Comair stopped Hiring?Asking for Leaves

[Col.Hogan]

?'s

You guys gotta' help out the slow people like myself If Comair is furloughing folks for a short time and stopping classes, then why are they still interviewing ( I interview in a few weeks). Also, how long does it take to get a class date NOW after an interview. HOG

 

[General Lee]

Col Hogan,

I think we have figured out that Comair is not actually furloughing anyone, rather they are offering short temporary leaves (like a month or two) when their orders for RJ's slow down this summer(?). It sounds like it has happened to them in the past. They probably are still hiring. If you do interview with them, make sure you ask around to the other interviewees and see if there are any furloughed Delta pilots interviewing. Then ask why or why not? They will probably blame the Delta MEC. Good luck.

Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[CRJFlyer]

Heard from a source who just got back from Montreal that the reason for the Leave of Absence is simply a training burp..Apparently the 70 is such a good investment that we are getting more deliveries of them at a faster rate, and in turn are taking less 50 seat deliveries. This leaves us with more 50 seat people than we originally needed. We have basically hired too many 50 seat people because we thought we'd be getting more 50's. Instead we're gonna get more 70's..

Also heard that up in Montreal there are "certain" pictures of 90 seaters...with a certain tail number already painted on them..? anybody have any idea?

 

[flaps30]

Well know more when...

... Delta begins talks with pilots on pay cuts. You can bet the 70-seat limit, 90 seat and other scope will be on the table. The additional 70-seaters coming to Comair is just a reponse to ASA being in contract talks. 57 is the current limit, but I bet that goes away when the cuts start. As for mainline flying them, good luck.

 

[FlyDeltasJets]

Flaps,

Why in the world would we give pay cuts AND relief on scope? In fact, I sincerely hope that my MEC is of the belief that concessions should buy us something. More airplanes (regardless of the size) are just part of the package we should get in return for any sacrifice we make.

CRJ,

If there is in fact a picture of a 90-seater in Delta colors, than I am looking forward to flying it. Of course you know that any airplane over 70 seats must be flown by Delta pilots, according to our contract. I hope that you are not in favor of "taking our airplanes?" If so, than why stop at 90 seats? Should we allow DCI our 737's? Why stop there? How about our 777s?

 

[flaps30]

ok

No, I have no idea who will fly what and when. All I was saying is that when you open yourselves up to pay cuts, ect. scope will again come up. I think both scope and pay will change. You may not.
Who flys what is just as important to the bottom line as pay cuts are. In the current environment mainline will have to give something, now what do you think the top 50% would rather give up ? Their pay or more 70-seaters ? I'd say it will be some combination of relaxing scope somewhat and modest pay cuts. There is talk about not giving an inch, getting the 1060 back, but in private the top 50% want to make sure their pension is still there and they keep salary just where it is. I'm not slamming anyone, just being realistic about what people say and what they actually do.
Also, I just don't see guys taking a pay cut to provide 70-seat jobs for mainline.

 

[miller22]

Reports from YUL are that a 90-seater is painted in Comair colors. Why is that? Nothing more than a marketing effort by bombardier. Comair is still their #1 customer and is the airline that was with bombardier from the very beginning. I've been told (never saw it) that there was a 50-seater painted half-comair and half-cityline back when they were initially marketing that aircraft. So a 90-seater painted in comair colors means nothing other than they're trying to sell it to Comair.

Don't forget, it only takes about 8-square feet of red, white and blue paint to make a comair airplane a skywest, or ASA airplane.

ON THE OTHER HAND...
Bombardier knows full well the scope limit on jets larger than 50 seats, yet they were given some reason to paint it in Comair colors. Somebody with their finger near the "buy" switch at Delta told them something.
But once again, I haven't seen the aircraft and have only talked to six or seven who have. I'm basing my speculations on what others have told me. The aircraft may not even exist.

 

[CRJFlyer]

FlyDeltaJets,
I was only repeating what someone who just got back from 70 training up in Monteal. I haven't even bid for the 70, the only way it benefits me in any way would be to have more senior guys get outta the way so I an get a slightly better line possibly in the 50.

Of course if we just got more 50's then that would help "my" cause better. Personally I'd rather keep getting more 50's which would mean more F/O's below me and a quicker upgrade, with lesser harm to mainline(Than with the 70/90).

Finding a happy medium between us and mainline would be a lot better than either totally pissing off mainline pilots or completing giving up on growth.

 

[79%N1]

777's at DCI........

ALLRIGHT!!! COOL!!! I can't wait! One question, will I get paid more than $19.02/hr to fly one of those?

 

[FlyDeltasJets]

Yeah, but your training will cost you more than 10 grand.

 

[maddog805]

^--NICE!!!!!!!!!--^

 

[skydiverdriver]

It seems to me that all the animosity is coming from the Delta side of the equation. I havn't heard any DCI pilots say that they are angry at Delta pilots, but I sure have heard it the other way around. Seems funny to me that after all the things they did to us, this one little meeting makes them mad, but we are not. We are taking the high road on this deal, again.

And I say it one more time, at least we spoke to them, as they usually refuse to discuss anything with us when we want to talk.

 

[NYRANGERS]

It seems to me that all the animosity is coming from the Delta side of the equation

Where have you been? Is your head that far up????????

YAASMFDSWIWLTK.SFYMFADRN




RANGERS 4 BRUINS 1

 

[cmrflyer]

edited because the general can't take it

 

[skiddriver]

Well, on that note I'm checking out of this thread with a couple of comments, which are all way off topic but have been touched on numerous times in this thread.

- I still disagree with the final decision of our MEC. Not because I want to get hired at Delta, not because I would like to improve relations with the Delta pilot group, and not because I have some old squadron-mates on furlough from mother D (though the last two are true); I asked Capt Lawson, in person and in writing, to reconsider the decision because I think we have a personal responsibility (all of us sentient beings- not just Comair pilots) to try and help out folks who need some help. I also specifically requested that the policy be changed for all furloughees, not just folks from Delta. I personally don't think that a person should expect to get something in return for a good deed, but then again, my wife says I never got over being a Boy Scout.

- There are plenty of folks around here at Comair who hold a grudge against the Delta pilot group; most of them just don't come post on this board. I would hate to think that our MEC's decision on the furloughees had anything to do with that. He told me face-to-face that it didn't, and that the issue was still open to discussion. The sticking point being that the Delta MEC would have to come back to the table, which I think we all realize isn't going to happen.

- The animosity between the two pilot groups has cause from both sides. Being human however (I think) many of us on both sides can more easily see the mote for the beam (Mat 7:3-5). It's a lot easier to point fingers and say nasty things that to reflect on our own wrongdoings and failings, and developing a snotty aura of self-righteousness doesn't help either. And it is also always easier for leaders to focus group anger on a scapegoat than to address difficult issues directly and rationally.

- The posters on this board are a small, self-selected sample of the two pilot groups, but I unfortunately think that the animosities are more widespread. I say unfortunate because I think that we'd all prosper from more cooperation and fewer personal attacks.

- Finally, this isn't an appeal for all of us to just "get along," but for goodness sakes, can't you guys find some other way to debate your (our) differences than to resort to personal attacks and insults? I know this is a (relatively) anonymous forum, but that doesn't mean that we need to discard the Queensbury rules.

I can't promise that I won't check this thread out again (it has a certain car wreck quality that makes it entertaining on a less mature level), but I think I've finished trying to discuss these issues here. Too much shouting, not enough listening.

 

[Heavy Set]

CMRFlyer,

Nice attitude. I just spoke with some friends from Delta about their contract. With furloughed pilots, Delta pilots CANNOT pick up overtime above 75 hours... So, anyone who is picking up "open time" it is because they have dropped trips and are now looking to pick up compensatory time. Get it? Quit yelling at General Lee - he is one of the few people on this forum who actually makes sense and he understands the contract - you don't.

So, to reiterate, he can't pick up "extra" open time if there are furloughees on the street...

You sound very bitter - you need to work on that.

 

[skydiverdriver]

And General Lee doesn't sound bitter? Ha!!!!

 

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

Actually, they can pick it up. Most pilots would rather that not happen, but it is.
I have a Delta Captain next door to me. He tells me stories about all the Delta pilots picking up open time all the time. He is pretty pissed about it.

 

[JI Gone OH]

"If there is in fact a picture of a 90-seater in Delta colors, than I am looking forward to flying it. Of course you know that any airplane over 70 seats must be flown by Delta pilots, according to our contract."


Not that I want to get in the mix, I rarely post anything on these boards, but just wanted to comment on the statement above. Being a furloughed Midway Pilot, I can attest to the fact that contracts mean nothing when a company files for Chapter 11. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!!! All of the JI boys and girls know what I am talking about. If and when Delta files for Chapter 11, you'll see what I am talking about. Take the contract and light fire under your a**, get out there and find another job, because that's all it's good for. If anyone needs more paper, let me know (I got an extra Midway Contract laying around somewhere).

Take Care, Fly Safe, and Stop the Bickering. Working Against One Another Moves Us In The Same Direction As A C-152 Demostrating Slow Flight In An 80 Knot Headwind. BACKWARDS!!

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Bankruptcy

The days of the Frank Lorenzo bankruptcy have passed and, in fact, bankruptcy law has changed.

Notwithstanding what happened at Midway there are a few hard and fast rules regarding bankruptcy.

Myth: The judge can throw-away/rewrite/etc. the contract.

A bankruptcy judge can not simply abrogate a contract on a whim at the request of the company.

The company may be able to change sections of the contract with force majeur provisions in them if they claim that the financial problems are a result of acts of war, labor dispute, limits by suppliers etc. But those would be the ONLY sections which could be abrogated without going through the process.

What will really happen?

The company will go to the bankrupcy judge and say "Hey, Your honor...we can't afford to pay for (insert contract section here)"

At that time the company and the association are requred to enter into good-faith bargaining to change that section of the contract. Federal mediators will be assigned to help reach an expedient solution. IF the parties are unable to come to an agreement then the association and the company are free to pursue self-help -- JUST like they would during any contract negotiations.

THAT BEING SAID ... The judge's sole responsibility is to find $$$ for the debtors!!!

If a solution can not be achieved, the judge may THEN elect to abrogate sections of the contract.

Example: The US Airways pension issue. As you know, the pension is the pot-of-gold in a major airline contract. ALPA has always been willing to sacrifice virtually anything to protect retirement for its senior members. Carefully watch the US Airways pension issue (the pension is scheduled to be terminated and replaced with a PBBG + comapny plan on March 31) to see how the entire process plays out.

Will Comair fly 90 seat jets? Who knows. There are rumblings that Chautauqua has orders for 70 seat jets to be flown in the DCI system. I believe it is much more likely that Delta will terminate all of its own capital expendatures and let a code-share partner such as Chautauqua and/or Skywest take the financial burden and risk. That, as you can imagine, would be bad for the entire DAL family... Delta, Comair, and ASA.

Hopefully when the industry recovers ALPA will have the wisdom to negotiate "brand-scope" to prevent outsourcing of flying to independant providers such as Chautauqua, Mesa, Trans-States or the other lowest bidders.

Just my opinion.