CMR on the move

[180ToTheMarker]

NO NO NO. Management will never quit this "concessionsforgrowth"non-sense if we don't stand up and tell them no. And beforeyou say it,any pay freeze is a concession. If this gets the okay from the pilots, it will do nothing but continue a nasty trend of "concessions for growth."

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Division in the Ranks -- Hang On!

Thats a good point. IF thats the case you're putting the guys on probotationary pay on a quasi-bscale. Interesting dillema.

There will be the faction at Comair who refuses the deal entirely. (the "just say NO" crowd)

There will be the faction (sr F/Os jr C/Os) who will be pushing for it.

There will be the faction at Comair who wants to protect the probationary newhires from a life on food-stamps.

There will be the faction who believes that "there are only 50 newhires, screw them!"

There will be the faction of CR7 Captains who will be angry that the E170/175 will not pay more.

This is going to potentially be a divisive couple of weeks at Comair. It will be educational to see if the current and future status reps will make the effort to communicate with the group.

If ever there has been a reason to call a special MEC meeting and discuss the decision with the pilot group this is it...

 

[shamrock]

I would hope that it is the contract longevity increase that they are talking about freezing - and not your yearly raise.

Hopefully I'm wrong, but I'd also interpret that to mean the yearly longevity increase, which would effectively be a pay cut.

Things ain't getting any cheaper these days, ya know. Taco Bell just raised the price of a soft taco from $.79 to $.89, and I believe raman noddles went from 6 for $1 to 5 for $1 at the local grocery store. H#ll, I need that longevity pay to keep up the lifestyle to which I've become accustomed!

Hopefully they won't try it again at ASA.

If this does happen and the new guys get stuck at first year pay, I'd hazard a guess that they won't stick around too long. F that.

 

[711-24-7]

In 2003, ASA tried that same crap. They wanted to extend our currentcontract for 2 more years in exchange for "growth airplanes."The onlything mgmt got was our collective middle fingers. Stand strong Comairand say "no"...chances are you'll get the airplanes anyway.

So instead of extending the contract for two years. Their new plan is to just stall the new contrcact for about seven years the way negotiations are going. oh and I also like that golf game comment above really funny. Well lets see whats going to happen to ASA

 

[chperplt]

If this does get voted on and pass, there's going to be a hell of a lot more than 50 people on 1st year pay.

The last class that will be on 2nd year pay (date of 1st delivery is June) will be the March 1, 2004 class. All other classes will be 1st year at time of delivery which is about 60 people right now.. Add to that the new hires required and the number goes up quite a bit.

There's got to be protection for the new hires to get to year 2 pay. Right now, the wording of the memo is a little muddy on that.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Breaking the Union

There is another consideration. This may be a play to break the union.

Fred no doubt sees the union (ALPA) in a weakened state.

#1. The voting for the MEC leadership is at a stalemate. Both sides of the current LEC are deadlocked and unable to agree, much less communicate with one another.

#2. A former candidate for Captain Rep is challenging the legitimacy of the status-rep elections and asking that they be thrown out.

The union leadership (both MEC and LEC) is weakened. The junior pilots do not feel fairly represented and NONE of the pilots feel as though the leadership is communicating with them.

Fred may see an opportunity to break the union by introducing this proposal. There is already an artificial dividing line tearing the group apart.

This proposal, along with the current MEC circus, just might break the camel's back.

 

[DDpaysoff]

How many new-hires would there be that do NOT turn 1 before June 1? Maybe something can be worked out where a tenative yes is given provided all first year Fo's on the property today get their probaionary $15.00/hr increase. Every new Hire not on the property today would come in at first year pay and stay there until the next strike in 2010.

 

[sleeve]

This was just an initial offering posted for all employees to see. It hasn't gone into any great detail. I agree 1st year Fo's need to get atleast 2nd year pay, but that can all be worked out. it just came out today.. relax everyone... as far as FB attacking while the union is in a chaotic state...well when isn't the union in a chaotic state...FB isn't playing god he is putting an offer out there for us to negotiate....and toi me it sounds like a good offering, my pay will stay at 38.33 and 1.75 perdiem until I upgrade or until the end of the freeze.. big deal...

 

[sleeve]

180-

without growth we'll shrink, this isn't a conspiracy to destroy the Comair pilot group, rape our wives and eat our children... You are probably also one of those guys that think someone passed a magnet near a computer to shut the whole SBS system down...

 

[DDpaysoff]

I heard the Comair MEC will respond this afternoon.

 

[Caveman]

Let all the newhires move to 2nd year pay and I'll consider it. Otherwise, not no, but He11 No!

 

[comrcap]

I've been here for 19 years. I'll miss a 5$ bump in june, but that is better than the time and crap of a protracted fight. It ain't worth it. My rate is still ahead of most 70 seat rates (113.12). More a/c means more routes, better sched...blah blah, you know the drill. I don't think the EMB 170 commands more than the CRJ700. Yes, there will be the "hell no" crowd rearing up, but they are in the minority. We do need to protect the new hires (Again!) so they aren't screwwed in the switches. I would say the group most likely to protest are the middle range Captains. They will not get a raise unless the move to the crj700 or EMB 170. But, if they stay, their schedules should get better. Another wild card is where is the next base!? They can't all stay here in CVG..........Smithers! That BOOB Simpson has done it again! Darned if he didn't push the fRED BUTTrellON!

 

[skyslug]

I agree that first year FO's pay and QOL need to be looked at more thoroughly.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

DDPaysoff said, "Every new Hire not on the property today would come in at first year pay and stay there until the next strike in 2010."

I certainly hope this is sarcasm. (I believe that it is) Anyone with any knowledge of airline history is aware of the damage that a B-scale can cause a pilot group.

(see American "Killer B's")
All or none. You can not screw the guys yet to come and then expect unity moving forward.

 

[Sinca3]

My questions are this:
1) If there is this new bid for flying, why is it no one else has mentioned it to their employees? Atleast not here at ASA....wait I can answer that. ASA has one of the worst most incompetent managment team in the industry.
2) If there is a bid for flying who will decide the winner now that FB isn't head of DCI?
Wait I can answer that too, GG. I mean FB was just a pawn in the whole big game. Just like SB is now and RR was.
3) Wasn't FB the one that mentioned there isn't any room in the market for more 50 seaters? I can see wanting the E-170's but he told a bunch of ASA people that Republic would get them and they did. He said it was too expensive to add a new aircraft type to either ASA or Comair! I heard it straight from his mouth!