Corporate vs. Commercial

[boeingaaa]

Hello,
I've been reading this message board for quite a while. So far, it's been very helpful in my flight training (although I'm only a private pilot). Anyway, I was trying to access my options for the future, and as always with anything anything aviation related, they're needlessly complicated. The basic question of this post is:

What is the difference between Corporate and Commercial flying? I realize that commercial is flying airliners like United etc, and corporate is usually companies or charted planes, but that's where my knowledge stops. I'm looking in terms of life style, pay, travel, security/stability, and anything else you know.


Sincerely,
Hopelessly confused - Alex

 

[Skyline]

Difference

In corporate you fly anything form a Cessna 182 to a Boeing 757. You are on the leash 24/7 in most cases. The pay ranges from 350K down to 18K and you have to put time in the factory. Most corporate jobs pay poorly and have bad working conditions. Your job can disappear overnight.

The airlines (commercial) gives you a schedule 30 days in advance. The pay ranges from 18K to 250 or so. You will be gone from home more than 50% of the time. Most airline jobs are below 35K. The industry is currently in decline. The best jobs are going away.


If I were you I would stop at the private. Enjoy life, get a good job. Stay away from aviation.

Skyline

 

[Melon]

Skyline has no idea what he is talking about. Yes, there are corporate jobs out there that are like he described, but there are also some really good ones. The thing about corporate (part 91 flight departments, 135 charter is a whole different animal) is no two jobs are the same. Generally most 121 airline jobs are all the same, the differences mainly being pay and equipment flown. 91 jobs, in a good, professionally run department, are the best jobs in aviation. I have been on both sides and for me corporate is hands down a better lifestyle. I also feel it is a much more secure job than the airlines if the aircraft is a tool and not a toy. I know several older guys who have never been out of work as a corporatre pilot, but I can not say the same for their airline counterparts.

 

[Skyline]

Skyline has no idea what he is talking about. Yes, there are corporate jobs out there that are like he described, but there are also some really good ones. The thing about corporate (part 91 flight departments, 135 charter is a whole different animal) is no two jobs are the same. Generally most 121 airline jobs are all the same, the differences mainly being pay and equipment flown. 91 jobs, in a good, professionally run department, are the best jobs in aviation. I have been on both sides and for me corporate is hands down a better lifestyle. I also feel it is a much more secure job than the airlines if the aircraft is a tool and not a toy. I know several older guys who have never been out of work as a corporatre pilot, but I can not say the same for their airline counterparts.

Dear Melon,

I had several disclaimers in there. I did acknowledge that there are some good corporate jobs, but lets not forget that most of them are bad. I have worked for a few corporate and 135 gigs and they were the worst jobs I ever had. The last one offered me 32,500/year and I had to work in the apple packing shed during harvest. If you send this kid out there with a false sense of the industry then you are not doing anyone any favors. He could also win the powerball for 300 million, but it is not likely.

Skyline

 

[banned username 2]

Skyline has no idea what he is talking about. Yes, there are corporate jobs out there that are like he described, but there are also some really good ones. The thing about corporate (part 91 flight departments, 135 charter is a whole different animal) is no two jobs are the same. Generally most 121 airline jobs are all the same, the differences mainly being pay and equipment flown. 91 jobs, in a good, professionally run department, are the best jobs in aviation. I have been on both sides and for me corporate is hands down a better lifestyle. I also feel it is a much more secure job than the airlines if the aircraft is a tool and not a toy. I know several older guys who have never been out of work as a corporatre pilot, but I can not say the same for their airline counterparts.

I have to agree with this... SKyline is pretty much clueless when talking about "Corporate Aviation"... The jobs he sounds like he is describing are most likely a crappy Charter job or flying for a personal owner... If you would for a Large Corporation, typically you will find Corporate Aviation to be a rewarding job...

 

[GoingHot]

and I had to work in the apple packing shed during harvest.
Skyline

This business is starting to SUCK!

 

[F16fixer]

yep,
So the next to do there boeinng, is finish up your multi commercial and start applying to Nike, Microsoft or maybe 3M. I've heard they are all pretty good to work for.
I think what skyline ment was that 90% of the corporate jobs that this kid would even have a chance at would suck. Go work for an airline for ten years build up that turbine PIC and then go find a good corp. job.

Corporate jobs are like people. No two are the same. Some are like Cindy Crawford and some are like Roseanne Bar.

I have to agree with this... SKyline is pretty much clueless when talking about "Corporate Aviation"... The jobs he sounds like he is describing are most likely a crappy Charter job or flying for a personal owner... If you would for a Large Corporation, typically you will find Corporate Aviation to be a rewarding job...

 

[Skyline]

You Guys

Man, he might as well apply to NASA as an astronaut as well. Just last night I had a conversation with a guy who works for Paul Allen and he said that someone had to die before there was an opening and even then they have a pile of resumes from real astronauts and pilots who flew air force one. Perhaps you guys are living in denial? Sure those are great jobs out there but the reality of corporate is closer to what I have described. Those jobs are one in a million and don't come by too often.

Skyline

 

[banned username 2]

Go work for an airline for ten years build up that turbine PIC and then go find a good corp. job.

Your best bet if you want to find a good Corporate job is to fly Charter... You will be flying in a similar environment, flying similar equipment and will have the opportunity to network with Corporate pilots... The airlines don't offer any of these important factors... Getting into Corporate is FAR more than just having a bunch of hours...

 

[Spooky 1]

BS Factor

Man, he might as well apply to NASA as an astronaut as well. Just last night I had a conversation with a guy who works for Paul Allen and he said that someone had to die before there was an opening and even then they have a pile of resumes from real astronauts and pilots who flew air force one. Perhaps you guys are living in denial? Sure those are great jobs out there but the reality of corporate is closer to what I have described. Those jobs are one in a million and don't come by too often.

Skyline

Skyline,

I just happen to know a little about the Paul Allen operation, better known as Vulcan Flight Management. They have no astronaut resumes, no Air Force One pilot resumes, just regular guys with good solid backgrounds from all spectrums of aviation. They have hired at least eight corporate pilots, plus another ten helicopter pilots in the last five years, so your "guy who works for Paul Allen" is seriously deficient in his knowledge of this flight department, or recognizes you as someone who need not apply and was just giving you the brush off. As a matter of fact they have two new corporate pilots starting next week, both just plain old civilian borne and bred pilots.

 

[banned username 2]

Perhaps you guys are living in denial? Sure those are great jobs out there but the reality of corporate is closer to what I have described. Those jobs are one in a million and don't come by too often.

I was hired off a resume into a Fortune 100 flight department... I didn't know anyone on the inside and I had "modest" qualifications (no Shuttle landings, no military time, no Air Force One time...)... I had about 4,500 TT, 3 jet type ratings (none of which were for the equipment I was being hired into) and a Charter background... Nearly nine years later I find myself still here, basically smack dab in the middle of the "seniority" list (for what that matters)... One in a million job??? Hardly... Good jobs are out there, you just have to have the right drive, attitude and insight...

Skyline, the job you described sounds like a "Private Owner" job, or a Corporate job that the owner was the only one who ever used the airplane, his toy, type job (You know the kind, where the company owns the airplane but it is really for use only by the President)... Those types of jobs typically blow because you are at his beck and call for all sorts of personal whims...

 

[boeingaaa]

Thanks,
it looks like there are some pretty good jobs available out there, just have to find them. From what I gather, regionals are the stepping stones to Commercial, and flight instructor, charter, networking!! are the stepping stones for Corporate.

Or....I could just become Mr. Discount Airilne Pilot Guy. (<-- click on link)

 

[Skyline]

Well Good for you Guys

Let's bag on poor Skyline. He is full of BS. The world is your oyster. All you have to do is to go out there and get it. Good for you guys. I don't think it is that easy or else we all would be there by now. In case you haven't noticed everyone who has two brain cells to rub together is pining for either big time cargo or the magical corporate job. They just don't exist at a very high percentage. Most are the crappy jobs like I described. In addition even big and well established corporate departments can quickly go away. Right now they are all the rage but that could easily change with a few short years. I am sure that even now with the high price of fuel some of your jobs are in jeopardy and you don't even know it yet.

Skyline

 

[banned username 2]

Thanks,
it looks like there are some pretty good jobs available out there, just have to find them. From what I gather, regionals are the stepping stones to Commercial, and flight instructor, charter, networking!! are the stepping stones for Corporate.

You are 100% correct...

 

[banned username 2]

Let's bag on poor Skyline. He is full of BS. The world is your oyster. All you have to do is to go out there and get it. Good for you guys. I don't think it is that easy or else we all would be there by now. In case you haven't noticed everyone who has two brain cells to rub together is pining for either big time cargo or the magical corporate job. They just don't exist at a very high percentage. Most are the crappy jobs like I described. In addition even big and well established corporate departments can quickly go away. Right now they are all the rage but that could easily change with a few short years. I am sure that even now with the high price of fuel some of your jobs are in jeopardy and you don't even know it yet.

Skyline

It is because you made some rediculous, "absolute" comments that do NOT apply to "nearly all". "pretty much all" or "all but the one in a million jobs"... The statements you made and tried to pass off as absolute fact are ONLY accurate for the very small percentage of the jobs that you held... From the list of your "Corporate Type" aircraft experience, you were working for very small companies (Most of the Fortune 500 don't operate Lear 35's) So trying to give "absolute" statements on such a broad industry is rediculous, inaccurate and unfair to the poster asking questions...

And as far as fuel prices go, remember we aren't making money (directly) with our aircraft... No matter what we are a cost center (directly). If our budget goes up, it isn't a huge deal, we aren't trying to sell seats at a profit... Once again, you are showing your lack of knowledge of true Corporate Aviation... Yeah, I realize the apple farmer might not be able to absorb $5.00/gal Jet-A very long, but most $30 Billion corporations can do it just fine...

 

[Skyline]

Hey, go back and re-read my posts. There was nothing in there that suggested an absolute. The definition of corporate flying is broad in scope. The majority of corporate jobs are as I described. You are tainting the truth by making is appear that your job is common and easy to get. It might seem that way to you but I think it is irresponsible for people in your position to spread false information to young pilots. Things worked out great for you and I am happy but for every cushy corporate job there are a large amounts of pilots out there trying to get in. It is highly competitive and a difficult area to break into.

Skyline

 

[400A]

Man, he might as well apply to NASA as an astronaut as well. Just last night I had a conversation with a guy who works for Paul Allen and he said that someone had to die before there was an opening and even then they have a pile of resumes from real astronauts and pilots who flew air force one. Perhaps you guys are living in denial? Sure those are great jobs out there but the reality of corporate is closer to what I have described. Those jobs are one in a million and don't come by too often.

Skyline

Yeah, kind of like an airline that is not currently in bankrupcy, laying off pilots, and asking for 50% pay cuts.... That definately sounds better than corp. to me. Also dont forget the promised pensions that get taken away.

 

[banned username 2]

The majority of corporate jobs are as I described.

How can you say this? Have you held a "majority" of the jobs? We aren't talking "personal Owners" type jobs, we are talking Corporate jobs... Look at it this way, out of the Fortune 500, there are about 450 companies with aircraft... This accounts for approximately 1,800 corporate aircraft, and nearly 8,500 pilot jobs... That is more pilots than UAL or Delta has... That is JUST the Fortune 500...

These jobs are certainly not "un-attainable" or "one in a million"...

 

[Spooky 1]

Let's bag on poor Skyline. He is full of BS. The world is your oyster. All you have to do is to go out there and get it. Good for you guys. I don't think it is that easy or else we all would be there by now. In case you haven't noticed everyone who has two brain cells to rub together is pining for either big time cargo or the magical corporate job. They just don't exist at a very high percentage. Most are the crappy jobs like I described. In addition even big and well established corporate departments can quickly go away. Right now they are all the rage but that could easily change with a few short years. I am sure that even now with the high price of fuel some of your jobs are in jeopardy and you don't even know it yet.

Skyline

It's not my intention to bag on poor Skyline, but your comments regarding the VFM flight department were so far off the wall, it just could not go unchallenged. Simply false statements from beginning to end. Suggest that you try and remove yourself from this false sense of woe is me, and get with the rest of the guys/gals out there who are looking at real world corporate issues and the employment opportunites that come with them.

 

[Snakum]

The last one offered me 32,500/year and I had to work in the apple packing shed during harvest.

Just be thankful they weren't in the fudge business.

Minh

 

[BenderGonzales]

Fortune 100

I printed this list on another thread in "corporate". Hope you don't mind, but I think its appropriate to copy here.

I've done both airline and corporate and I prefer corporate.

So here's a list of the top Fortune 100 (from 2003) to get you started. Revenue is in billions of dollars:

1. Wal-Mart Stores Inc., Bentonville, Ark., 1, $258.681
2. Exxon Mobil Corp., Irving, Texas, 3, $213.199
3. General Motors Corp., Detroit, 2, $195.645
4. Ford Motor Co., Dearborn, Mich., 4, $164.496
5. General Electric Co., Fairfield, Conn., 5, $134.187
6. ChevronTexaco Corp., San Ramon, Calif., 7, $112.937
7. ConocoPhillips, Houston, 12, $99.468
8. Citigroup Inc., New York, 6, $94.713
9. International Business Machines Corp., Armonk, N.Y., 8, $89.131
10. American International Group, Inc., New York, 9, $81.300
11. Hewlett-Packard Co., Palo Alto, Calif., 14, $73.061
12. Verizon Communications Inc., New York, 10, $67.752
13. The Home Depot Inc., Atlanta, 13, $64.816
14. Berkshire Hathaway Inc., Omaha, 28, $63.859
15. Altria Group Inc., New York, 11, $60.704
16. McKesson Corp., San Francisco, 20, $57.129
17. Cardinal Health Inc., Dublin, Ohio, 19, $56.830
18. State Farm Insurance Cos., Bloomington, Ill., 21, $56.065
19. The Kroger Co., Cincinnati, 18, $53.791
20. Fannie Mae, Washington, D.C., 16, $53.767
21. The Boeing Co., Chicago, 15, $50.485
22. AmerisourceBergen Corp., Chesterbrook, Pa., 24, $49.657
23. Target Corp., Minneapolis, 25, $48.163
24. Bank of America Corp., Charlotte, N.C., 23, $48.065
25. Pfizer Inc., New York, 37, $45.950
26. J.P. Morgan Chase & Co., New York, 26, $44.363
27. Time Warner Inc., New York, 29, $43.877
28. The Procter & Gamble Co., Cincinnati, 31, $43.377
29. Costco Wholesale Corp., Issaquah, Wash., 33, $42.546
30. Johnson & Johnson, New Brunswick, N.J., 34, $41.862
31. Dell Inc., Round Rock, Texas, 36, $41.444
32. Sears Roebuck and Co., Hoffman Estates, Ill., 30, $41.124
33. SBC Communications Inc., San Antonio, 27, $40.843
34. Valero Energy Corp, San Antonio, 55, $37.969
35. Marathon Oil Corp., Houston, 52, $37.137
36. MetLife Inc., New York, 38, $36.261
37. Safeway Inc., Pleasanton, Calif., 41, $35.553
38. Albertson's Inc., Boise, 35, $35.436
39. Morgan Stanley, New York, 40, $34.933
40. AT&T, Bedminster, N.J., 22, $34.529
41. Medco Health Solutions, Franklin Lakes, N.J., new to list, $34.265
42. United Parcel Service Inc., Atlanta, 43, $33.485
43. J.C. Penney Co. Inc., Plano, Texas, 42, $32.923
44. The Dow Chemical Co., Midland, Mich., 51, $32.632
45. Walgreen Co., Deerfield, Ill., 45, $32.505
46. Microsoft Corp., Redmond, Wash., 47, $32.187
47. The Allstate Corp., Northbrook, Ill., 44, $32.149
48. Lockheed Martin Corp., Bethesda, Md., 56, $31.844
49. Wells Fargo & Co., San Francisco, 46, $31.800
50. Lowe's Cos. Inc., Mooresville, N.C., 60, $31.263
51. United Technologies Corp., Hartford, Conn., 49, $31.034
52. Archer-Daniels-Midland Co., Decatur, Ill., 71, $30.708
53. Intel Corp., Santa Clara, Calif., 58, $30.141
54. UnitedHealth Group Inc., Minnetonka, Minn., 63, $28.823
55. Northrop Grumman Corp., Los Angeles, 99, $28.686
56. Delphi Corp., Troy, Mich., 53, $28.096
57. Prudential Financial Inc., Newark, N.J., 57, $27.907
58. Merrill Lynch & Co. Inc., New York, 48, $27.745
59. E.I. du Pont de Nemours, Wilmington, Del., 67, $27.730
60. The Walt Disney Co., Burbank, Calif., 61, $27.061
61. Motorola Inc., Schaumburg, Ill., 59, $27.058
62. PepsiCo Inc., Purchase, N.Y., 62, $26.971
63. CVS Corp., Woonsocket, R.I., 68, $26.588
64. Viacom Inc., New York, 66, $26.585
65. Sprint Corp., Overland Park, Kan., 54, $26.202
66. Sysco Corp., Houston, 73, $26.140
67. Kmart Holding Corp., Troy, Mich., 39, $26.032
68. TIAA-CREF, New York, 89, $26.016
69. American Express Co., New York, 69, $25.866
70. New York Life Insurance Co., New York, 65, $25.700
71. International Paper Co., Stamford, Conn., 64, $25.200
72. Tyson Foods Inc., Springdale, Ark., 72, $24.549
73. Wachovia Corp., Charlotte, N.C., 70, $24.474
74. Goldman Sachs Group Inc., New York, 75, $23.623
75. Duke Energy, Charlotte, N.C., 118, $23.483
76. Honeywell International Inc., Morristown, N.J., 78, $23.103
77. Caterpillar Inc., Peoria, Ill., 85, $22.763
78. Best Buy Co. Inc., Richfield, Minn., 91, $22.673
79. Johnson Controls Inc., Milwaukee, 86, $22.646
80. BellSouth Corp., Atlanta, 77, $22.635
81. Ingram Micro Inc., Santa Ana, Calif., 76, $22.613
82. FedEx Corp., Memphis, 83, $22.487
83. Merck & Co. Inc., Whitehouse Station, N.J., 17, $22.486
84. ConAgra Foods Inc. Omaha, 50, $22.053
85. HCA Inc, Nashville, 90, $21.808
86. Alcoa Inc., Pittsburgh, 82, $21.728
87. Electronic Data Systems, Plano, Texas, 80, $21.596
88. Bank One Corp., Chicago, 79, $21.454
89. Comcast Corp., Philadelphia, 157, $21.263
90. Massachusetts Mutual Life Insurance Co., Springfield, Mass., 84, $21.076
91. The Coca-Cola Co., Atlanta, 92, $21.044
92. Bristol-Myers Squibb Co., New York, 98, $20.671
93. WellPoint Health Networks Inc., Thousand Oaks, Calif., 103, $20.360
94. Georgia-Pacific Corp., Atlanta, 74, $20.255
95. Weyerhaeuser Co., Federal Way, Wash., 96, $19.873
96. Abbott Laboratories, Abbott Park, Ill., 100, $19.681
97. AutoNation Inc., Fort Lauderdale, 93, $19.381
98. The Williams Cos. Inc., Tulsa, 196, $19.246
99. Supervalu Inc., Eden Prairie, Minn., 81, $19.160
100. Cisco Systems Inc., San Jose, Calif., 95, $18.878

 

[Skyline]

Corporate Flying

The definition of corporate flying is to operate a private plane for personal or corporate interests. The department of labor and industries keeps track of corporate pilot incomes and the last time it was shown to me by my employment counselor a few years ago it was listed at 30K/year. That number includes every Cessna 206 that is used by a guide service and piper seneca that is flown by a construction company. The little outfits outnumber the good jobs by a long shot.


I think it is wrong for people in your position to spread information to young pilots that is false. There are few good corporate jobs out there and they are very hard to get. I have flown for three corporate type outfits and they were the worst days of my life. A small company is fast to abuse its employees. They don't care about the FAA regulations or about you. The only way out is to quit. Even bigger companies can have similar attitudes. The airlines are having some hard times but the odds of getting hired and not killed are higher. There has to be 50 times the amount of employment opportunities in the airlines. (I don't advise the airlines either)
To extend the illusion that it is common and easy is wrong. Right now there are over 250,000 Commercial and ATP pilots in the US with current medicals. I think there are another unaccounted for 400,000 to 600,000 pilots who dropped their medicals and had to give up. By my accounting there are less than 48,000 good jobs at the airlines (and that number drops by the hour) and probably less than 10,000 good corporate jobs.
You are lucky and I am glad for you, however I think your view of the industry has been tainted a little. These young kids are eager and fueled by what you say. I just think it is irresponsible.

Skyline

 

[banned username 2]

I think your view of the industry has been tainted a little. These young kids are eager and fueled by what you say. I just think it is irresponsible.

I think your view of the "indusrty" is a little tainted... You've worked (admittedly) a couple crappy (what you call "Corporate") jobs and now you think pretty much all Corporate jobs must be like that except the "one in a million" job out there... Again, go work for one of the Fortune 500 flight departments and most likely things will be much better than they were at your Lear job... And the Department of Labor doesn't have a "Corporate Pilot" catagory... I believe they class it as "Non-Commercial" aviation.... We aren't the Department of Labor here... When people on THIS board refer to "Corporate Aviation", they are referring to flying for a Company who primarily uses the aircraft for company purposes... Not flying for Joe Blow chasing his yacht around the Med... If the "Corporate World" is sooo full of crappy jobs, why are there many threads on here about airline guys (RJ Captains and such) asking about getting into Corporate and getting out of the airlines? There are even quite a few Major airline guys from the legacy carries who got furloughed and are now flying corporate... Most of them don't intend on going back if recalled...

 

[Lead Sled]

I think your view of the "industry" is a little tainted... You've worked (admittedly) a couple crappy (what you call "Corporate") jobs and now you think pretty much all Corporate jobs must be like that except the "one in a million" job out there... Again, go work for one of the Fortune 500 flight departments and most likely things will be much better than they were at your Lear job... And the Department of Labor doesn't have a "Corporate Pilot" catagory... I believe they class it as "Non-Commercial" aviation.... We aren't the Department of Labor here... When people on THIS board refer to "Corporate Aviation", they are referring to flying for a Company who primarily uses the aircraft for company purposes... Not flying for Joe Blow chasing his yacht around the Med... If the "Corporate World" is sooo full of crappy jobs, why are there many threads on here about airline guys (RJ Captains and such) asking about getting into Corporate and getting out of the airlines? There are even quite a few Major airline guys from the legacy carries who got furloughed and are now flying corporate... Most of them don't intend on going back if recalled...

Well said Captain.

Finding a "GOOD" Part 91 corporate job (Notice I didn't mention 135.) isn't particularly difficult IF you are qualified. By qualified, I mean that you not only have the ratings but also the experience AND - just as important for corporate jobs - the personality and temperament to go along with it.

I have a hard time understanding guys like skyline, for some the cup is always half empty. The guys that I know that share his attitude usually have other issues that keep them from assimilating into the corporate culture.

'Sled

 

[Spooky 1]

I think your view of the "indusrty" is a little tainted... You've worked (admittedly) a couple crappy (what you call "Corporate") jobs and now you think pretty much all Corporate jobs must be like that except the "one in a million" job out there... Again, go work for one of the Fortune 500 flight departments and most likely things will be much better than they were at your Lear job... And the Department of Labor doesn't have a "Corporate Pilot" catagory... I believe they class it as "Non-Commercial" aviation.... We aren't the Department of Labor here... When people on THIS board refer to "Corporate Aviation", they are referring to flying for a Company who primarily uses the aircraft for company purposes... Not flying for Joe Blow chasing his yacht around the Med... If the "Corporate World" is sooo full of crappy jobs, why are there many threads on here about airline guys (RJ Captains and such) asking about getting into Corporate and getting out of the airlines? There are even quite a few Major airline guys from the legacy carries who got furloughed and are now flying corporate... Most of them don't intend on going back if recalled...

You talkin about me, eh? Yacht chasing can be lots of fun and it's my experience that if you are using the aircraft for fun, as opposed to pure business one is not looking at the bottom line or stock price
and wondering what comes next.

Poor Skyline just keeps spouting all the obsticles that eveyone has faced somewhere in the career chase. Sure some never get that perfect job, including me, but the ride has been pretty good for the most part.

 

[Skyline]

What ever

Guys,


What ever. Lets call all fancy jet jobs as corporate. I know that some are leaving the airlines for corporate but just a few years ago it was quite different and my guess is that many will go back once it looks like things are getting better. It is all the rage right now in the airlines to see the grass as greener but few are walking away from even marginal jobs to pursue corporate interests. They all like to talk about it though. The others are furloughed and flow back to their last job before the airlines. Once things pick up I am sure they will change their tune. Just last week I spoke to a buddy who has one of the best "corporate" jobs in the state who is planning to leave for SWA. It goes both ways.

"I have a hard time understanding guys like skyline, for some the cup is always half empty. The guys that I know that share his attitude usually have other issues that keep them from assimilating into the corporate culture."

'Sled


I don't have the temperament for corporate. I couldn't sit there and be abused by a spoiled fat executive and be happy about it. I like having some control over my life and having a schedule. The other pilots who could take a punch to the gut and smile about it reminded me of beaten wife syndrome. So, I don't have the personality to do it for long. I don't think that most of these airline defectors will last long either.


Skyline

 

[banned username 2]

I don't have the temperament for corporate. I couldn't sit there and be abused by a spoiled fat executive and be happy about it. I like having some control over my life and having a schedule. The other pilots who could take a punch to the gut and smile about it reminded me of beaten wife syndrome.

ROFLMAO!!! What are you talking about?

Here is an example of what my job is like:

- Average 12 days a month of work (all other days are at HOME)
- Know schedule for next month on 15th of month prior
- Average 5 RON's (Remain Overnights) per month, the other 25-26 nights are in my own bed.
- On first name basis with all the execs (including the CEO)
- Dockers and Polos for uniform (no tie, no hat, no epaulets)
- Paid whether I fly or not (Salary), NBAA average
- Full benefits, including pension, bonus, stock, etc.
- Passengers help themselves when onboard, pilots fly the plane
- Five and a half weeks paid vacation per year
- Basically never fly on holidays, mostly weekday flying.

I know a lot of guys who have very similar or even better jobs... They aren't that rare...

 

[AA717driver]

Astronauts? AF1 pilots? There goes Spooky again, debunking good aviation rumors... The mods ought to ban him for 'rumor-ruining'. Besides, all the former Space Shuttle guys are working at SWA.

Am I missing something? I always thought when you started out in aviation you'd have to take some crappy jobs to gain experience? My first "corporate" job paid $125.00 a week in an F33 Bonanza. I moved up to that coveted commuter job for $800.00/mo.

ATTENTION NEW PILOTS! You will not be able to get a job at JetBlue, SWA or any decent (not to mention top notch) 91 job with 1,000 or 3,000 or probably even 5,000 hours. It takes time. Yes, there are those who have gotten lucky and gotten a good job with low time. But don't count on it.

Bide your time and work hard and you may still get hosed. (Probably not but nothing is guaranteed in this business.)TC

 

[RichardRambone]

Good lord I hope I can land one some day. Im low on the totem pole and yes I take a lot of whats said seriously on here but also with a grain of salt. Everyones perspective is different but from what I can gather corporate is the way to go. But at this point its really whose willing to take me and pay me a livable wage. I guess its time to start kissing more a$$.

 

[Spooky 1]

Myth Debunking

It's pretty easy with some of these whoppers that show up from Skyline and a few others on this board. Instead of being inspired by others sucess, Skyline chooses to reject to possibility of sucess and waffle in reject line. Maybe there is more to this than meets the eye?