ATL. [/B]

Yes, it is amazing. I guess we should be bringing 'whine' and bread. How can somebody possibly come to ATL and complain? If I wanted to go to ATL, I would have applied. So, when did you guys stop taking deliveries of jets? I guess that delivery of 15 next year is a rumor. Tell you one thing, we don't whine about atl nearly as much as you whine about stunted growth. Especially for a company that is still taking jet deliveries.
Are you people high, thinking that some of your 70's are going to CMR?

 

[e120pilot]

Some people just don't get it. You are absolutely correct that ASA is still getting new jets. In fact, we're getting 21 new RJ's this year. The problem is that we've retired 28 E120's this year. To quote George Costanza...."It's shrinkage!" If my numbers are correct, CMR is getting over 30 CRJ's this year. So ASA loses 7 a/c, while CMR grows by over 30. If you can't understand why people here are unhappy about this...you need more help than I can offer.

Due to the shrinking fleet, ASA is already staffed for a large portion of the new deliveries next year. We'll see some hiring in 04, but not until later in the year. I could care less if CMR was in ATL or DFW, as long as we continue to grow. However, when we're shrinking and everyone else is growing in our only 2 hubs...it tends to touch a nerve. Again, nothing against the CMR pilots, it's just our good buddy Fred playing his game with us.

 

[DDpaysoff]

Shrinkage

I think we went through that last year losing a base and all the a/c that went w/ it. Don't worry our growth recovered well and so will yours. If we didn't bit.ch, we would not be pilots. Saw your 70 in CVG the other night. That is what I call a late night turn. I expect we will be seeing more of that if Reid wants to improve on 10.5 hrs. utilization. Take care.

 

[CR7CAP]

The only displacements so far on the 700 are FO's due to their lack of seniority and in conjunction with the EMB retirements. No Cpts on the 700 have been displaced. It is only a rumor that has been floating around for quite a while.



RJCAP-

Looks like it's more than a rumor. Just read a memo on Flica addressed to all ATL CR7 Captains. I guess another type rating (AT7) won't be so bad.

 

[701EV]

CR7CAP,

Where on FLICA did you see that memo.

701EV

 

[rjcap]

Can't find anything on FLICA ???

 

[asarjfo]

I looked and could not find anything. Did this only go out to those on the CR7?

 

[rjcap]

It only went to those affected - displaced.

its a fact.

 

[~~~^~~~]

The memo, if reposted, would look a lot like this:

To: ATL CRJ CA

Subject: Resultant Displacement

Based on your seniority, you may be subject to a resultant displacement during the upcoming Award process that will reduce the ATL CR7 CA positions. A resultant displacement occurs when a more senior pilot displaces into a position that has no vacancies which then results in the most junior pilot in that position being displaced.

The displacement process is explained in §24.G.2 and applies to all displacements. A captain being displaced may be able to choose, by virtue of the Bid Preference form on file and his seniority, one of two displacement tracks (Track A or Track B).

(Blah Blah)

Does anyone know how many, or why, the change in the Company's staffing?

Candidly, it bothers me that this Company can upset folks lives like this and not even have the decency to pass along what they know as far as expected numbers and their reasoning. Quite a few of the new Captains have purchased homes and had kids in the last year and a half. With the income levels at ASA, having a family means you must be in the left seat, or work at another business.

If the Company is trying to send a message about contract negotiations, they had better speak more clearly. The message I'm getting is that they want a Comair style war.

 

[sleepy]

The memo, if reposted, would look a lot like this:


Does anyone know how many, or why, the change in the Company's staffing?

Candidly, it bothers me that this Company can upset folks lives like this and not even have the decency to pass along what they know as far as expected numbers and their reasoning. Quite a few of the new Captains have purchased homes and had kids in the last year and a half. With the income levels at ASA, having a family means you must be in the left seat, or work at another business.

If the Company is trying to send a message about contract negotiations, they had better speak more clearly. The message I'm getting is that they want a Comair style war.

This is probably from more senior Capts leaving the E-120 and chosing the CR7. If I was a new Capt at ASA on any aircraft, I would not make any big financially related moves until I had about 10 years with company.

The best way to avoid this problem is to find a spouse with a stable and well paying job.

 

[e120pilot]

Sleepy,

There weren't any EMB captains that got displaced to the CR7. The only EMB Captains that could hold CRJ Captain went to DFW CR2.

Who knows why they're doing this, but I'm sure we'll be the last to find out. Fortunately, all the ATL CR7 Captains can hold either AT7 or CR2 Captain in ATL. Unfortunately, it could mean that some of the junior AT7 or CR2 Captains in ATL could be bumped out. We'll just have to wait and see. You've gotta love the VISION!

 

[~~~^~~~]

What is the best way to commute to DFW?